Linux-Advocacy Digest #358, Volume #30 Wed, 22 Nov 00 00:13:02 EST
Contents:
Re: Of course, there is a down side... (Gary Hallock)
Re: Of course, there is a down side... ("Les Mikesell")
Re: wahoo! I'm running now (Gary Hallock)
Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied. (Gary Hallock)
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: wahoo! I'm running now (Gary Hallock)
Re: Mandrake 7.2 and KDE2 - Congrats ! (Gary Hallock)
Re: Linux for nitwits (Gary Hallock)
Re: Linux for nitwits (Gary Hallock)
Re: Uptime -- where is NT? (Marty)
Re: Uptime -- where is NT? (Marty)
Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied. ("Les Mikesell")
Re: The real question about Claire Lynn (Jacques Guy)
Re: LINUX USED BY THE NEW ZEALAND ARMY FOR ARMED FORCES SIMULATION: (kiwiunixman)
Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied. ("Les Mikesell")
Re: Uptime -- where is NT? (Marty)
Re: Microsoft Speaks German! ("Chad Mulligan")
Re: The Sixth Sense (T. Max Devlin)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:19:17 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Of course, there is a down side...
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> That's because I don't have to worry about &^*%$#@?{}":;:"""!~`\|}{
> and all the other"wonderful" keys you Penguinista's dream about using
> in your next version of the Linux How-Not To.
>
r p m - q l p U v h
Yeh, you're right. Who else but "Penguinista's" would dream of using
those wacky characters.
> claire
>
> BTW how did your kde experiment work out?
Worked fine.
Gary
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Of course, there is a down side...
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 04:31:36 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 07:03:36 GMT, Mike Byrns
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> >Bullshit Les. Show some proof. My default install of Pro didn't even
> >have
> >NetBIOS over TCP enabled so the port was rejecting connections. When I
> >uninstalled the Workstation service it was stealthed. I've NMAPed my
> >box and
> >nothing is open that I don't want and that's OUT OF THE BOX. BTW I'm
> >not "blocking" anything. Windows does not respond when the services are
> >not installed on the interface. Never has.
>
> I just went through this EXACT scenario installing SuSE 6.4 as well as
> Win2k in default installs.
>
> With SuSE 6.4 I took the "Almost Everything" option because as a
> newbie, I don't want to miss experiencing Linux to it's fullest. With
> Win2k I did a standard default install.
Try a RedHat 6.2 or up 'workstation' install if you want the
machine not to run any services. Normally I want to use the
computer so I want services enabled. However, that has
nothing to do with the earlier posting about Microsoft arbitrarily
moving the ports for file sharing without telling anyone. Quick
now, which router ports do you block to keep netbios-over-tcp
from leaking out?
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:30:44 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: wahoo! I'm running now
The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
> Not me, but then it might be a usage issue. Erik F. mentioned
> that a way he likes to work is to:
>
> 1. Select text on document #1.
> 2. Edit > Copy.
> 3. Select text on document #2.
> 4. Edit > Paste.
>
> Presto: instant replacement, when using Windows. Alas, this doesn't
> work for my version of kwrite. But that may be because I'm using
> RedHat 6.2, and whatever version of KDE came with that.
>
> This is obviously not a major flaw, but it does illustrate that
> things break sometimes -- even under Linux. :-)
Yes, X does have a limitation of one selection at a time. The second select
wipes out the first.
Gary
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:35:55 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> And you think posting your real name to an advocacy group does?
>
> claire
>
>
Probably. At least, posting with the same id does. How am I suppose to
determine what id you used to post to alt.os.linux.mandrake? And you
have posted to alt.os.linux.mandrake with the name "claire". It just
wasn't a query for help. It was a put down. So you want me to believe
that you have posted to alt.os.linux.mandrake asking for help under a
different name? Yeh, right!
Gary
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 04:37:40 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Ayende Rahien
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 11 Nov 2000 03:51:53 +0200
<8uicid$abe$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>"The Ghost In The Machine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
>message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
You missed the point slightly, which was, if memory serves, what
the possible responses would be when one presses on one icon on one window,
then drags it to another window and drops it.
>
>> Blue Screen O' Death.
>
>From copying files?
A coworker did have a machine that flaked out while playing CD's,
at one point. If one is copying a file and listening at the same
time, well....
Admittedly, though, that'a nitpick.
>
>> Lock destination window with "copying progress" dialog box, then hang.
>
>On what circumstances?
