Linux-Advocacy Digest #772, Volume #30 Sat, 9 Dec 00 19:13:04 EST
Contents:
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever (Chris Ahlstrom)
Re: Windows review (Adam Schuetze)
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever (Chris Ahlstrom)
Re: What if Linux wasn't free? ("Bobby D. Bryant")
Re: Nobody wants Linux because it destroys hard disks. ("Bobby D. Bryant")
Re: Uptimes ("Otto")
Re: Windows review (Adam Schuetze)
Re: Windows 2000 sucks compared to linux ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Video software for linux ("Nigel Feltham")
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: What if Linux wasn't free? (mlw)
Re: Nobody wants Linux because it destroys hard disks. ("Bobby D. Bryant")
Re: Caifornia power shortage... ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 23:30:00 GMT
Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
> "Anonymous" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > >>No. I stated you had to reboot to remove TCP/IP either in Windows or
> Linux.
> > >>Others in this thread started saying "Why remove it when you can merely
> > >>disable it" and when I said you could disable it the same way under
> Windows,
> > >>you made the claim that you couldn't.
> > >
> > >No that isn't what you said Fukenbush. You said you could remove
> > >TCP/IP from Windows without rebooting. And I said you were full
> > >of shit then.
> >
> > Actually, he's right, Erik. You started out showing how you can remove
> > and then add the protocol, and it will still work, if you ignore the
> > direction to reboot. I corrected that by pointing out that if you do
> > reboot after removing, you have to reboot to add. That's when you
> > switched to talking about binding the protocol, rather than removing it.
>
> No, I didn't and I challenge you to post a deja link to said statement.
>
> I started out showing how you can DISABLE TCP/IP, not REMOVE it in a manner
> similar to removing the IP address from an adapter in Linux.
Definitely seems like you're the one who has problems with reading
comprehension. Time to forego the comic books.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Adam Schuetze)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt,comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Windows review
Reply-To: adam at adam-schuetze dot org
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 23:32:21 GMT
On Sat, 09 Dec 2000 19:16:39 GMT, Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I didn't know about it either! I just tried it while trying to
> come up with a counterargument in this newsgroup.
>
> Aren't newsgroups great!
Yes!
I was going to mention, if that "thumbnail" viewer for ee isn't
good enough for your purposes, I was going to suggest gqview. I
went looking for an image previewer (because I didn't know ee
could do that), and found gqview. It works good.
--
Adam Schuetze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Get my pgp keys at http://www.adam-schuetze.org
- pgp fingerprints -
rsa: B8 80 DA D6 BB CA 80 5F C5 68 1C 08 FE 3E 65 1C
dss: 46 CB B3 C3 A1 C9 BA 57 7C B4 A1 6A BF 8F 2D 95 2B 7A 1D 77
------------------------------
From: Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 23:33:31 GMT
Kelsey Bjarnason wrote:
>
> 27000 requests to improve things; feature requests, not bugs. Almost half
> the claimed number of bugs. Sorry, I missed where you get support for
> "63,000 bugs" out of the references you provided.
I find no qualitative difference between 63,000 and 27,000. And Microsoft
is quite ambiguous about the status of 21,000 other "issues".
Also, as a programmer, I have found that it makes no difference to my
client whether I give them a "bug", or an "undesired feature". They
lump them together and want them fixed, pronto. The reputation suffers
the same tarnish with each.
Chris
------------------------------
From: "Bobby D. Bryant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What if Linux wasn't free?
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 17:29:13 -0600
jtnews wrote:
> I was in Home Depot a few weeks ago, and by chance I saw the cashier
> using her terminal and it had an HP-UX login prompt. Do you know what
> they're using Linux for at Home Depot?
Cash registers, supposedly. And it was a "going to" announcement, not
something they have already done.
As to why they would replace existing systems, I wouldn't know. Surely
they're not opening up enough new locations to need 90K new cash
registers.
The fact that they've been using Unix surely influenced the decision.
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas
------------------------------
From: "Bobby D. Bryant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Nobody wants Linux because it destroys hard disks.
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 17:34:04 -0600
Swangoremovemee wrote:
> On Fri, 08 Dec 2000 22:41:11 -0600, "Bobby D. Bryant"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >If you actually cared, you'd be sending your complaints to the makers of
> >those devices, rather than airing them on c.o.l.a.
>
> Nothing wrong with the hardware.
>
> Works on Windows and Mac.
>
> Linux is the weak link here.
Surprise! Some hardware requires OS-specific drivers, O Computer Guru.
If the vendors are shipping good drivers for Windows and the Mac, but not
for Linux, then you should be complaining to those vendors and threatening
to take your business elsewhere, instead of whingeing about it here.
