Linux-Advocacy Digest #29, Volume #31 Sat, 23 Dec 00 03:13:04 EST
Contents:
Re: Windows - Is It Really Easier to Use? (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: What's the sed line mean? (Craig Kelley)
Re: Windows review (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: This group should rename itself (Terry Porter)
Re: Looks kike Linux is taking the lead! (Craig Kelley)
Re: Red hat becoming illegal? ("Tom Wilson")
Re: Sun Microsystems and the end of Open Source (Shane Phelps)
Re: A Microsoft exodus! ("Tom Wilson")
Re: Red hat becoming illegal? (The Ghost In The Machine)
Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever ("Tom Wilson")
Re: This group should rename itself ("Donn Miller")
Re: Which retail Linux distribution is best? (maximus)
Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied. (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Conclusion (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Uptimes (T. Max Devlin)
Re: Which retail Linux distribution is best? (J Sloan)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Subject: Re: Windows - Is It Really Easier to Use?
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 06:11:53 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 15:33:31 -0500
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>Bracy wrote:
>>
>> I wasn't saying that you advocate Windows.
>>
>> I was just more than a little angered by your characterizing
>> my knowledge and experience as merely "pointing and clicking."
>> Windows is a quirky OS, and isn't all that easy to support -- it isn't
>> stable, it isn't secure, and the average Windows user has the
>> intelligence level of a slug.
>>
>> There was a time when a DOS/Windows user had a better
>> understanding of computers than a Macintosh user, but those days
>> are gone.
>
>
>The point is...LoseDOS doesn't let you do anything other than
>point and click. ANYTHING you do is merely a matter of hoping
>that what you want is available on a menu...somewhere.
>
>And if it's not...you're screwed.
Just as a point of pedantry: DOS was (and presumably still is,
if one can find it!) CLI-based [*]. Of course, Windows is more or
less sitting on top of it (and it's a strange marriage since DOS
knows about Windows as well).
But you're right -- if one wants to go outside the garden
path in Windows, one's screwed. :-)
[.sigsnip]
[*] Andraw Schullman mentions that the "It is now safe to turn
off your computer" allowed a "MODE CO80" to be typed in
(blindly) and then one is sitting in the familiar (to
those who've used it, anyway) 'C>' prompt.
I don't think that works anymore, though.
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
up 87 days, 12:17, running Linux.
------------------------------
From: Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What's the sed line mean?
Date: 22 Dec 2000 23:12:19 -0700
G.P. Hwang <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Yeah,thank you very much.
> Through your explanation and man pages I had myself understood. ;-)
> Ehh,can you tell me why you change sed/awk to perl? I have not any
> idea of perl for I doesn't ever use it.
Perl can do everything awk and sed do, in a less obfuscated manner,
*plus* so much more. If you're curious, this is the best book (in
english) on perl:
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/pperl3/
Or, you can type 'man perl' to dig right in.
--
The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt,comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux
Subject: Re: Windows review
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 06:14:58 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Colin R. Day
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 22:19:50 -0500
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
>
>>
>> Oh, right, like this proves anything.
>>
>> TeX is an excellent -- I'm not quite sure what to call it,
>> because it's basically a converter that takes a textual
>> description of a document (with lots of dollar signs, backslashes,
>> and braces :-) ) and generates a device-independent file which
>> can be interpreted by lots of things, among them dvips and
>> xdvi (the first for printing, the second for viewing).
>> Reminiscent of troff, albeit more capable and the format
>> is more portable.
>>
>> It's the best typesetter of equations I know of, but it's
>> certainly not a word processor in the usual sense of
>> being able to type in a GUI and WYSIWYMGIYL (What You See
>> Is What You Might Get If You're Lucky) [*].
>>
>> Its main drawback -- which probably has been addressed by now --
>> is that it can't include pictures; the simplest way around
>> that is to draw the pictures separately using xfig, then
>> run the paper through twice.
>>
>
>Read the LATeX Graphical Companion for capabilities. One can
>typeset textbook-quality graphs, which is important to me, as I
>teach math.