Well, it always locks the destination window. I'm not sure about
the hang, but if it copies large files or lots of files it does tend
to misrepresent the amount of time it has left. If one's
real lucky, it *will* hang. :-)
>
>> Put up a "Can't copy to itself" (if you're lucky).
>
>Why? If you are trying to copy a file to the same path, that is the error
>you get.
True, and it's a nice protection.
>
>> Try to copy to itself and wipe out the item (if you're not).
>
>No, it doesn't do that. It gives an error message.
It better not. The GUI is bad enough without crap like that. :-)
>
>> Successfully copy the items, but in such a way as to leave the
>> user completely befuddled regarding positioning. (For example, from
>> a Details window to a Large Icons window display.)
>
>That is a matter of the user's display settings.
>Some people like to have a large icons display for some folders, and details
>display in some.
>It's easyily changable, of course.
>Right click on empty space > view > <viewing icons as whatever you like>
>You can also set a default type if you like, or put a common feel to all the
>explorer windows (my choice.)
Yeah, I know. Usually I reorganize the icons anyway, and usually
(but not always!) they stay where I put them.
But the Amiga was definitely more predictable in this regard. :-)
(Even the Mac doesn't do such strange things with its icons;
at worst, it snaps them to a fixed grid, if memory serves.
Boring, but predictable.)
>
>> Successfully copy the items, leaving them at the end of the list
>> (List or Details display) instead of near the mouse pointer.
>
>Right click > Arrange Icons > <Choose what to arrange the icons with>
>
>If you copy in Large Icons display, it will put them near the mouse (if you
>used paste from the mouse menu).
>
>> Flash the screen and ignore you (destination read-only)...?
>
>What do you mean by this?
What do you think I mean? Is it obvious to the casual user before he
drops the icons that the directory into which he's dropping them
is readonly?
Probably not. (I'm frankly not sure what MS will do, since
I haven't tried it.)
>
>> Put up a dialog box saying "The destination is read-only".
>
>What would you expect?
About this, actually. :-)
>
>> Put up a dialog box saying "Permission denied".
>
>In what cases?
I'd have to do some research on this one; however, one easy way is
to have a file that was not replaceable (because it was readonly, owned
by someone else, undreadable, unwritable, etc. The error message
might say something else.)
>
>> Execute the destination (!!). (Hello, virus.)
>
>What did you do?
Well, I dragged the file and dropped it on its counterpart (I was
copying an .EXE file)....is this reasonable? I would surmise that
the executing .EXE probably got an argument, which happens to be
the source .EXE; I don't know enough to be sure about MFC and/or
Windows, though.
>
>> Completely trash your registry (!!!).
>
>From copying files?
No, from dragging an icon and dropping it on another one (as opposed
to an empty space in the destination folder). Apparently, if an
icon is highlighted, it *accepts* the thing you're holding, executing it
in much the same way as WorkShell (or whatever) executes things
for Outlook. If it's a directory, great; it gets dropped into
that directory (which is probably what you want). If it's an
executable, though, that executable gets executed. I haven't tried
dropping a .txt file on another .txt file, but I suspect I'll get notepad.
Doubleclicking on .REG files is A Very Bad Thing, which can trash your
registry. (It's useful IF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING! But is
it reasonable? I would preferit to open RegEdit, thank you!
I hope this is fixed in Win2k/WinmMe...it's a gigantic flaw.)
>
>> Execute the associated tool of the destination icon, with *both*
>> source and destination as arguments.
>
>There isn't such a thing as destination icon in windows.
Oh no?
Somebody better tell the highlight thingy then; if one presses on
an icon (a .txt file, say), and drags it over a window without
releasing the mouse button, if one passes over another icon, it
highlights if the destination icon is a folder or executable.
That's what I'm calling the destination icon.
Drop the source on the destination. What happens?
If you're lucky, something reasonable.
(I will have to retract part of my statement; apparently Windows isn't
as dumb as I thought. Thank goodness. I can't drop a .txt onto
another .txt in the same window. I *have* had it open all of the files
I'm holding at once, though -- although I think it was because I
inadvertantly double-clicked on a folder full of things I'd
already highlighted (I haven't played with my doubleclick settings, so they're
probably a tad slow). I then get to close them all. Fun.)
>There are drive icons, and folders icons, but that it about how far as it
>goes.
It apparently works for more than that.
>
>> The last three are predicted consequences if one highlights the desired
>> destination (assuming one wants to overwrite it), then drops the icon
>> being moved thereonto. (The first one I once triggered by accident;
>> fortunately the tool -- one of my own -- was easily interruptable.)