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas
------------------------------
Reply-To: "Otto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Otto" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Uptimes
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 23:36:30 GMT
"sfcybear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:90tmu4$m0i$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
Snip...
: > I'd argue the cost of commercial NT based web site. For less than half
: a
: > million dollars, you could have the necessary hardware and software.
: People
: > tend to forget that OEM servers come with 10 CALs for each servers.
: > Depending on the number of servers used, the CALs add upp in hurry.
: Add to
: > the equation, that for the web users there is no licensing
: requirement, then
: > you can even drop some of the licenses on the OEM machines.
: > Your recurring cost is way out of whack. Salaries are salaries,
: regardless
: > of the OS.
:
: Yeah, and the staff that needed to keep and unstable OS up and running
: if far greater than the staff needed to keep a stable OS up and running.
: Two sources now show evidance that W2K is not stable
What evidence?
:
: Uptime (with a little math to get past the fact that more linux
: computers are listed in the report)
:
:
http://x76.deja.com/threadmsg_md.xp?thitnum=5&AN=702846300.1&mhitnum=6&CONTE
XT=976374076.1878327313
The www.uptime.net is not a report, just a project in which people can
participate if they want to. The actual reporting is done over the web,
which in itself can render a participating server down if it isn't reachable
regardless if it's actually down or not. However, it does prove you dead
wrong about the Windows OS. Check out the number 101 in the active host
section at the uptime site. It's a Windows98 machine with the uptime of 236
days. Or how about number 11 with NT 4.0 OS having 658 days uptime.
: And www.netcraft.com
Oh please, it has more holes in it than a swiss cheese...
: Trying to keep an OS as unstable as W2K seems to be is very time
: consuming, demanding more staff and more Salaries. So, not only is Linux
: cheaper to start with, the fact that it seems to be more stable than W2K
: goes a long way in showing that the staffing and thus the salaries
: required for Linux is LESS thatn W2K. Linux looks like it is gaining the
: advantage of lower TCO as well as stability!
Is Linux really cheaper than NT to use for a web site? That depends, for a
mom & pop site it's definetly the case. For a commercial web site Linux is
actually more expensive. Commercial entities will not build they own
servers, they will buy it from OEMs with OS. Ordering servers with Linux is
more expensive than servers with NT. The other cost factors for a new web
site, routers, firewalls, load balancing equipment, etc, are the same.
That leaves the operating expenses, which you claim is less for Linux. Or is
it? The monthly bandwidth, utility, and the rental costs are the same
regardless of the OS. Salaries aren't much different either. One would need
at least 3 people, preferably 6 for the 24/7 coverage, on staff to manage
the web site. Remember, this isn't a mom & pop site where it does not matter
if the site is accessible or not. Commercial web sites do have activity on
their site and availability is critical. Not to mention the necessity for
IDS and proper responses to intrusion attempts. Again, regardless of the OS
the administration cost is the same. One could argue that it's easier and
cheaper to have NT admins, than Linux admins, but we won't go there.
The TCO has two component, installation and operating costs. From the above
you can see, if you're not blind, that there is a difference in TCO between
Linux and NT. For deploying a commercial web site Linux is more expensive
than NT.
Otto
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Adam Schuetze)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt,comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Windows review
Reply-To: adam at adam-schuetze dot org
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 23:36:30 GMT
On Sat, 09 Dec 2000 21:38:22 GMT, Chris Ahlstrom <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Kelsey Bjarnason wrote:
> >
> > Well, if you're a GUI user, your mouse is usually conveniently placed
> > instead of stuck behind the monitor under a pile of magazines; if it takes
> > you more than about a quarter second to go from keyboard to mouse - or
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > back - you should probably see an ergonomics consultant.
>
> Now you know why many programmers prefer vi or emacs.
It's this VERY thing that annoys me about gui's. I am a touch
typist, so if I am doing any work with a gui, I'm always going
back and forth between mouse and keyboard. It's bad ergonomicly
(sp), and it's just plain annoying. Thats why I use vi.
Everything is there. No mouse required.
By the way, this brings up an interesting discussion about vi vs
emacs... heheheheh. I used to use emacs, but the control-<key>
commands were bothersome, because the control key sits at the
bottom left of my keyboard. It is a strain on the wrist to do
long term work with this.
I tried finding a different keyboard, but no luck. I've heard
about a "happy hacking" keyboard, thats supposed to have a sun-3
layout, but I haven't got one yet.
Is there any way to change it, so
that a different key is used rather than <ctrl>? Thats the main
reason I swiched to vi, because I can do everything from touch
type position.