Indeed. :-)
>
>Colin Day
>
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
up 87 days, 12:26, running Linux.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Terry Porter)
Subject: Re: This group should rename itself
Reply-To: No-Spam
Date: 23 Dec 2000 06:10:26 GMT
On Sat, 23 Dec 2000 00:48:54 GMT,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Dec 2000 22:11:55 +0000, Pete Goodwin
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>>Besides, if I really thought Linux sucked, why am I using it right now?
>
>I dunno, you're stupid (only kidding) <BG>!
Hahahahahah!!
Very good one,
"Steve/Mike/Heather/Simon/teknite/keymaster/keys88/Sewer Rat/
S/Sponge/Sarek/piddy/McSwain/pickle_pete/Ishmeal_hafizi/
Syphon/Proculous/Tiberious/Amy/Jerry_Butler/Wobbles/wazzoo/
Tim Palmer/BklynBoy/susie_wong/leg log/bison/deadpenguin/
clair_lynn/Swango/flatfish++++"
>
>Actually i suspect you are using it for the same reasons many people
>"use" it:
>
>1. Using something different for a change is exciting.
Not for those afraid of change ... Wintrols like you for instance.
>2. It allows you that control factor over your system that you once
>had when you ran DOS.
It allows us *total* control.
>3. It is powerful.
Agreed
>4. It is a novelty and is very different from Windows.
No, Windows is the novelty, Unix has been around since 1972.
>5. You are hoping that you can someday replace Windows with Linux and
>are betting that this release is "the one".
I replaced Windows with Linux in 1997, and I havent used Windows since then.
>6. You have convinced yourself that Linux "is" better than Windows for
>what you do.
Incorrect, Linux and the huge range of applications convinced me.
> In some cases this may be true but, I suspect that if you
>take an honest look at what you have to go through just to run Linux
>(ie: how often are you adjusting things like fonts and so forth?) you
>will find that Windows is a far better choice.
Your totally off base as usual Troll.
>
>How many hoops or sacrifices do you have to put up with to run Linux
>Pete?
Why ask a fellow Wintroll, *this* question ?
>
>Can you honestly say that reading mail, surfing the net, playing
>video/audio viewing images, word processing etc is easier and superior
>under Linux not counting cost?
Yes, and when you count the $cost, thats the icing on the cake.
>
>I can't and it isn't even close. The Linux applications look like
>crude toys next to the Windows equivalents and that is assuming they
>even work, which many of them don't.
Another generic generalisation from the Wintroll.
>
>Is Linux "really" better for you Pete, or are you trying to convince
>yourself that it is?
Goodwin is a Wintroll Like you, is this a good troll, bad troll session ?
>
>
>
>
>Flatfish
>Why do they call it a flatfish?
>Remove the ++++ to reply.
--
Kind Regards
Terry
--
**** ****
My Desktop is powered by GNU/Linux, and has been
up 3 days 15 hours 53 minutes
** Registration Number: 103931, http://counter.li.org **
------------------------------
From: Craig Kelley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Looks kike Linux is taking the lead!
Date: 22 Dec 2000 23:18:16 -0700
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (.) writes:
> Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Whistler Beta 1 is quite stable.
>
> I especially love those cute mouseovers all over the GUI.
>
> No seriously, thats nessesary.
Yep, just like all the mouse-overs that are required by some unwritten
perverse law for commercial websites. It was cute 3 years ago, it's
annoying now (ditto with mouse-over popup menus and most every other
use of mouse-over).
--
The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
------------------------------
From: "Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Red hat becoming illegal?
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 06:23:24 GMT
"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Said Tom Wilson in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 04 Dec 2000 05:42:26
> [...]
> >Rush is loud, obnoxious, pompous, opinionated and , more often than not,
> >absolutely right in what he says.
>
> Think harder.
Drop dead.
------------------------------
From: Shane Phelps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Sun Microsystems and the end of Open Source
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 17:44:40 +1100
"Chad C. Mulligan" wrote:
>
> "Nick Condon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > "Chad C. Mulligan" wrote:
> >
> > > > Also, the "Free" in Free Software doesn't primarily refer to
> > > > money bu to sourcecode. Then you can do all the source auditing
> > > > out want. Infact, one of the BSDs is geared specifically with
> > > > that in mind.
