Linux-Advocacy Digest #556, Volume #33 Thu, 12 Apr 01 18:13:03 EDT
Contents:
Re: Blame it all on Microsoft ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Linux on Compaq...coming this Summer. (Anonymous)
Re: Blame it all on Microsoft (Jerry Coffin)
Re: Blame it all on Microsoft ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: lack of linux billionaires explained in one easy message (Anonymous)
Re: Blame it all on Microsoft ("Felger Carbon")
Re: t. max devlin: kook ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: Undeniable proof that Aaron R. Kulkis is a hypocrite, and a (The Ghost In The
Machine)
Re: t. max devlin: kook ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.theory,comp.arch,comp.object
Subject: Re: Blame it all on Microsoft
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 17:12:04 -0400
Craig Kelley wrote:
>
> Jerry Coffin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > says...
> >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> > > You needn't walk over all objects; only those that are candidates for
> > > losing scope; as soon as scope changes you only need to check those
> > > that are visible in the current scope; the same applies with
> > > intentional reference death, you only need to check the current
> > > reference and it's children. Yes, this does mean you could have to
> > > walk over all objects -- but more often it doesn't mean anything of
> > > the sort.
> >
> > True, but more or less irrelevant -- my point was that with (at least
> > most) GC systems, the time taken is related to the number living
> > objects, and generally a linear function. Using X as the number of
> > living objects, looking through .1 percent of the living objects is
> > obviously a lot faster than looking through all of them, but O(.001X)
> > is still identical to O(X). By contrast, with most manual systems,
> > we don't have any function of X at all -- we have a function of a
> > totally separate Y, which is the number of objects that have been
> > freed. IOW, we're trying to compare O(X) to O(Y), which is clearly
> > impossible without knowing something (quite a bit usually) about the
> > relationship between X and Y.
>
> Yes, and you can construct bad trees that require exponential time to
> search -- in reality it rarely happens [/me sticks his neck out on
> that assertation].
No....the worst-case tree is one that's completely unbalanced
R
\
*
/ \
*
/ \
*
/ \
*
/ \
*
/ \
*
/ \
*
/ \
where: the tree is constructed of
root R
null pointers / and \
and nodes / and \
* *
This worst-case tree has a LINEAR search time.
Best case tree has a logrithmic search time.
> If you view a program as a tree of objects,
> stemming from the root object, you would end up with a tree and not a
> list, albeit with circular references. Searching for the collectable
> objects would be a very small list of tree nodes that could possibly
> have expired, plus the _tree_ function dominating the rest of the
> algorithm.
>
> [aside: when I say 'references' I don't mean to imply reference
> counting]
>
> > > [i slipped up and used the term 'object' when i wanted to keep it
> > > generic; but it seems appropriate]
> >
> > In this sort of discussion, I generally use "object" in roughly the
> > way the C standard does -- basically just a piece of memory. Whether
> > what's stored in it is an instance of a class is basically
> > irrelevant; of course, when you're chasing pointers to find live
> > objects, it become relevant that you can identify pointers, but's
> > about it...
> >
> > > Probably true, but we heard the same things about high-level (and 4GL)
> > > languages back in the 80s and early 90s. People avoided C like the
> > > plauge because it was so slow at certain things; it could never be as
> > > fast has hand-crafted assembly. Today, it's difficult to beat the
> > > compiler with your own assembly code
> >
> > Actually, no it's not, at least in my experience. Both I, and quite
> > a few other denizens of comp.lang.asm.x86 routinely beat the best
> > compilers on the market with relative ease. It's often hard to
> > justify bothering, but usually fairly easy to do when there's a
> > reason.
>
> You're not the average programmer that I know then. :)
>
> > > -- and now people ususally use it
> > > in cases where they don't want the compiler to optimize away some
> > > special hardware property that they are accessing.
> >
> > Hmm...rarely much of an excuse, IMO. "volatile" will handle this at
> > least 90% of the time -- the problem there is that most people don't
> > know C well enough to know what volatile is or does.
> >
> > > Memory managment is a mundane task that will eventually be handled
> > > automatically every time, in every commonly-used language.
> >
> > It probably will eventually, but not anytime very soon. There are
> > just too many people who simply like feeling in control of things for
> > it to happen easily -- after all, Smalltalk's been using it for 25
> > years and Lisp for around 40, but Java's the first widely-used
> > language to use it for most purposes (though most BASICs have used it
> > for the string pool for quite a while).