>> Unfortunately, it's not clear how one can differentiate between
>> "drag tool icon to overwrite this other tool icon" and "drag tool icon
>> to tool icon so that second tool icon can execute using this first icon
>> as an argument" (an operation that is not unique to Windows, BTW --
>> Amiga and Mac had it, too). Note that I haven't tested the last two,
>> but I have this ugly feeling...
>
>If you are drugging any file, and dropping it on an exeutable, it will run,
>with the icon that you dropped on it as the pharameters.
>If you are draggin number of files, you'll get all their paths stuffed into
>the pharameters.
I think you mean "dragging", "executable", and "parameters", but
yes, you're correct; this sort of thing has been around since
Amiga, and probably Mac as well. (On the Amiga, though, there
was no concept of "dropping on", just "dropping in"; one highlighted
a tool icon and a bunch of data icons, and double-clicked.)
>
>
>> I also wonder what happens if one tries to copy from or to the
>> Control Panel special directory.
>
>You can't.
>Cut, Copy & Paste options are disabled in the Control Panel.
Probably not unreasonable, considering things in there are slightly
magical anyway. :-)
>
>> There are also issues when using rectangular select in the various
>> display modes -- this is pointed out in the Interface Hall Of Shame
>> (http://www.iarchitect.com/mshame.html).
>
>404 - file not found.
Typo on my part; try
http://www.iarchitect.com/mshame.htm
instead. (*grumble grumble* darned MS-specific extensions *grumble* :-) )
>
>
>There are 3 in depths reviews of MS products in this site (Which I *highly*
>recommend, btw. Both as an educating tool and one of the most amusing
>reading materials that I've the chance to read.)
>None of them has anything to do with rectangular select.
>
>Start here:
>http://www.iarchitect.com/shame.htm
>Hilarious & Educating, what more can you ask from a site?
>
I'll admit, I like it. :-)
I even sent him something; Netscape on Unix machines has a bad
habit of stuffing <SELECT><OPTION>...</SELECT> tags into a
Motif OptionButton -- which can get very hairy if one has a hundred
options. (IE and Netscape on MS use a combobox pulldown with scrollbar.)
One might consider this a combination of stupid Web page design, and
browser mishandling thereof.
I hope 6.0 fixes this.
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:28:15 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: wahoo! I'm running now
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> True at first, only because the default configuration under XF86Setup
> worked fine so I didn't know. I went back and DID select Emulate 3
> button mouse and now cute paste DOES work with mouse but STILL fails
> using menues.
You know, it does ask you if if want to emulate a 3-button mouse during
installation.
Gary
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:41:29 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Mandrake 7.2 and KDE2 - Congrats !
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> All of these things worked perfectly for me under Win2k and BTW I
> didn't have any greyed out Netscape menues either.
>
Ever try to install Partition Magic on Windows 2000 or Windows ME? Oops, doesn't
work.
Gary
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:47:22 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux for nitwits
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> You must be a real idiot then because at least where I live the cable
> company comes and sets the entire thing up. Unfortunately they haven't
> reached my street yet and if you happen to mention Linux, they will
> not come at all.
>
> claire
Wow. Not what does that have to do with installing Windows with a Direct
Cable Connection. The cable in this case, sometimes called a null modem
cable, allows connecting two computers through the parallel port. Extremly
slow (40K Bytes/sec). Don't you know anything about Windows?
Gary
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2000 23:49:25 -0500
From: Gary Hallock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux for nitwits
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>
> Ooopps...You are correct...My mistake.
>
> Sorry to all..
> claire
What this shows is that you are too damn fast to blame Linux. This was a
discussion about the pain of installing Windows.
Gary
------------------------------
From: Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Uptime -- where is NT?
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 04:48:07 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> Kind of like the speedometer scale on production street cars is
> ALWAYS higher than the maximum speed that the car will go with
> the factory drivetrain.
[Aside:] That's not always the case. My '92 Ford Exploder (er.. Explorer)
only went up to 85MPH on the speedometer and I've gotten it to 105 or so.
However, my 2001 VW Passat goes up to 160MPH on the speedometer and I've only
gotten it to 130. Both are straight stock.
------------------------------
From: Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Uptime -- where is NT?
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 04:50:27 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> Marty writes:
>
> >> sfcybear writes:
>
> >>> That still leaves the FACT that NT uptime clocks are only acurate for
> >>> 49.7 days while Unix clocks are 10 times more acurate than that.
> >>> remaining accurate for 497 days.
>
> >> You're confusing range with accuracy. Both clocks could be equally
> >> accurate. Range usually comes at the expense of precision. That is,
> >> the same number of bits can provide a greater range if the precision
> >> is reduced.
