Linux-Advocacy Digest #656, Volume #31 Mon, 22 Jan 01 16:13:03 EST
Contents:
Re: The real truth about NT (Nico Coetzee)
Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Games? Who cares about games? ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software (.)
Re: I am preparing to teach a Linux class and I am soliciting advice (webbgroup)
Re: Games? Who cares about games? (WesTralia)
Re: New Microsoft Ad :-) ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Poor Linux ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Loki has trouble playiong their own games under Linux!!!!! (Donovan Rebbechi)
Re: Win2k vs Linux? Why downgrade to Linux? ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:00:42 +0200
From: Nico Coetzee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: The real truth about NT
"Rob S. Wolfram" wrote:
>
> Erik Funkenbusch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >"Peter Köhlmann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> >> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> >> > > Very few people mastering CD's outside of the sort of enviroment
> >> > > where there would be a special machine dedicated to the purpose
> >> > > stress machines to the level where it should be an issue.
> >> >
> >> > Just kick of a kernel compile.
> >> >
> >> Well, just to try out if my SCSI-only system would stand the strain, I did
> >> exactly that -- I made a CD AND did a kernel recompile while at the same
> >> time browsing the net.
> >
> >The key word here is SCSI. Most people burn IDE CD-R's (and those are the
> >ones they burn coasters on when heavy disk activity causes them to get a
> >buffer underrun)
>
> OK, this is quite a late reply, but I had to wait for the opportunity to
> prove you wrong. Here goes.
> I placed an extra disk on *the same* IDE bus as the writer (the
> secondary bus). So I started wrting the CD at 8 speed (iso image is on
> the second disk) and kicked off a kernel compile on that same disk. And
> even though these things don't take that long on a PIII 650, I thought
> I'll pass my time with a game of FreeCell. No, not the Gnome Freecell,
> but the Native Win'98 Freecell in a VMWare session. The Win 98 disk is
> a virual disk image on, again, the second disk.
> A screendump (96kB) of this process can be viewed at:
>
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~rsw/images/vmware+cdrecord+make-kpkg.gif
>
> (Those who understand it will see in the rightmost rxvt that the writer
> and the "current" disk are both on the same IDE channel (/dev/hdc and
> /dev/hdd respectively)). About 3 minutes after I made that screendump,
> I had a newly compiled kernel package and a working CDR:
>
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~rsw/images/vmware+cdrecord+make-kpkg2.gif
>
> I take it that someone can do the same experiment on W2K and show us the
> screendumps? (And before anyone starts shouting out loud, the answer is:
> "Yes, the `cdrecord` process runs with root privileges". And for the
> really Linux impaired, the SCSI messages just mean that this Linux
> kernel uses SCSI emulation for IDE ATAPI devices (kernel parameter
> CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDESCSI). The system also has a real 2940 adapter, but
> that has just a DAT-3 drive connected.)
>
> Cheers,
> Rob
> --
> Rob S. Wolfram <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> OpenPGP key 0xD61A655D
> 145 = 1! + 4! + 5!
It will indeed be interesting to see a similar thing on Windoze ;)
--
=========================================================
This signature was added automatically by Linux:
.
The fact that it works is immaterial.
-- L. Ogborn
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:24:15 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Said [EMAIL PROTECTED] in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 22 Jan
>>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Said [EMAIL PROTECTED] in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 21 Jan
>>>>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>>>> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>
>>> This is a convention, not a rule of routing or the IP protocol.
>>
>>It is not a convention. Look up the appropriate RFC's. The private IP
>>address ranges should never appear on the Internet.
>
> That's what we call a convention. Notice the "should". Where as,
> 0.0.0.0, and 127.0.0.1 *cannot* appear on the Internet. Get it?
I 'should' have said must. Now tell me why '0.0.0.0, and 127.0.0.1
*cannot* appear on the Internet'? It just takes a misconfigured router.
There is nothing magical about these addresses. You really are clueless.
>>>>You clearly have no understanding
>>>>of Internet routing and firewalls.
>>>
>>> To be modest, my knowledge and understanding literally dwarfs your own.
>>
>>Crap. You have no idea what you are talking about.
>
> Oops.
>
> [...]
>>Yes NAT is independant of how a firewall implements a security policy.