>
> I think very soon it will happen. Microsoft is throwing their full
> weight behind Java^h^h^h^h C#, and they'll drag a bunch of developers
> kicking and screaming behind them.
>
> > > I think we're violently agreeing on this issue; I don't see GC as a
> > > bad thing in Java 2.0 -- it had some problems with Sun's Java 1.0 JVM
> > > to be sure,
> >
> > Of course -- _I'm_ the only person who can get things perfect the
> > first time! <GD&R>
> >
> > > but those were implementation issues coupled with too much
> > > beautiful architecture in the wrong places of the language (when was
> > > the last time you saw a garbage man wearing a dinner suit?).
> >
> > Oddly enough, quite recently. Of course he was taking his wife to
> > dinner at the time, not collecting garbage... <G>
>
> :)
>
> --
> It won't be long before the CPU is a card in a slot on your ATX videoboard
> Craig Kelley -- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.isu.edu/~kellcrai finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP block
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 15:20:37 -0600
From: Anonymous <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux on Compaq...coming this Summer.
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,soc.singles
t. max dumbass:
> Said Anonymous in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 9 Apr 2001 17:03:22
> >GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >> Joseph Ogiba wrote:
> >> >
> >> > This is the biggest bullshit story I ever heard. There is no demand from the
> >> > public for a PC with Linux instead of Windows.You Linux diehards have a bug
> >> > up your ass the size of Texas over the word MICROSOFT. If there was a demand
> >> > Larry Ellison would start a company selling PC's with your "FREE" OS.Your
> >> > just pissed because YOU paid $320.00 for one share of VA Linux and watched
> >> > it drop to $3.00 today. Linux is DEAD as a consumer OS and Windows XP is the
> >> > nail in the coffin.
> >>
> >> No different than you WinTroll diehards. When the great fanfare of the
> >> rollout of WindowsXp arrives into town like a cheap carnival will we
> >> know for sure if it really is all that it can be.
> >
> >i'm no more loyal to microsoft than i am to any other business. [...]
>
> Do you always defend a company's right to rip off their customers,
i defend a company's right to sell products on whatever terms they can
negotiate with vendors and consumers. if i as a consumer dislike those
terms i can take my business elsewhere.
however all things considered i consider windows to be a real bargain.
> then,
> and break the law?
the law, dear sir, is a beast.
jackie 'anakin' tokeman
men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth - more than ruin,
more even than death
- bertrand russell
------------------------------
From: Jerry Coffin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.theory,comp.arch,comp.object
Subject: Re: Blame it all on Microsoft
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 15:23:02 -0600
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
says...
[ ... ]
> Yes, and you can construct bad trees that require exponential time to
> search -- in reality it rarely happens [/me sticks his neck out on
> that assertation].
You're not really sticking it out very far -- testing with
generational scavengers seems to agree quite closely.
> If you view a program as a tree of objects,
> stemming from the root object, you would end up with a tree and not a
> list, albeit with circular references.
Which is to say that it's a graph, not a tree. A tree would be an
acyclic graph, where this is a more general graph that may contain
cycles.
> > Actually, no it's not, at least in my experience. Both I, and quite
> > a few other denizens of comp.lang.asm.x86 routinely beat the best
> > compilers on the market with relative ease. It's often hard to
> > justify bothering, but usually fairly easy to do when there's a
> > reason.
>
> You're not the average programmer that I know then. :)
Well, probably not. As it happens, my job leaves me with very little
choice but to work with assembly language on quite a regular basis,
and the optimizing part tends to be more an accidental by-product.
> I think very soon it will happen. Microsoft is throwing their full
> weight behind Java^h^h^h^h C#, and they'll drag a bunch of developers
> kicking and screaming behind them.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens. I wouldn't go
so far as to predict that C# will be a complete flop (that would be
just wishful thinking) but I'm not at all sure it's going to take
over the world anytime soon either. They're also pushing "managed
C++" (basically C++ with GC) but when you use this, you get only a
restricted subset of C++. Ultimately, you could be right: MS has
been more successful with more second-rate technology than I'd like,
and this might really do incredibly well. That certainly wouldn't be
all bad by any means, and my objections are NOT based to GC in either
case. At the same time, every time MS comes up with one of their
half-baked schemes (and I really think this qualifies) I'm skeptical
of its success.
