Linux-Advocacy Digest #17, Volume #27 Sun, 11 Jun 00 02:13:04 EDT
Contents:
Re: Linux faster than Windows? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (Bob Germer)
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (Bob Germer)
Re: Microsoft migrates Hotmail to W2K (Full Name)
Re: booting 3 OS's on one machine win98-win2k-linux. (John & Susie)
Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split Save It? (Leslie Mikesell)
Re: MacOS X: under the hood... (was Re: There is only one innovation that
matters...) ("Patrick")
x86 processor mode and Linux ("Hai Nguyen")
Re: Dealing with filesystem volumes (Full Name)
Re: Linux & Winmodem (John & Susie)
Re: x86 processor mode and Linux ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Haakmat digest, volume 2451707 ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Thorne digest, volume 2451707 ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Mac = Playstation? Unix useless?(was Re: Canada invites Microsoft north) (Loren
Petrich)
Re: vote on MS split-up (Rick)
Re: Canada invites Microsoft north (Marty)
Re: vote on MS split-up (Rick)
Re: democracy? (Rick)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Subject: Re: Linux faster than Windows?
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 04:25:14 GMT
On Sat, 10 Jun 2000 19:54:23 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Now, on Intel, it seems things are much less clear. A while ago,
>someone built the Bytemark benchmarks with some really fancy compiler
>optimizations under NT, using some commercial compiler from either
>Intel or MS (I could look it up if anyone needs more details). I built
>the same code with a recent gcc. It turns out that for some of the
>tests, the gcc code wipes the floor with the commercial compiler's
>code, and for some other tests, it's the other way around. The
>benchmark averages came out pretty much identical --- which just goes
>to show that both compilers can still be improved upon.
Which processor was this on? I compiled most of the industry standard
benchmarks on a dual boot P5 machine about a year ago, and Windows
performed better than Linux in each. Not _much_ better, about 20% as I
recall. But if you are running a long simulation, it makes a big
difference. I can imagine the results would be different for P6, but I
would guess they would be even more pronounced in Window's favor (I
believe Microsoft generates P6 instructions such as CMOV, and it
definitely at least knows about the P6 microarchitecture)
>Anyone around who could compile and run a bit of obfuscated C with commercial
>in order to do some benchmarking?
Obfuscated C would not be interesting as a benchmark. Standard bechmarks
such as whetstone, fft, queens, et al, would be semi-interesting. SPEC
would be interesting but unfortunately are not open source.
I have Windows running on a Pentium III 550, dual Pentium 133, Pentium 90,
and mobile Celeron 400. If anybody wants to "face off" on a CPU benchmark
and has similar hardware, I'll be happy to submit the Windows results for
the benchmark of your choice.
>I have been meaning to ask this --- could you provide a reference for that
>claim? I don't seem to recall it, so I would like to check whether I missed
>it or whether we interpreted something I saw differently. A message ID will
>be enough. Thank you.
I once posted an innocent question on comp.os.linux.advocacy about how to
compile a Linux executable under Windows. Somebody told me (in effect)
"That shows just how little you know about Linux. Linux will compile
programs 10 times faster than Windows". I can't find it as DejaNews seems
to be broken, but do a search for "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" in that newsgroup
in the fall 1998 timeframe and you will find it. It was a howl. How a CPU
bound process such as GCC be affected so much by the OS, I have no idea,
but this is what the poster seriously claimed.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 04:27:38 GMT
On 06/10/2000 at 02:41 PM,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (G. Wayne Hines) said:
> There is an airport at Sydney that has commercial flights. I'm not sure
> that it actually has "international" status. Gander, and possibly St.
> John's, Newfoundland has such status.
> The Yarmouth airport used to have a couple of daily flights to/from
> Boston, and there are some freight runs in and out of there. There used
> to be a customs office right at the airport. I'm not sure if they are
> still there, or if they just show up before a flight.
I believe a pilot has to make reservations with Customs Canada for either
airport. If that be the case, then it is an international airport.