>>However most if not all firewalls implement NAT as it is the logical
>>place to do so.
>
> I think you mean "this is an available feature in most firewall
> products". Whether a firewall implements NAT is not as trivial a matter
> to guess. But you can generally tell those enterprises which attempt to
> use NAT to 'secure their network', as they are the ones with slow
> performance and intermittent connectivity.
Again you just don't know what you are talking about. NAT is essential
if you are using private addresses on your Intranet. For sure NAT is an
overhead and you scale your firewall performance appropriately.
>>>>They use PAT to translate many internal addresses to a single
>>>>external routable address.
>>>
>>> Indeed; Proxy Address Translation.
>>
>>Now you are showing your ignorance. PAT is not Proxy address translation,
>>whatever that might be.
>
> Oops. You caught me. I certainly don't know what *you* are talking
> about. Forgive me if I point out that, this little bluff aside, I *do*
> know what *I'm* talking about. Which is to say I will figure out what
> you're talking about, eventually, though I'm not at all sure the reverse
> is true.
Max it is quite clear you do not know what you are talking about.
At what level in the OSI stack would you place ethernet, IP, TCP, ftp
for example? I'm sure you cannot answer this. Proxies work at the
application layer (7) to give you a little help.
>>PAT is port address translation often also called
>>hide address translation. When you do many to one NAT you have to have
>>some method of knowing which packet belongs to which connection. Doing
>>port translation allows this. Nothing to do with proxies which work at
>>the application layer.
>
> Don't move! You've just stepped on a land mine. Carefully, without
> bending over, pretend you never said "the application layer".
This is just too stupid to believe. Your credibility has just dropped to
zero. For example, squid is a proxy. Pray tell me what layer in the OSI
stack does squid function?
>>>>The good
>>>>firewalls also allow 1 to 1 NAT.
>>>
>>> No, a "good" firewall will leave NAT up to a NAT system, just as a NAT
>>> leaves firewalling up to the firewall. Sure, in theory we could munge
>>> all these things together. Have fun; its too braindead an idea for me
>>> to waste my time on, personally.
>>
>>Grief, have you ever administered a firewall? Every firewall I have
>>worked with, it is my job by the way, provides NAT facilities.
>
> Again, I'm still not sure what you're saying by "provides NAT
> facilities". Are you saying you used them? Or they were a feature on
> the box? If you have indeed used them on "every firewall" (or even if
> you say they all have them), then apparently it is your experience, not
> mine, which is limited, as this proves you can't have ever touched a
> firewall before 1998.
Listen I administer several checkpoint fw-1's, Sun's sunscreens and
a couple of tuxscreens (don't know what that is do you?). I have
administered firewalls for 4 years and been a Unix system administrator
for over 12 years. Be so kind to tell us what experience you have in
this area. Do you understand what NAT is? From what you have said I
don't think so.
>>>>MAC addresses are used to send the packet
>>>>to the next hop on its route.
>>>
>>> Yes, MAC addresses are used to *transmit* the *frame*, containing the
>>> packet, to the receiver. Note that whether the receiver is "the next
>>> hop on its route" is one of those rules that you should fuck around with
>>> lightly. The rule is, "you don't know, you can't know, and it doesn't
>>> matter." Because routing doesn't have anything to do with
>>> transmissions. So MAC addresses don't have anything to do with packets.
>>
>>You really don't have a clue. The above paragragh is gibberish. Please
>>read the book you say you have and build a test network to see how it
>>really works.
>
> Listen, lamer. I'm trying to keep my peace and keep my temper, here,
> but you're starting to get on my nerves. Don't make me flame you to
> crispy critters, butter-cakes. I've been explaining this stuff
> professionally for about seven years now, solid. If you didn't quite
> get it the first time, don't blame me.
I just don't believe a word of this. You are sounding more and more
like the wintrolls on this list. It is clear you have little or no
knowledge / experience with regard to IP networking and firewalls in
particular.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:19:33 GMT
On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:24:15 +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>Max it is quite clear you do not know what you are talking about.
>At what level in the OSI stack would you place ethernet, IP, TCP, ftp
>for example? I'm sure you cannot answer this. Proxies work at the
>application layer (7) to give you a little help.
I'm not Max (thank God), but I believe IP and TCP would go in Level 5,
which is the session layer.