> > > >
> > >
> > > So you would pay for a freebie?
> >
> > Many people do just that. The Free Software Foundation has been selling
> > free-software compilations for nearly 20 years. If you speak French think
> > "libre" rather than "gratis". In English think "free country", not "free
> > lunch".
> >
>
> So much for lower up front costs. There goes TCO even further up for Linux.
I'm going to call you (and other TCO claimants) on this one, Chad!
I keep seeing lots of claims from assorted quarters that System X has
much lower TCO than System Y (where X and Y are arbitrary OSen, and
are often reversed) but the hard data never seem to surface.
Please don't use MS's NT vs Linux pages as a reference - they were
derived from *old* NT vs SPARC/Solaris figures, then Linux was
substitied for Solaris.
http://www.microsoft.com/NTServer/nts/exec/Compares/LowerTCO.asp
I have my own TCO figures from client sites, so I have a pretty good
feel for ongoing support requirements of comparable systems for a
range of user types and functionality. TCO is like any other type
of statistic or benchmark. It can be fiddled to give the results
you want. BTW, lost user productivity of downtime rarely seems to appear
in published TCO figures.
FWIW, the bulk of real world TCO is in the ongoing support, and
depends very heavily on stability, ease of installation and ease of
remote management as it scales beyond trivial numbers of users,
boxen and sites.
------------------------------
From: "Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.unix.advocacy
Subject: Re: A Microsoft exodus!
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 06:52:48 GMT
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:mia%5.12374$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Tom Wilson writes:
>
> >>> Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
>
> >>>> I wrote:
>
> >>>>> Tom Wilson writes:
>
> >>>>>> Aaron R. Kulkis wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> I wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>> Steve Mading writes:
>
> >>>>>>>>>> My statement wasn't applied to "at the time". I'm talking
about
> >>>>>>>>>> now.
>
> >>>>>>>>> You didn't say so.
>
> >>>>>>>> I shouldn't need to say so for those who understand context.
>
> >>>>>>>>> (See I can be a pendantic pain too. Your game is fun.)
>
> >>>>>>>> You're erroneously presupposing that I'm playing a game, Steve.
>
> >>>>>>> Tholen...
> >>>>>>> when you finally realize how utterly worthless your life is...
> >>>>>>> remember to slit lengthwise.
>
> >>>>>> .....Along the femoral artery. It's quicker that way.
>
> >>>>> Desperate for attention, eh Tom?
>
> >>> Nah, desparate for a recursive twit filter..
>
> >> So it can ultimately work on you?
>
> > ....for me.
>
> That's not what I wrote. Suffering from reading comprehension problems
> as well, Tom
>
> >>>> Goddamn, Tholen... somebody offers you clever and helpful advice,
> >>>> and you insult him in return.
> >>>>
> >>>> What a fucking ingrate you are.
>
> >>> And, to think I was going to add that he do it in a hot bath so as
> >>> not to cause himself undue pain...
>
> >> Desperate for attention, eh Tom?
>
> > No, merely in need of your keen wisdom.
>
> Then pay attention, Tom.
Easier said than done as this is boring me to tears.
>
> >>> You wound me, Tholen.
>
> >> Illogical, Tom.
>
> > Sarcasm, Tholen.
>
> Your sarcasm is illogical, Tom.
Your pontification is amusing.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To:
alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy,us.military.army
Subject: Re: Red hat becoming illegal?
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 07:02:09 GMT
In alt.destroy.microsoft, billh
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Sat, 23 Dec 2000 06:07:28 GMT
<AiX06.6183$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>"The Ghost In The Machine"
>
>
>
>> [3] How is Aaron a wanna-be war hero? Did he post that he wanted
>> to lead a platoon of soldiers onto a beach or something?
>> Did he post that he DID lead a platoon of soldiers onto
>> a beach -- Normandy? Grenada? Kuwait? -- or something?
>> (Do I really care? Not all that much.)
>
>Then why ask the first question above?
Mostly out of curiosity, I guess. :-)
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random curiosity here
up 87 days, 13:13, running Linux.