>
> > Is it "accurate" to report that a system has been up for 0 days when it
> > has, in fact, been up for 49.7 days?
>
> How does that prove that UNIX clocks are 10 times more accurate, Marty?
How does that answer my question?
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied.
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 04:59:48 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 19:19:48 -0500, Gary Hallock
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >> How do you know if I post in any other groups? Just because you look
> >> for "claire" doesn't mean there aren't post's from me.
> >>
> >> Look a little bit harder.
> >
> >And you think this helps your credibility?
> >
> >Gary
> And you think posting your real name to an advocacy group does?
>
> claire
I guess that would depend on whether you always tell the truth in
those postings, wouldn't it?
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:03:02 +0000
From: Jacques Guy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The real question about Claire Lynn
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Well, we all know that she's another typical ignorant female whinger, who for
> some reason considers herself a authority on why linux is not up to scratch.
> But the real question is, does she have a big set of tits?
Nope. She's got tats for tits, as the saying goes, in
singular reverse.
------------------------------
From: kiwiunixman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: LINUX USED BY THE NEW ZEALAND ARMY FOR ARMED FORCES SIMULATION:
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 17:58:00 +1300
Claire, Have you ever been to New Zealand? probably not. Unlike the US
military, when the New Zealand Army helps in peace keeping, they work
with the people (as in the case of East Temor), not tell them what to do
like the US military. Also, unlike the US military, the New Zealand
Army does not have the arrogant belief that "our way is the best way"
like how the US military does, this arrogant approach by the US military
has had disastrous consequences, such as Vietnam and Somalia.
Claire, I think you actually need to read a bit about history before you
post anecdotal stories on how great the US/any other country is. As a
side issue, what did you actually learn in History whilst at College
(ages 13-18years), it is obvious they you only know a small section of
history that fits into your frame of mind. At college, here in New
Zealand, I learnt about the Russian Revolution, WWI, WWII, Vietnam,
Charles I, Charles II, James I (James the forth of Scotland), Elizabeth,
Korean Conflict, The Cold War, The Bore War, The Treaty of Waitangi,
American Revolution, American Civil War, Chinese Revolution, German
Revolution (when Kaiser William abdicated), and many more topics. Do
students in the US learn about things outside the US (such as the
English Revoltion when Charles I is overthown by the gentry, and Oliver
Cromwell tries to create a Government to replace the monarchy, or the
TRUE story regarding the Vietnam War) or is it just Claire that has a
naive view of the world? My guess, it is just Claire.
kiwiunixman
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> And where are they today?
>
> Protecting the sheep in the fields?
>
> Give me a break....
>
> claire
>
> On Wed, 22 Nov 2000 14:56:27 +1300, kiwiunixman
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> Historically, New Zealand has had the largest contingent of troops, per
>> capita, when New Zealand particpates in any war. Where was the o'l US
>> of A during WWI and WWII? wasn't in there until the ol' Japanese bombed
>> perl harbour. Get ya bloody facts right claire or keep your trap shut!
>>
>> kiwiunixman
>>
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>
>>> I didn't realize New Zealand had an army?
>>>
>>> claire
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 21 Nov 2000 22:37:04 +1300, kiwiunixman
>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Read the story below:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.stuff.co.nz/inl/index/0,1008,497306a1896,FF.html
>>>> Who said Linux wasn't ready for the big league?
>>>>
>>>> kiwiunixman
>>>
------------------------------
From: "Les Mikesell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied.
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:02:55 GMT
"Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:6WrS5.9453$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> This annoys me. One of my most common paste operations is to copy some
> text, highlight some other text and paste, deleting the text in the second
> document and replacing it with the pasted text. Can't do that.
>
> It also seems that you can't have highlighted text in more than one
> document.
It is equally annoying that in MS-Windows you have to do an
extra operation to copy instead of automatically having a
highlighted selection available to paste.
Les Mikesell
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Marty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.os2.advocacy,alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: Uptime -- where is NT?
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:00:23 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> Do you have any idea how routers work? How subnets work? Usually, but not
> necessarily always (which is why I said "sounds like") a subnet is routed by
> a gateway router. The last IP address in the traceroute wasn't even close
> to IP address of the destination, which suggests that unless the IP was
> connected directly to the NAP, it would have to go through a subnet router.
The main site is enormous. It has received over 40 million hits in the past 4
years. It owns the main network feed.
------------------------------
Reply-To: "Chad Mulligan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Chad Mulligan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Microsoft Speaks German!