I agree with what you are saying here.
Flatfish
Why do they call it a flatfish?
Remove the ++++ to reply.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Games? Who cares about games?
Date: 22 Jan 2001 14:29:24 -0500
mlw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I don't know anyone that really plays games on their computers. is
> that out of the ordinary? When people mention games as an issue, I
> often wonder why.
They're essential for penetrating the
"more-time-on-my-hands-than-.advocacy-groups-can-kill" market niche.
--
Bruce R. Lewis http://brl.sourceforge.net/
I rarely read mail sent to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.)
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft
Subject: Re: NT is Most Vulnerable Server Software
Date: 22 Jan 2001 20:04:59 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> Said [EMAIL PROTECTED] in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 22 Jan
>>>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>>> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Said [EMAIL PROTECTED] in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 21 Jan
>>>>>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
>>>>> T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> This is a convention, not a rule of routing or the IP protocol.
>>>
>>>It is not a convention. Look up the appropriate RFC's. The private IP
>>>address ranges should never appear on the Internet.
>>
>> That's what we call a convention. Notice the "should". Where as,
>> 0.0.0.0, and 127.0.0.1 *cannot* appear on the Internet. Get it?
> I 'should' have said must. Now tell me why '0.0.0.0, and 127.0.0.1
> *cannot* appear on the Internet'? It just takes a misconfigured router.
> There is nothing magical about these addresses. You really are clueless.
Actually, there is. They are not routable, no router in the world, no matter
how misconfigured, will throw them out, unbridged to any other network, case
closed.
Sounds to me like youre the clueless one. You should be careful about what
you call people.
> Again you just don't know what you are talking about. NAT is essential
> if you are using private addresses on your Intranet. For sure NAT is an
> overhead and you scale your firewall performance appropriately.
Ummm...how exactly is NAT an overhead? How exactly do you scale your firewall
performance appropriately?
>> Oops. You caught me. I certainly don't know what *you* are talking
>> about. Forgive me if I point out that, this little bluff aside, I *do*
>> know what *I'm* talking about. Which is to say I will figure out what
>> you're talking about, eventually, though I'm not at all sure the reverse
>> is true.
> Max it is quite clear you do not know what you are talking about.
> At what level in the OSI stack would you place ethernet, IP, TCP, ftp
> for example? I'm sure you cannot answer this. Proxies work at the
> application layer (7) to give you a little help.
Maybe you need to read "TCP/IP Networking" again.
>> Again, I'm still not sure what you're saying by "provides NAT
>> facilities". Are you saying you used them? Or they were a feature on
>> the box? If you have indeed used them on "every firewall" (or even if
>> you say they all have them), then apparently it is your experience, not
>> mine, which is limited, as this proves you can't have ever touched a
>> firewall before 1998.
> Listen I administer several checkpoint fw-1's,
The second worst firewall this world has ever seen. (can you say UDP
denial?)
> Sun's sunscreens
The absolute worst.
> and
> a couple of tuxscreens
Unmentionable.
> (don't know what that is do you?). I have
> administered firewalls for 4 years and been a Unix system administrator
> for over 12 years.
Tell me, exactly why do you use firewalls instead of packet filtering at the
router?
> Be so kind to tell us what experience you have in
> this area. Do you understand what NAT is? From what you have said I
> don't think so.
By your experience, you should have known full well that the "internet" will
not believe a node advertising itself as 0.0.0.0
But you didnt. Something is amiss.
>>>> Yes, MAC addresses are used to *transmit* the *frame*, containing the
>>>> packet, to the receiver. Note that whether the receiver is "the next
>>>> hop on its route" is one of those rules that you should fuck around with
>>>> lightly. The rule is, "you don't know, you can't know, and it doesn't
>>>> matter." Because routing doesn't have anything to do with
>>>> transmissions. So MAC addresses don't have anything to do with packets.
>>>
>>>You really don't have a clue. The above paragragh is gibberish. Please
>>>read the book you say you have and build a test network to see how it
>>>really works.
>>
>> Listen, lamer. I'm trying to keep my peace and keep my temper, here,
>> but you're starting to get on my nerves. Don't make me flame you to
>> crispy critters, butter-cakes. I've been explaining this stuff
>> professionally for about seven years now, solid. If you didn't quite
>> get it the first time, don't blame me.