--
Later,
Jerry.
The Universe is a figment of its own imagination.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.theory,comp.arch,comp.object
Subject: Re: Blame it all on Microsoft
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 17:17:00 -0400
Jonas wrote:
>
> > > You can tailor your own programs to work with MS Office and other MS
> Suites.
> >
> > It's obvious that you don't even understand the concept.
>
> Sure I do. It's something conceived in the mind. I noted that your a UNIX..
> whatever. Writing that as an end tail is noted. Windows has done a hell lot
> of more for computing through out the world then any highly priced UNIX
> system have done.
really. Name one piece of microsoft code that didn't originate
on Unix or Macintosh.
Accuracy counts, so be precise.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 15:30:29 -0600
From: Anonymous <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: lack of linux billionaires explained in one easy message
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,soc.singles
t. max dumbass:
> Said Anonymous in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 9 Apr 2001 12:33:29
> [...]
> >> So, what you're saying is that a large portion of the population is dumb as
> >> a post, if not dumber.
> >
> >no, i'm saying that hostility to consumer needs is a bug not a feature.
>
> No, 'hostility to consumer needs' is a smoke-screen for apologizing for
> the monopoly, not a supportable argument.
if microsoft were really a monopoly linux would not exist.
as to your hostility to consumer needs
you're soaking in it.
> >> You then go on to prove your own membership in this
> >> elite crew by listing some numbers and making the assumption that some of
> >> these numbers being higher than others determine which system is better, and
> >> that this entire post is somehow related to the ease of use.
> >
> >if the goal is to defeat microsoft and its emperor ease of use is job
> >one.
>
> Actually, preventing illegal activity is job one. There is no job two.
translation: linux cannot win in the free market so i am hoping the
jackbooted thugs will destroy the winner making way for the losers ie
linux headcases
> >if, on the other hand, you prefer to bitch and moan about the
> >ignorant endluzers who don't appreciate your brilliance, well
> >please do go on.
>
> Like you were? We don't do that.
are you claiming that linux users respect the majority of people who
prefer windows?
too funny!
> >just don't expect unix to get anywhere on the desktop anytime soon.
>
> I don't. Unless the federal court's decision comes anytime soon.
what was that you were saying about freedom of choice?
jackie 'anakin' tokeman
men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth - more than ruin,
more even than death
- bertrand russell
------------------------------
Reply-To: "Felger Carbon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Felger Carbon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.theory,comp.arch,comp.object
Subject: Re: Blame it all on Microsoft
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 13:11:51 -0700
Aaron R. Kulkis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Eric Smith wrote:
> >
> > Chad Everett wrote:
> > > Bill Gates and Paul Allen did it all.
> >
> > "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > > Considering that they're both a lying sacks of shit, caught red-handed
> > > committing perjury in Federal Court....let's just say that i don't
> > > trust a word they say.
> >
> > When do you claim that Paul Allen committed perjury?
>
> Every single Microsoft officer was cought in at least one lie.
Paul Allen has not been an officer of Microsoft for many, many years now.
Even granted that "every single officer", this does not include Paul Allen.
And you have not documented "every single officer".
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,soc.singles
Subject: Re: t. max devlin: kook
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 17:26:01 -0400
Anonymous wrote:
>
> t. max dumbass:
> > Said Anonymous in alt.destroy.microsoft on Mon, 9 Apr 2001 12:23:24
> > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chad Everett) wrote:
> > >> On Sun, 08 Apr 2001 13:24:32 -0700, GreyCloud <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >You're correct! I've watched new secretaries trying to learn point and
> > >> >click for the first time. Hand-eye-coordination training is needed.
> > >> >All newbies to windows have trouble in the beginning. And then real
> > >> >troubles later on when the crapware starts giving them fits.
> > >>
> > >> My good ol' Mom bought a Windows machine three years ago. She is the
> > >> newbie of all newbies. All Windows users end of being command
> > >> line users cause eventually they'll experience a crash or lockup
> > >> that requires an "untidy" Windows shutdown (unplug the machine
> > >> cause not even the "smart" power switch will work). Then,
> > >> when the machine is rebooting they get the commandline prompt
> > >> telling them about how Windows was shutdown is a "untidy" manner
> > >> and you have to tell it something about what you want the
> > >> system to do with these dangling file thing-a-ma-jigs it has found.