This is also true in the US with many international airports. Many require
advance reservations and a fee of $25 or so for an officer to be there
when you land. Others only have customs available during certain hours and
one must pay a substantial "overtime" fee outside those hours.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice 2.19zf Registration Number 67
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 04:27:36 GMT
On 06/10/2000 at 02:21 PM,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas) said:
> >> >> Tell me once again how useful OS/2 is for business customers.
> >>
> >> > Been to any banks lately?
> >>
> >> You may have had a point about 3 years ago. :)
> > Surely you've been to a bank since then.
> Ive done contract work in banks since then, yes. And as I said, you may
> have had a point three years ago....
> Or with banks that havent upgraded anything in three years. I hear
> theres alot of those left. :)
And then there is Bank One which just added over 10,000 OS/2 seats within
the past year.
--
==============================================================================================
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice 2.19zf Registration Number 67
=============================================================================================
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Full Name)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft migrates Hotmail to W2K
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 04:41:43 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Sat, 03 Jun 2000 17:32:01 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Christopher Browne) wrote:
>
>Obviously the spoils can go to those that have the most money for bribes.
>The question is not really of much importance for any of those that actually
>care about _using_ certified systems, but is rather primarily of importance
>for marketing spindoctors of whatever persuasion.
>
Typical reponse of someone who has been cornered.
You've been proven wrong. Just admit it and stop with the paranoid
nonsense above.
------------------------------
From: John & Susie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: booting 3 OS's on one machine win98-win2k-linux.
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 00:43:00 -0400
Have a look at boot.ini. If that doesn't help, M$'s web site has info on
how it works.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Here's the situation:
> the system is a dual celeron pc/abit bp6 board with a 10gig drive.
> I first created a 5gig partition FAT32 for windows98, loaded it. this
> was c: the primary partition.
> Next I went to install windows2000 using NTFS (win2k creates an extended
> partition, and then fills that partition with a logical NTFS partition,
> d:) using the remaining 5gigs of the drive.
> Then the time came where I needed to install linux because well...
> for many
*** crap snipped ***
I was able to get my hands on
> called FIPS, shrank my primary fat32 partition to 2gigs, leaving 3gigs
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> of free space, the problem is, since FIPS changed the MBR, windows2000
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> freaked out, and didn't know where to find it's root directory, so win98
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> boots up fine, but when I try to load win2k
*** more crap snipped ***
You sir, should should stay well away from any computer that allows you
to monkey with its partitions.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Leslie Mikesell)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: Would a M$ Voluntary Split Save It?
Date: 10 Jun 2000 23:44:03 -0500
In article <lnf05.2677$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Daniel Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> not improve them. Improving them would be to make them even
>> more open and thus more widely useful.
>
>No, improving them would not make them more open. At least,
>not the way MS does it. :D
Their concept of improving it to make it take more money
from the consumers. You just have to decide which side
you are on.
>> The improvement is temporary as the innovations of the
>> defunct competitors disappear.
>
>Now now, MS is hardly shy about borrowing its competitors
>ideas.
That's fine for last year's ideas. But the competitors
are dead now.
>> Dumping, by definition, is to sell below cost of production.
>> Something built by volunteers doesn't have an associated cost.
>
>Sure it does. Those volunteers are spending their time and money
>on it; that they don't draw salaries isn't terribly relevant, unless you
>feel that Open Source is magic and special and just *deserves* to
>be privileged.
>
>Which I don't. I find it awfully uncreative.
If you define creativity as taking as much money as possible
from consumers, you are right - it doesn't do that.
>> There are some nice innovative Windows apps, like Visio, for
>> example. And my kids sometimes need to do PowerPoint presentations
>> for school. But, of course the real need is to match up
>> exactly with those 'de-commoditized' file formats and protocols.
>
>I don't see how WINE is much a solution for that, though.
Why should I have to put up with the annoyances of installing
windows and keeping it working just to be able to be sure
I will be able to read a .doc file? When WINE is complete
it won't be necessary to run windows to run windows apps.
>> People who would like to have a choice need protection.