------------------------------
From: "Tom Wilson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy
Subject: Re: Windoze 2000 - just as shitty as ever
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 07:11:43 GMT
"Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Tom Wilson wrote:
> >
> > "The Ghost In The Machine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in
> > message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Followup-To:
> > >
> > > In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > wrote
> > > on Wed, 06 Dec 2000 19:04:24 -0500
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > > >Tom Wilson wrote:
> > >
> > > [snip]
> > >
> > > >> Are we talking about a false dialog being left on the server
console or
> > a
> > > >> workstation or are we talking about physically pre-empting the
logiin
> > > >> sequence with a trojan?
> > > >
> > > >Oooooooops, Funkendolt never even considered the first possibility.
> > >
> > > One could in theory emulate the actual three-netry login widget
> > > of an NT box; the naive user might get suckered, but the slightly
> > > more knowledgable (or lucky) one would hit CTRL-ALT-DEL and get --
> > > the six-button session manager. Whoops!
> >
> > Actually, I thought of emulating the password dialog and, after
collecting a
> > password, violating some memory to cause a BSOD. As for the C-A-D, just
> > trigger the BSOD the very moment it detects any one of those keys
register a
> > press. There's a chance it might work.
> >
> > Anyway, I'm busting my ass on code that makes money, rather than
mischief.
> > My gal scored a platinum necklace with a diamond and sapphire pendant
for
> > Xmas which makes me rather in need of the cash <g>
>
> If *she* scored it...why do *you* need cash?
My wallet is the ball we're playing the game with.
>
> I suggest your start reading alt.seduction.fast so that you never
> find yourself in such a predicament again.
What I need to do is to hang around alt.onenight.stands.
A lot less trouble...
--
Tom Wilson
Sunbelt Software Solutions
Where White Slavery is Alive and Well
------------------------------
From: "Donn Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: This group should rename itself
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 02:18:39 -0500
"Pete Goodwin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:HMw06.2473$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> I get angry when I see distortions or misrepresentations of the truth
> portrayed as fact. Like "Windows crashes every two or three hours", like
> that was some kind of absolute truth. Maybe it does for you, but it sure
as
> hell doesn't for me!
The problem with Windows is that it's really fickle. I've gotten uptimes
longer than a day, as long as I stay away from the heavy stuff. When I used
to use Cygwin extensively, Windows 98 would go down in one hour mostly.
Windows 98/95 seems to have these "weak spots" such that when you hit them
just right, it goes down. Linux probably doesn't have as many weak spots as
Windows, and they're probably not as "tender" as Windows.
But then, what do you mean by "Windows"? We assume it's 95/98/ME unless you
specifically state NT or 2000, correct? I acknowledge that 2000 is a pretty
stable operating system. But even if I could get my hands on 2000 for free,
I would still choose FreeBSD or Linux. I find I can accomplish more with
unix variants, since I can make use of their tools, like awk, sed, perl, sh
for pretty much everything, even web page design. You can put a unix CLI
command shell on Windows 98 or NT, like bash or ash, but Windows just
doesn't lend itself to CLI as well as unix. Unix was born for shell tools
like grep, sed, awk, perl, etc, and although you can have these on Windows,
they don't seem as comfortable as on unix. But, I suppose Windows is nicer
for purely browsing the web, multimedia, games, etc. I will acknowledge
that.
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
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======= Over 80,000 Newsgroups = 16 Different Servers! ======
------------------------------
From: maximus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Which retail Linux distribution is best?
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 07:09:36 GMT
Thanks J Sloan, that's the best advice I've received yet. Very kind of
you. If I read between the lines a bit, I think (without putting words
in your mouth) that you are saying that Caldera and Mandrake are (at
this point) best for the client side and Red Hat is super for the
server side. Sounds like you think SUSE is an excellent choice (not
sure if it fits better for destop or server) as well. Correct me if I'm
wrong but I think you are saying that picking either Red Hat (or
perhaps Mandrake), the bottom line is that support (via nr of users)
would be better.