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 05:06:23 GMT
"Stephen S. Edwards II" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8v4qbf$qb8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chad Myers) wrote in
> <V7TQ5.4584$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
> >
> >"André Pönitz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:8v0s33$8ma$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> wrote:
> >> > G.W.Bush is in the lead and will rectify the situation.
> >>
> >> By having some more people executed perhaps?
> >
> >A governor's responsibility is to uphold the law.
> >
> >The law in Texas allows for the death penalty.
> >
> >A bill to outlaw the death penalty in Texas would
> >fail miserably.
> >
> >The Governor reviews each case, but it its considered
> >poor practice to grant pardons to every person convicted
> >and sentanced by the judicial branch.
> >
Actually Texas law gives him very little authority to do anything.
Hopefully the Presidency will be changed accordingly if that moron is chosen
by the other morons in the state of confusion.
> >What is with you liberals being against the rule of law?
>
> If the liberal Democrats were to follow the law, then
> Al Gore wouldn't stand a chance of getting elected.
>
> Of course, to this, some screaming liberal dimwit will
> probably say that I'm a fascist, and that I don't care
> about anything but money. *sigh*
You're a fascist and don't care about anything but money. ;^P
> --
> .-----.
> |[_] | Stephen S. Edwards II | http://www.primenet.com/~rakmount/
> | = :| -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> | -| "You are a waste of space; a disgrace to your profession;
> | | both the one you claim and the kindergarten student you
> |_..._| act like..." -- Robert Moir to Aaron R. Kulkis in COMNA
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The Sixth Sense
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 00:13:37 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Christopher Smith in alt.destroy.microsoft;
>"Steve Mading" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
[...]
>> Because in the case of printers and URLS the "shortcut" doesn't need to
>> be anything more than a dumb ascii string. Exactly what is the difference
>> between having one icon associated with this string vs having two? I
>> don't see why it needs to be a special thing - once you have the capacity
>> to associate an icon with a URL string, what's the difference between a
>> shortcut to that icon, and just making a totally new icon associated with
>> the URL string?
>
>[...]A shortcut to
>a URL basically *is* just a file with the plaintext URL in it.
"Basically?"
>> For example, in kde and gnome, the desktop can have an icon on it that
>> refers to a "URL" file, which is, behind the scenes, just a file that
>> contains one line of text - the URL itself.
>
>And that's almost exactly what a shortcut to a URL in Windows is. It may
>also contain a few other bits of information like whether or not the page
>the URL refers to has been syncronised or whether it has changed since the
>last time it was opened.
Which is to say that the phrase "almost exactly" is synonymous, in at
least this context, with "not".
>> : The advantage to these things is that you can move them around, or send them
>> : to other people, or take them with you.
>>
>> URLs already have that feature, without shortcuts.
>
>But they don't have the other things like syncronisation information, or the
>ability to be quickly an easily manipulated as a single object, if they're
>just a string in a file somewhere.
They are an URL, in a file, right there, where you put them. They don't
change mysteriously, and therefore cannot prove a source of problems
when the krufty bogus design of monopoly crapware shows its true colors,
and proves to be an impediment to effective use of standardized basic
functionality, such as an URL.
>> That's why I'm
>> confused. There is no difference between making two separate copies
>> of a URL and making a shortcut to a URL. A URL is *already* a remote
>> reference anyway.
>
>I ask again, what are the two copies you're talking about ?
Apparently, you seem to be having trouble grasping some abstraction or
something. The problem, I would suspect, is that you are getting
confused over all the different things that "shortcuts" are, in Windows.
They are sort-of-like soft links, they are PIFs, they are URLs wrapped
in an icon, they are several other things, all mushed together into one
despicably inconsistent mess.
He is talking about *any* two copies, Christopher. In an optimally
functional system, the idea of a shortcut to an URL makes no sense. An
URL is a reference to a file, a shortcut is a reference to a file. Why
have a reference to the reference to a file; doesn't it make more sense
to just reference the file?
[...]
>Can I copy (just with cp, or by dragging it to a disk in, say, KDE) a link
>from any filesystem that supports links to any other filesystem that
>supports links and have the link still work ? How about ftping it ?
Christ, no. What a ghastly idea.
[...]
>> I know they exist. I don't use them. There's very little point to it,
>> precisely because I don't want to lock myself into just kde or gnome.
>
>They're a *UI* feature. It's irrelevant whether you "lock yourself in"
>because they're only really meant for organising access to <whatever> inside
>the UI of your choice.
So want a link to be portable across file systems, but not across
interfaces? What up wit dat?
[...]
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
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