>
>You've your choice- you can run wahtever softwarae you like. If
>that software isn't good enough for your needs, that is your problem.
It isn't an issue of 'good enough', it is whether it can deal
with data files in formats that change rapidly for no good reason.
>People who want to *make* other people use software they don't
>want to use- just to cover up their interoperability problems-
>need some help.
The people *causing* those problems are the issue.
>> Then there would be one popular abstraction, one popular scalable
>> font type, etc. with multiple implementations.
>
>You are assuming, of course, that a Windows standardized on PostScript
>would succeed- and I doubt it.
A published standard abstraction would have worked as well as
re-inventing the concept.
>Further, you are assuming that if Windows standardizes on PostScript
>everyone else will do likewise. This is *very* unlikely; consider the
>effort Apple had *already* expended on QuickDraw.
Yet Apple has no trouble using Postscript printers. Not the same
with winprinters.
>> If someone built
>> a 'Winprinter' with a postscript engine it wouldn't be 'de-commoditized'
>> to a point where it was impossible to use without buying a specific
>> OS.
>
>A "winprinter with a postscript enginer" is a contradiction in terms.
If Windows used postscript as the printing abstraction, it would
not be. But it wouldn't serve the purpose of making it difficult
to mix Windows with standard equipment either.
>But a winprinter driver writen for a hypothetical windows w/ GhostScript-
>style printer support would probably not be easily portable to Linux.
>Neither, at the end of the day, really does *any* rendering; they just
>driver a printer and spit out a bitmap.
Right - you are better off using a standard abstraction in the
printer itself so it can do its own rendering.
>> A more accurate way to express that is that it is difficult
>> to use windows with anything else.
>And when the Next Generation Amazing Printer Format comes
>along, Windows will be able to support that too.
Only because Microsoft has the clout to ensure that the
necessary driver is written, and their strategy of being
incompatible with any existing standards keeps that driver
from being helpful to anyone else.
>[snip]
>> This is a personal machine that dual-boots. Now it spends most
>> of its time running Linux.
>
>Well, okay. I'm surprised you are not more concerned, if it is
>your personal machine.
The 'toy-for-the-kids' function under windows has been taken
over by a different machine.
>[snip]
>> I have found useful bits of information in the MS knowledge base
>> but it is extremely painful. For example the first time I
>> tried to set up WLBS where a pair of NT boxes shared an IP
>> address for load balancing, it didn't work. The best I could
>> find in the knowledge base went approximately: "if it doesn't
>> work try a different NIC". Turned out to be correct, but there
>> was no list of which ones work or don't work, or why. I got the
>> feeling I was sprinkling chicken blood around at midnight to ward off
>> the daemons.
>
>I wasn't talking about the knowledge base; I find that rather
>hit or miss- a great pile of 'knowlege', but not so much 'base'-
>good mainly for bug reports, in my experience.
>
>I meant MSDN; the knowledge base is but a small fragment
>of that.
This was with a complete search, and several Windows developers
where I work also tried to find a solution. The Knowledge base
was the only mention of the fact that some NIC's just don't
work.
>[snip]
>> >You'll noticed that MS did eventually drop that icon.
>>
>> It's back, if it ever did go away. Unlike the others, it
>> doesn't have any properties. I think I can delete it but
>> it won't go to the recycle bin so it's a one-way trip.
>
>You say that like it's a *bad* thing. :D
It's my machine, and if I want to move the blatent advertising
for a related product to a folder so I can nostalgicaly view
it in a few years when the companies are no longer bedfellows
I should be able to do it...
>[snip]
>
>Well, I don't know, I try to keep my desktop a little neater
>than that. The program menu is a bit over the top, but it's
>nice to have somewhere to go to get to *every* program
>you have.
Sure, I just want a separate uncluttered version for a
few things.
>I see. Why do you want to keep it on your desktop, then? Sounds
>like its better off in the toolbar..
It doesn't take any special fiddling in the desktop folder. I
manipulate the contents as files, not special menu contents. But,
I always access it from the toolbar copy because it is quicker.