> I just don't believe a word of this. You are sounding more and more
> like the wintrolls on this list. It is clear you have little or no
> knowledge / experience with regard to IP networking and firewalls in
> particular.
Actually, it sounds like you know even less, mr 12 years of unix experience.
=====.
------------------------------
From: webbgroup <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux,comp.os.linux.questions,comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: I am preparing to teach a Linux class and I am soliciting advice
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:17:11 GMT
I am teaching a similar class internally for my company.
1.Target the audience. My audience aren't linux gurus, and most of them
are mostly familiar with Winbloze. Most of my 1 hour class is going to
be very general. What Linux looks like. What Gnome, KDE looks like.
Heck, here is the outline of my 1 hour speech
Introduction to Linux
1. History of Linux
I. Where did it come from?
II. Who invented it?
III. Well what does he do now?
IV. What does Juan Valdez have to do with Linux? (Or Lee-nuks vs. Lie –
nuks)
2. Purpose of Linux and the Linux Community
I. Us vs.Them
II. You mean to tell me I can sell dirt?
III. IBM vs. the Linux Community
3. But, I love MS Windows so much.
I. Gnome
II. KDE
III. Gee, Joel your so smart! How can I understand the file system
more? I am so used to MS Windows.
 /
 /etc
 /home
 /root
 /usr/local or /opt/
 lilo.conf
IV. What else is on the system that is similar to Windows?
See Insert.
V. Ok. But can Linux talk with other Windows machines?? Intro Samba
VI. But what about running windows applications on my Linux Box? Can’t
I do that??
Wine-
Vmware-
4. Linux Distributions
>From ftp://ftp.linuxberg.com/pub/distributions
Armed Sep 25 2000 05:27 Directory
BestLinux Dec 20 2000 20:17 Directory
Caldera-eDesktop Sep 25 2000 10:54 Directory
Caldera-eServer Sep 25 2000 11:46 Directory
Conectiva Dec 09 2000 11:17 Directory
Debian Jan 02 2001 19:49 Directory
LinuxPPC Oct 17 2000 17:48 Directory
LuteLinux Sep 25 2000 14:16 Directory
Mandrake Sep 25 2000 14:23 Directory
MkLinux Sep 25 2000 17:08 Directory
Netwinder Sep 25 2000 17:56 Directory
Peanut Jan 11 2001 06:25 Directory
PizzaBox Jan 16 2001 23:51 Directory
RedHat Jan 10 2001 13:22 Directory
Slackware Sep 26 2000 08:26 Directory
Stampede Dec 04 2000 12:59 Directory
Stormix Sep 26 2000 10:19 Directory
SuSE Sep 26 2000 10:42 Directory
TurboLinux Sep 26 2000 12:22 Directory
Woven Sep 26 2000 12:52 Directory
Yellowdog Jan 18 2001 06:23 Directory
mini Nov 22 2000 13:42 Directory
5. Linux Documentation Project
HTML How to Documents
Go to http://howto.tucows.com
Click on HOWTO on the sidebar
Click on HOWTO on the main page
Complete URL:
http://howto.tucows.com/LDP/HOWTO/HOWTO-INDEX-3.html#ss3.1
6. Review
 Robust
 Works great on crappy computers
 Free
 Can interact with Windows, Novell, Unix Systems
 OS Customizable
 GUI interaction customizable
 Clustering (used by NASA)
 New 2.4 Kernel
 Supports up to 64G RAM
 Full USB Support
In article <94gqn6$rmd$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Jeff Silverman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi. I am an experienced Linux/UNIX sysadmin and I am getting ready
to teach a class on Linux for
> the Communications Workers of America and WashTech. I am soliciting
comments and suggestions from
> people in the Linux community about what I ought to teach.
>
> The students will be adults with some computer experience, most
likely in MacOS or MS-Windows.
>
> I assume that I have to teach them the basics:
>
> 1) How to login and how to logout
> 2) File manipulation commands: cp, mv, rm, rmdir, ln, cat, more,
find, grep, sort, uniq. Also I/O
> redirection and pipelines
> 3) An editor. vi? emacs? Something else? No flame wars, please.