Newbie question? If you were a newbie now, would U pick Red Hat or what
would U recommend? Again, just asking for an informed opinion (no
obligation). Best Regards.
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> maximus wrote:
>
> > I must confess that I am a Linux neophyte (sorry). Started looking
> > into it about a year ago but.... I am now interested in beginning to
> > use and support the Linux/Open source movement again. I looked at
the
> > software shelves today and found numerous commercial versions of
Linux.
> > Must more than before. Suse, Mandrake, Red Hat and others. I am
curious
> > if anyone has any advice on which of these distributions would be
> > better (or worse).
>
> It all depends on what you want - I started with Slack, but
> have been running Red Hat since about '97. I've looked at
> Caldera, TurboLinux, SuSE Mandrake, but keep coming back
> to Red Hat. Mandrake looks pretty good for desktop use, as
> is Caldera - but in the server arena, Red Hat is in the lead.
>
> I do everything using Red Hat Linux - my servers at work
> are Red Hat, my home systems are Red Hat, I do consulting
> for other clients who are using Red Hat.
>
> I use my system for web browsing, homework assignments,
> online gaming (mainly quake 3 arena), and it is also my
> firewall, mail server, ftp, web and dns server. My experience
> with it has been good. Not to say there's been no problems,
> but I've eventually gotten past all of them. All in all, Linux has
> given me less grief than other OSes I've used - and that
> includes windows, mac, freebsd, hp-ux, solaris, and Irix.
>
> > I would like to initially have a dual boot system,
> > however, the comments on the boxes were very vaque on whether or not
> > they had that feature built in.
>
> Any Linux I've ever seen includes lilo or boot magic or
> something of the like to allow dual booting, that's standard.
>
> > The latest kernel (although one had a
> > beta of 2.4) in these packages seemed be 2.2.17/18. I believe 2.4 is
> > coming out soon
>
> Caldera, Red Hat and Mandrake all have 2.4 previews available.
>
> > (don't know how 2.3 was skipped?.
>
> 2.3 was not skipped, it has been under construction for
> many months and is what will become 2.4 - odd numbers
> (e.g. 1.1, 1.3, 2.1, 2,3) are "developer-only" releases, which
> when ready to ship, transition to "stable" releases, e.g.
> 1.2, 2.0, 2.2, 2,4. When 2.4 ships, the 2.5 development tree
> gets underway, and when 2.5 is ready to ship, it becomes 2.6
> (or possibly 3.0, if the changes are deemed significant)
>
> Bottom Line:
>
> If you go with Red Hat, you'll have a lot of company, and
> a lot of people who are running the same thing.
>
> Mandrake is also very popular. It originally started out
> as Red Hat + better GUI, but they've been developing
> their own tools and innovations and are coming into their
> own, so to speak.
>
> Pick one of those 2, and you'll be fairly safe.
>
> Caldera is decent, not as many users, and Suse is the
> favorite in Europe. SuSE is great in that it's very thorough
> and comes with just about everything but the kitchen sink.
>
> Hope this helps -
>
> jjs
>
>
--
"Strength and Honor"
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: New to Linux, and I am not satisfied.
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 02:19:49 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Bob Hauck in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Tue, 19 Dec 2000 17:03:55
GMT;
>On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 02:41:11 -0500, T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>Does anyone know of a good news provider? I think all the good ones
>>(Deja, Supernews, etc) have all "gone web", and while they might offer
>
>I used to run a small ISP. We finally had to give up on doing Usenet
>ourselves because it just became too much of a drain on resources. We
>contracted with RemarQ (aka Supernews), and that worked out quite well.
>You might suggest this to your "small town" ISP.
I'm at the point where, if that's what a small town ISP uses, I want to
use that. I would hope that I could find it somewhere for commodity
rates. I should be using Linux soon, so getting a 'full feed' would be
feasible, but I'm not going to pay out the wazoo for an overly
commercialized service like 'RemarQ'.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
http://www2.PetitionOnline.com/dejanews/petition.html
====== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ======
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------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Conclusion
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 02:19:51 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Chad C. Mulligan in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Fri, 22 Dec 2000
>"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> Said Chad C. Mulligan in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Tue, 19 Dec 2000
>> 02:08:59 GMT;
>> >
>> >"T. Max Devlin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
>> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>> >> Said Chad C. Mulligan in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Sun, 17 Dec 2000
>> >> [...]