If the file manager treated menu items the same as files, that
would be just as good.
>> How do you get a handy set of 'your' items isolated from the rest?
>
>Windows has per-user desktops; your start menu can have
>items just for you. Likewise the toolbars Windows does
>have (which don't pop up).
I don't really want to get rid of the other stuff, I just want
my own to be more accessable.
[snip]
>> But people work together, and you can hardly buy a computer
>> that does not have the current version of Word on it -
>
>Sure you can. Word is an expensive program, low end computers
>are frequently sold without it.
>
>> it is even in the Works package now.
>
>I beg your pardon?
>
>I do not think Word is any part of Works. You've got it
>confused with Office.
The Dell I just got came with something called 'Works Suite 2000'
which includes Word 2000. I guess even Microsoft gave up on
the problems of dealing with Word incompatibility.
And by the way for anyone who thinks windows is easy to set up,
this box came with a total of 21 CD's and a few floppies.
Most of these have several separate things that ask or force
you to reboot as you add each piece.
>> So - sooner or later you
>> end up needing a program that will match.
>
>That will read the same files your co-workers do, certainly.
>
>It does not have to be *MS Office*.
Yes it does. Even if some other program can read the files
today, MS has demonstrated that they can and will change the
formats whenever they want. The FUD factor wins. Anyone
using another program has to assume that someday, probably
soon, they will start getting files they can't read. Again.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
Reply-To: "Patrick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Patrick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.be.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: MacOS X: under the hood... (was Re: There is only one innovation that
matters...)
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 04:53:49 GMT
I tried Linux before BeOS and I didn't care for it. I really like BeOS. How
do I remove LILO and replace with Bootman?
Patrick
"Piers Bray" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:39430658$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
:
: "Patrick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
: : That would make sense as sometimes Windows9x does some strange things in
the
: name of hardware recognition. A boot disk or creating a Be Partition from
: within BeOS PE and then copying the OS onto it and using Bootman to
install
: a boot manager for it and Windows works the best. You would not believe
the
: speed BeOS boots.
:
: Piers B.
:
:
------------------------------
From: "Hai Nguyen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: x86 processor mode and Linux
Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 23:56:06 -0700
Hi,
I was wondering, what processor modes( aka Ring Levels aka CPL) does Linux
use on the x86?
Thanks,
Hai
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Full Name)
Crossposted-To: comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: Dealing with filesystem volumes
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:06:47 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 10 Jun 2000 15:03:07 GMT, James Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>Haven't you heard of automount and autofs?
>It automatically mounts it when accessed
>and unmount it when not in used for some time.
>
>
We recently had a Mandrake box rendered unusable when the machine that
was used as a backup failed to answer the mount request. It filled
it's own hard disk with copies of local files every 24 hours when the
backup cron job was triggered.
------------------------------
From: John & Susie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux & Winmodem
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 01:15:58 -0400
This is how people get pissed off about Linux. The modem thing is easy
to solve, but what about the 'win-printer', 'win-scanner', 'win-camera',
et al?
mlw wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > Hi all
> >
> > A quick question: I'm thinking of trying out Linux (probably SuSE), but
> > I have a US Robotics Winmodem. I know it is incompatible, but is it
> > still worthwhile running a dual Windows (for internet) and Linux
> > system - or does that kind of miss the point?
>
> I would bag the WinModem and dig up $29 for a real modem. Even if you
> don't like Linux, the real modem is a better peripheral. WinModem's are
> like factory radios in Ford Escorts, not worth the price of
> installation.
>
> --
> Mohawk Software
> Windows 9x, Windows NT, UNIX, Linux. Applications, drivers, support.
> Visit http://www.mohawksoft.com
> Have you noticed the way people's intelligence capabilities decline
> sharply the minute they start waving guns around?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Subject: Re: x86 processor mode and Linux
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:25:01 GMT
On Sat, 10 Jun 2000 23:56:06 -0700, Hai Nguyen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Hi,
>
>I was wondering, what processor modes( aka Ring Levels aka CPL) does Linux
>use on the x86?