--
Adam Schuetze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Get my pgp keys at http://www.adam-schuetze.org
- pgp fingerprints -
rsa: B8 80 DA D6 BB CA 80 5F C5 68 1C 08 FE 3E 65 1C
dss: 46 CB B3 C3 A1 C9 BA 57 7C B4 A1 6A BF 8F 2D 95 2B 7A 1D 77
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windows 2000 sucks compared to linux
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 18:39:12 -0500
Chad Myers wrote:
>
> "Curtis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Charlie Ebert) posted:
> >
> > | >Linux was used on the Titanic but the render farm had to be augmented by
> > | >utilizing NT boxes after they had finished doing the design work. The
> Linux
> > | >render farm, as designed wasn't up to the task. If you are looking for
> > | >referrences to what I say, check out the TITANIC thread in this group and
> > | >COLA from about 20 months ago.
> > | >
> > |
> > | Just so the crowd doesn't think your full of shit,
> > | give us just one link to a web site which proves this.
> > |
> > | Just one.
> >
> > http://linux.nuvoli.to.it/varie/titanic/2494.html
> >
> > You'll see that Digital Unix, NT and Linux were all used.
> >
> > Both NT and Digital Unix were not selected for the final rendering
> > because of cost, not capability.
>
> Here is the reasoning behind not using NT:
> "Windows NT had several shortfalls. First, our standard applications,
> which normally run on SGI hardware, were not available under NT. Our
> software staff could port the tools, but that solution would be quite
> expensive. NT also had several other limitations; it didn't support an
> automounter, NFS or symbolic links, all of which are critical to our
> distributed storage architecture. There were third-party applications
> available to fill some of these holes, but they added to the cost and,
> in many cases, did not perform well in handling our general computing
> needs."
>
> Cost of the OS wasn't a factor, it was the OS they were using.
>
> The lack of an automounter? What for?
>
> NFS? There are several freeware NFS client/servers for NT, and several
> commercial ones for relatively little cost, so this argument seems
> wrong or unresearched. This isn't a valid argument.
>
> Symbolic links? NT supports hard links. They could've also used DFS
> which supports all sorts of linking including symbolic links across
> the network. This isn't a very valid argument either.
>
> So basically it boils down to their software wasn't available on NT.
>
> Which software was this, exactly? They didn't mention it, so we can't
> validate the validity of this argument, but it will stand as a valid
> one for the time being.
>
> The primary argument against DUX was cost.
>
> "The biggest limitations of Digital UNIX were cost and lack of
> flexibility."
>
> So basically they didn't feel like using NT, and their software
> didn't run on it (which sounds unlikely. However it was in 1997,
> so the argument could be made), and DUX was too expensive.
> Linux was chosen because NT didn't support the software.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> That's essentially what it boils down to.
Precisely. Linux could do the job, NT couldn't.
> This wasn't a victory
> for Linux as much as it was a defeat for Digial Unix and
> NT didn't win or lose.
>
> -Chad
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Nigel Feltham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Video software for linux
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2000 23:36:28 -0000
>Of corse not. Linux only for EMACS, VI, and XTERM!
>
what a twat - linux supports a lot more than windows without
the huge cost - what about 'Broadcast 2000' for video editing
(supports most TV cards as well as firewall and 5 channel
24bit 96khz sound) and is free, Staroffice (free office suite
which does most of what the overpriced MS office does),
at least 15 window managers (windows only has one poorly
written bug riddled one) - the list is almost endless.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 18:40:26 -0500
Joe Malloy wrote:
>
> The Tholen tholes:
>
> > > I haven't seen any microwaves with an on/off button lately.
> >
> > Okay then, "Start/Stop", if you must be pedantic.
>
> Whoa, this is the pot calling the kettle black! Pedantic to the
> point of silliness, Tholen now turns around and uses pedanticism as
> an attack. Great going, Tholen, you're really low on the
> consistency list now!
There's a reason why Tholen, in 12 years, has never budged from
the TOP of my list as "GODDAMN STUPIDEST FUCKING IDIOT ON USENET"
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 18:41:12 -0500
Joe Malloy wrote:
>
> Tholen tholes:
>
> > > Silly me, I thought I was talking about text editors, not signs.
> >
> > Something wrong with a simple analogy to help illustrate a point?
>
> Wattsamatta, Tholen, you don't like being called on the carpet for
> an inappropriate "analogy"?
No...what he objects to is the fact that ... Steve was right.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What if Linux wasn't free?
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 18:43:19 -0500
Swangoremovemee wrote:
> But have you earned a degree?
>
> FWIW I have a BS in Mechanical Engineering from NY Polytechnic
> University.
Most of the "best" computer guys I know do not have degrees. I do not
put much stock in "degrees" so much as I put stock in people. When I see
people using a degree as a status symbol, it simply means, to me, that
they have no real love of what they had supposedly gone to school to
learn. A person that "loves" their pursuits and has the proper skills
(regardless of education) are far far more valuable than someone that
waives a piece of paper.