>> >> >The essence remains a properly administered NT system is as stable as any
>> >> >UNIX. At this time getting the proper administration skills to the system
>> >> >when they are needed is the problem.
>> >>
>> >> Bullshit.
>> >
>> >Same to you.
>>
>> The real world is a bit more unforgiving of monopoly crapware than you
>> are. I have to deal with monopoly crapware, too, you're right about
>> that. But I'm not dumb enough to buy that load of bullshit about NT
>> being stable, except for 'proper administration'. Its nothing but
>> hindsight bias.
>
>Only through your eyes.
According to you. According to me, through any reasonable and informed
person's eyes. Your ball.
>Sorry that you have problems, be specific maybe we
>can solve them for you.
It is not a problem that other people can raise post-modernistic
arguments from ignorance in order to insist that my position encompasses
only my opinion; it is merely a fact of life. Your ball.
>Call it a learning experience.
I call everything a learning experience. You are still mistaken, so
perhaps you should do the same, in this case. Your ball.
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
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------------------------------
From: T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Uptimes
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 02:19:44 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Said Chad C. Mulligan in comp.os.linux.advocacy on Thu, 21 Dec 2000
>"sfcybear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
[...]
>> When chad actualy posts some documentation that supports any of his
>> "opinions" I'll think about posting some evidance of his BS. Untill
>> then:
>>
>> My opinion is that W2K is *NOT* stable. Evidance of this is at
>>
>> www.netcraft.com
>> www.uptimes.org
>
>Still dancing with bogus numbers eh?
They're perfectly valid, whether you understand them or not.
>> What documentation has chad posted that supports his "opinion"?
>
>Many others have posted corroborating evidence that my opinions were, on the
>whole, more accurate than yours anyway.
So others are clueless, too. That's not what is meant by "corroborating
evidence".
--
T. Max Devlin
*** The best way to convince another is
to state your case moderately and
accurately. - Benjamin Franklin ***
Sign the petition and keep Deja's archive alive!
http://www2.PetitionOnline.com/dejanews/petition.html
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------------------------------
From: J Sloan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Which retail Linux distribution is best?
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 07:39:53 GMT
maximus wrote:
> Thanks J Sloan, that's the best advice I've received yet. Very kind of
> you. If I read between the lines a bit, I think (without putting words
> in your mouth) that you are saying that Caldera and Mandrake are (at
> this point) best for the client side and Red Hat is super for the
> server side. Sounds like you think SUSE is an excellent choice (not
> sure if it fits better for destop or server) as well. Correct me if I'm
> wrong but I think you are saying that picking either Red Hat (or
> perhaps Mandrake), the bottom line is that support (via nr of users)
> would be better.
Red Hat is by far the most popular, so yes. Mandrake is
about as popular on the desktop, but Red Hat is far more
popular on the server. There are some die hard slack or
debian admins out there, but the industry recognizes Red
Hat as the leader.
> Newbie question? If you were a newbie now, would U pick Red Hat or what
> would U recommend? Again, just asking for an informed opinion (no
> obligation). Best Regards.
I would probably pick a preinstalled Linux system from VA -
It's hard to remember, but I would probably still go with Red
Hat or Mandrake. However, Caldera, Suse are not bad at all.
Also, as a newbie I would avoid debian or rock.
The most important thing in saving yourself some frustration
is to make sure you have good hardware for Linux. That's
getting a lot easier than it was, but you still have to be careful
since there are some vendors who care only about the mass
market, only want to deal with one OS, and that OS is windows.
That may mean getting a new video, sound or network card.
My current hardware?
@home:
clone system made of -
asus motherboard
amd k6-2 450
SB live sound card
voodoo 3 2000 video card
2 realtek 8139 10/100 network cards
@work:
HP Vectra system
Pentium II 300
SB 128 sound card
Voodoo 3 2000 video card
IBM pci token ring network card
Both systems are completely stable in all situations.
jjs
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