Linux uses two rings on Intel hardware: 3 and 0.
For kernel code, the segment descriptor is 10h, and the segment descriptor
for the data is 18h (both ring 0). For user code, the segment descriptor
is 23h, and for user data it is 2bh (both ring 3). AKAIF, Linux uses only
these four descriptors.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:41:56 GMT
Chris Pott writes:
>>>>> I'm not falling into another tholenesque spiral this week,
>>>> What alleged "tholenesque spiral"?
>>> The tholenesque spiral in which we find ourselves at this very moment.
>> Incorrect; that would be a "tinmanesque" spiral, given that you
>> started it.
> Irrelevant, given that the characteristics of said spiral are not
> dependent on whom initiated it.
Illogical, given that the said spiral was given a name.
> (Yes, I'm jumping into discussions again.)
Why?
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:45:46 GMT
Tinman writes:
>>>>> [oh well, it's hot out there anyway]
>>>> Irrelevant.
>>> Not to my garden.
>> This newsgroup is not your garden.
> Irrelevant, the reference is to my garden, not this newsgroup.
Illogical, given that the posting is in this newsgroup, not your
garden.
>>>>>> Tinman writes:
>>>>> Typical inaccuracy,
>>>> Incorrect.
>>> On the contrary.
>> Is that the best you can do, merely stating contrariness?
> Can you do better?
I see that you didn't answer the question. No surprise there.
>>>>> It's tinman.
>>>> Which is how I spelled it to begin with.
>>> Incorrect, you spelled it Tinman,
>> Same spelling.
Note: no response.
>>> and you did it again above.
>> I'm being consistent in my spelling, which is consistent with your
>> spelling.
> Nope.
Incorrect. Compare the spellings.
> But if you prefer, you made a capitalization error--
On what basis do you call it an error?
> regardless, it's still incorrect.
On your part.
> And you keep repeating this error.
You're erroneously presupposing that it is an error.
>>>>>>> I'm not falling into another tholenesque spiral this week,
>>>>>> What alleged "tholenesque spiral"?
>>>>> The tholenesque spiral in which we find ourselves at this very moment.
>>>> Incorrect; that would be a "tinmanesque" spiral, given that you
>>>> started it.
>>> Incorrect on two counts--
>> Balderdash, for reasons given below.
Note: no response.
>>> I didn't start this thread,
>> Irrelevant, given that I didn't say that you starting this thread.
> Typically incomprehensible, "given that I didn't say that you starting
> this thread" makes no sense.
How ironic, coming from the person who doesn't realize what I didn't
say.
>>> and it is clearly in a tholenesque mode of discourse.
>> An example of pontification.
> Correct, but uninteresting, since all tholenesque modes of discourse are
> examples of pontification.
Classic circular reasoning.
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,nl.scouting
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Haakmat digest, volume 2451707
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:46:59 GMT
Today's Haakmat digest:
1> Why do you think I asked?
Entertainment purposes?
------------------------------
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Thorne digest, volume 2451707
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 05:51:39 GMT
Today's Thorne digest:
1> Another of Tholen's Assteriods.
What alleged "Assteriods", Thorne?
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Loren Petrich)
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Mac = Playstation? Unix useless?(was Re: Canada invites Microsoft north)
Date: 11 Jun 2000 05:58:35 GMT
In article <39415d6b$13$obot$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Bob Germer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On 06/09/2000 at 08:59 PM,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (abraxas) said:
>> I dont run windows by the way, or OS2. In case you thought you were
>> getting my goat or something. :)
>Then there are only 2 possibilities. You are running a MAC which is
>nothing more than a glorified Playstation or you are running some form of
>unix which makes your machine virtually useless for 99.98% of business
>customers.
How is a Macintosh a glorified Playstation? That's pure idiocy.
Compared to a Playstation, a Macintosh is essentially a rather weird
flavor of PeeCee.
Unix? How is it useless? What do you think all those purchases of
Unix servers are made by?