CS guys with no passion about computers will never be very good.
Mechanical engineers without passion will never design anything cool.
EEs with no love of electronics will never create anything interesting.
However, high school kids that love computers often come up with some
really cool programs.
Backyard mechanics often come up with novel approaches that have
improved industries.
More than one hardware hacker in a basement has created an HP or an
Apple.
Paper is meaningless. Dedication, aptitude, and a desire to improve ones
self is the only way to be successful, in any field of endeavor. If
obtaining a degree is part of that, great, but it is not always the
case. Intelligent men understand this, small men do not.
--
http://www.mohawksoft.com
------------------------------
From: "Bobby D. Bryant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Nobody wants Linux because it destroys hard disks.
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 17:39:49 -0600
Swangoremovemee wrote:
> Judging by your headers you are in school. Wait until you come out
> into the real world and get told your services are no longer needed
> before you speak like an English professor who has never written a
> best seller yet lectures all day on how to write on.
Yep, I'm in school. Now ask me about my career in IT before I came back
to school. And ask me whether there was any belt-tightening going on at
the places I worked.
I haven't written any "best selling" software, but I've written a *huge*
pile of work-a-day software in a commercial environment. Also managed
VAXClusters in an environment where taking down a single node for a
reboot, even at 4am on Sunday morning, would result in a flood of angry
phone calls to the data center. Try to convince me that I wanted a MS
solution in *that* environment.
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: Caifornia power shortage...
Date: Sat, 09 Dec 2000 18:45:12 -0500
Joseph Coughlan wrote:
>
> "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> > Russ Lyttle wrote:
> > >
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Steve Mading writes:
> > > >
> > > > >>>> Not exactly uncommon. When my VCR is "off", it's still on by
> > > > >>>> enough to keep a clock running and monitor its programming to
> > > > >>>> determine whether to turn "on" (or should I say "more on") and
> > > > >>>> record a program. Doesn't make the power switch any less
> > > > >>>> intuitive.
> > > >
> > > > >>> Actually, I would say that that sort of power switch is highly
> > > > >>> unintuitive. Intuitively, you'd expect that turning something
> > > > >>> off would, you know, actually turn it off.
> > > >
> > > > >> Depends on what you consider "off" to be. When you turn your
> > > > >> microwave oven off, do you expect it to lose the time? (Yes,
> > > > >> that does presuppose an oven with a clock on the display.
> > > > >> Are there any new models that don't have one of those built in?)
> > > >
> > > > > I haven't seen any microwaves with an on/off button lately.
> > > >
> > > > Okay then, "Start/Stop", if you must be pedantic.
> > > >
> > > > > If they had them, then yeah, I'd expect them to at least turn
> > > > > the display off, and go down to a trickle that only serves
> > > > > to maintain a few K of RAM (for the clock and maybe some programs)
> > > > > (which takes very little power, as evidenced by calculators and
> > > > > watches, and could be done by battery like it is for CMOS
> > > > > settings on computers.)
> > > >
> > > > Even with the display on, it could still be a trickle.
> > >
> > > All this "unintuitive" behavior of power switches is causing a major
> > > problem in California. The issue of all these devices still drawing
> > > power is keeping a load on the system that it wasn't designed to handle.
> > > That coupled with lack of new power generation in California is putting
> > > a strain on the system now, promising a major breakdown in the near
> > > future. Relying to much on intuition and not enough on reason is going
> > > to get a lot of people killed.
> >
> > Actually, the REAL problem is that the ECO-NUTS in California shut
> > down practically every fission power project that came down the pike
> > in the 1970's.
> >
> > If those plants had been built, a lot of oil-fired and coal-fired
> > plants would have been taken off-line a long time ago AND Cali.
> > would STILL have surplus capacity.
>
> That's news to us.
>
> Electrical power is available for the right price so there really is NOT a
> shortage - just a shortage of power for sale at a regulated low price. The
i.e. capacity is used up.
> simple truth is we've begun to de-regulate power in CA. These some of the
> logistical issues as the system is de-regulated.
>
> What you'll see if the free market is allowed to work is a large increase in
> power prices as power is sold to the highest bidder. No for profit power
Which, if youre eco-freaks don't gum up the works, will be quickly
counteracted by the construction of more plants, which will drop
the price as they come on line. ... that's how free markets work.
> company will willing refuse to make a huge profit selling to CA and they
> could care less about ECO-bashing and blame. We'll pay and we'll get our
> power. Maybe our demand will increase the cost of power in the West if not
> the US. Why not? That's a free market. Let them build nuclear plants
> somewhere else if they're as good as others think. We'll buy that power off
> the power grid.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.advocacy) via:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
******************************