> 4) Minimal sysadmin stuff - assuming they are going to run their own
machines. Is that a reasonable
> assumption? Account management. Minimal security issues.
Networking (that's a mouthful).
>
> It gets more complicated... GUIs. Should I teach KDE? gnome? Motif?
>
> How about shell scripting?
>
> What do beginning users need to know?
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
> --
> Jeff Silverman, PC guy, Linux wannabe, Java wannabe, Software
engineer, husband, father etc.
> See my website: http://www.commercialventvac.com/~jeffs
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
^*
0 0 Happy Holidays!!
( V )
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: WesTralia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Games? Who cares about games?
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:34:58 -0600
mlw wrote:
>
> I don't know anyone that really plays games on their computers. is that out of
> the ordinary? When people mention games as an issue, I often wonder why.
>
> I have a Nintendo for games, why would I waste a computer on games?
If you have kids, then you have games on the computer. It's that
simple. I'm not a game player but the kids and neighborhood kids
are into it big time.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: New Microsoft Ad :-)
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:43:09 -0500
John & Susie wrote:
>
> Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
> >
> > "mlw" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/16139.html
> > >
> > > Did I read this correctly?
> > >
> > > Win2K: MTTF 2893 Hours? (120 days)
> > > NT: MTTF 919 Hours? (38 Days)
> > > Win98: MTTF 216 Hours (9 days)
> > >
>
> >
> > The test covers desktop environments, not servers. The average desktop *IS*
> > shutdown at night.
>
> Nonsense. If manufacturing is running 24/7, workstations and their users
> *will* be doing the same.
And if it's 24x7 ops, either one of two situations will be reality
1) If using a microsoft platform, they will have to work around
FREQUENT shutdowns
or
2) They can use a non-Microsoft system, and do TRUE 24x7 ops.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.linux.sux
Subject: Re: Poor Linux
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:45:18 -0500
Kyle Jacobs wrote:
>
> "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> > GAME
> > SET
> > MATCH.... jerkoff
>
> No comment.
translation: Kyle Jacobs acknowledges my victory over flat-head.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Donovan Rebbechi)
Subject: Re: Loki has trouble playiong their own games under Linux!!!!!
Date: 22 Jan 2001 20:49:05 GMT
On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:35:50 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:09:35 GMT, Jim Broughton
><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>> Why are you here?
>
>To counter the ridiculous propaganda that masquerades as fact around
>here concerning Linux as a viable desktop solution.
You can scream all you like about how it's not a "viable desktop solution"
but this is a lousy place to do so, because the fact is that for many
of the regulars in this group, Linux does just fine on the desktop.
--
Donovan Rebbechi * http://pegasus.rutgers.edu/~elflord/ *
elflord at panix dot com
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Win2k vs Linux? Why downgrade to Linux?
Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:48:51 -0500
Tom Wilson wrote:
>
> "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Tom Wilson wrote:
> > >
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > On 18 Jan 2001 04:48:21 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (.) wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >The first computer I laid hands on was around that time actually,
> > > > >and was a commodore PET. (I cant remember which model). We wrote
> > > > >BASIC programs that made little ascii rockets fly up the screen.
> > > >
> > > > Did you key in the Balloon Program from the Commodore System Guide
> > > > (the fat spiral bound book I forget it's name) ?
> > > >
> > > > Everyone did that one with all the sprites and things.
> > > > That was for the 64 though.
> > >
> > > The PET really didn't have anything like that as it was more primitive
> than
> > > even the VIC-20. The only thing being in the book, as I remember it, was
> > > instructions on how to use the built-in machine language monitor.There
> were
> > > a few ASCII shoot-em-up games and I recall a textual version of StarTrek
> > > being really popular. The funny thing is remembering how blown away you
> > > were the first time you saw something that "high-tech" <g>
> > >
> >
> > Ever play AppleTrek?
>
> A couple of frieinds in college used to play it. I never did as I was a bit
> of an anti-Apple snob. The only thing cool about them was that Super Bowl,
> Big Brother commercial. That my opinions of them have improved in recent
> years has more to do with an anti-Microsoft sentiment than anything.
The old Apple ][ and ][+ machines were pretty cool. Very open...easy to
get at the 8 card slots...even published the source code to the ROMS.
The complete antithesis of the early "sealed box" Macs.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
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