--
Loren Petrich Happiness is a fast Macintosh
[EMAIL PROTECTED] And a fast train
My home page: http://www.petrich.com/home.html
------------------------------
From: Rick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: vote on MS split-up
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 02:05:19 -0400
Smitty wrote:
>
> "Colin R. Day" wrote:
>
> > Gerald Willmann wrote:
> >
> > > CNN is conducting a poll whether MS should be split up and if yes into how
> > > many parts. Please take a minute to vote for a good cause.
> > >
> > > -> http://cnnfn.com/poll/microsoft_breakup.html
> > >
> > > thanks, Gerald
> > >
> > > --
> >
> > Justice is not the product of opinion polls. Besides, I want
> > Microsoft destroyed by Linux, not the DOJ.
> >
> > Colin Day
>
> Hear! Hear! Crush them in the market place where they live!
> Smitty
History and Microsft have proven the market cannot kill M$, even when
the market is more innovative.
--
Rick
To reply by email remove the obvious from my address.
------------------------------
From: Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Canada invites Microsoft north
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 06:01:55 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> > But if you prefer, you made a capitalization error--
>
> On what basis do you call it an error?
>
> > regardless, it's still incorrect.
>
> On your part.
See tinman, Tholen knows how your handle name should be presented better than
you do. You really wanted to be known as Tinman, not tinman.
Can't argue with "logic" like that. You believe the ego of this guy?
------------------------------
From: Rick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: vote on MS split-up
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 02:09:37 -0400
Jim Ross wrote:
>
> ajam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Gerald Willmann wrote:
> >
> > > CNN is conducting a poll whether MS should be split up and if yes into
> how
> > > many parts. Please take a minute to vote for a good cause.
> > >
> > > -> http://cnnfn.com/poll/microsoft_breakup.html
> > >
> > > thanks, Gerald
> > >
> > > --
> >
> > This is like the Soviet Union. Now that it is not a direct threat, we
> have a
> > zillion people to worry about. Regardless, if it is M$ or someone else,
> you
> > always are going to have someone controlling most of the market. I
> prefer
> > to deal with an enemy that I know well, than one that I don't plus a
> zillion
> > creeping everywhere! My personal opinion is that M$ should be nailed big
> > time, and regulated left and right, but a break up really won't solve
> much!
> >
>
> A three way breakup would change everything.
>
> Why the worry?
> If Linux is good, that the most important thing.
>
> Jim
Go Computing had good handwriting recognition. Microsoft killed Go
Computing. Digital Research had a good DOS replacement. M$ killed that
off too. Good doesnt win against M$ unless there are some other VERY
compelling reasons to go with something else.
--
Rick
To reply by email remove the obvious from my address.
------------------------------
From: Rick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: democracy?
Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 02:13:13 -0400
Francis Van Aeken wrote:
>
> Gerald Willmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote
>
> > CNN is conducting a poll whether MS should be split up and if yes into how
> > many parts. Please take a minute to vote for a good cause.
>
> > -> http://cnnfn.com/poll/microsoft_breakup.html
>
> The results of these MS breakup polls (consistently 2/3 against) raise some
> interesting questions about the implementation of democracy (in this case in
> the USA).
>
> Why is it that the opinion of the man in the street doesn't matter (because
> they're stupid, stupid! (?)) and why is it that one single person (the judge)
> is to make the decision? Shouldn't there be at least a panel or a jury?
>
> Francis.
The general public is highly misinformed about M$'s business practices.
They dont know that M$ has videotaped demos, then written code to
duplicate the screen actions fo that demo, preannouced product to freeze
the market (They did that to Go computing). They dont know aboutthe
stolen code (Apple's quicktime code ended up in Video for Windows, M$
lost in court over that). Add to that that practice of charging less for
Windows if you put it on ALL your shipping computers, instead of just
95%...
M$ is criminally competitive, and the general public doesnt have that
information... Judge jackson does.
--
Rick
To reply by email remove the obvious from my address.
------------------------------
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