> > >> This is the point where I get the call cause my good ol' Mom has
> > >> no idea whatsoever about what she's being told and asked to make
> > >> a decision about. The inevitable question is: "Son, why did
> > >> the computer do this?" and the inevitable answer: Mom, it just
> > >> Windows".... and I get this call EVERY time this happens.
> > >
> > >thank you for proving my point
> >
> > You don't have a point.
>
> if you can't see it you aren't quite so clever as you think.
>
> > >> Real user-friendly GUI scenario for a newbie, eh?
> > >
> > >and that makes the case for linux... how exactly?
> >
> > Free market competitive development beats "whatever way whoever built
> > the proprietary crapware thinks is the right way."
>
> why, if that is the case, haven't the linuxoids trumped microsoft by
> completely eradicating the command line trauma so vividly described
> above? *
First, jackie, the Linux GUIs run circles around the Windows GUI.
Second...commandline trauma ain't nothing compared to the the
GUI-trauma of doing something (such as batch processing 50 documents)
by hand through a newbies-ONLY-oriented GUI.
> jackie 'anakin' tokeman
>
> * as you really aren't too bright i better spell this out:
>
> completely eradicating means that under no circumstance does the user
> ever face the command line, no matter what they want to accomplish
>
> men fear thought as they fear nothing else on earth - more than ruin,
> more even than death
> - bertrand russell
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (The Ghost In The Machine)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: Undeniable proof that Aaron R. Kulkis is a hypocrite, and a
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 21:39:41 GMT
In comp.os.linux.advocacy, Aaron R. Kulkis
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote
on Wed, 11 Apr 2001 13:59:21 -0400
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>WesTralia wrote:
>>
>> "Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>> >
>>
>> > One which has the full overhead of a function call, including
>> > the overhead of pushing the CPU state onto the stack, and
>> > recovering it at the end.
>> >
>>
>> "pushing the CPU state onto the stack"
>>
>> OK genius, explain what you mean!
>
>
>Pushing all data registers, pointers, and the program counter
>onto the stack.
>
>What did YOU think it means?
Pointers? What pointers?
That's tangential to storing the state of the micro during a context
switch or function call for later restore. A pointer is merely a
novel method of interpreting a number within a general register or
memory location as a memory address. (For that matter, a number is
merely a novel method of interpreting the bits within a general
register or memory address, and the bits within a general register
are a novel method of interpreting logic voltages, which are merely
novel methods of interpreting largish collections of electrons [*]:
1 pF = about 6,250,000 electrons per volt.)
Of course, one of the pieces of CPU state is the program counter.... :-)
OK, so I quibble.
Note also that a smart compiler won't push all registers onto the stack;
it would be kind of silly for a function such as:
foobar:
MOV 4(SP),R0 ; argument 1
ADD 8(SP),R0 ; argument 2
RET
assuming the micro has registers R0 through Rn, where R0 is used
to return values, a fairly typical backwards stack frame (push
= decrement then shove), and a 4-byte PC.
An even smarter compiler, of course, could inline the
function and perform constant folding, translating
A = foobar(1+2)
to
MOV #3,R5
assuming A was being held in R5 in that section of code (another
optimization of course is that a value needn't be stored immediately
into memory; modern compilers don't really need 'register' anymore :-)).
>
>
>> OUTED! LOL!
>
>Yes...I admit that I have a first-rate university-level education in
>computer systems engineering.
[.sigsnip]
[*] very old memories used small ferrule cores (hence the
term "core dump"). However, most modern computers, and
all consumer-grade PCs, use dynamically-refreshed memory
for the bulk of their RAM storage needs (there is some cache
which is most likely SRAM in various spots). I don't know
how many pF each transistor has sitting on its gate, though.
I do remember that the leakage is such that they have to be
refreshed every 2 ms or so...at least, as of 10 years ago.
(Not as painful as it sounds, as DRAM is actually a two-
dimensional array, with RAS and CAS strobes; to refresh,
one throws an address onto CAS -- or was it RAS? -- and pulls it
down for a short interval. A 64Mb would be, internally, 8192 x 8192,
and a refresh cycle (one row) would have to be done about
every 250 ns -- assuming the leakage hasn't changed; for all I
know the transistors might be able to hold their charge for 20ms now.)
There are also several formats for a "number"; the two most obvious
ones are the typical two's-complement specified integer and
the IEEE-compliant float or double, and the infamous
big vs. little-endian debate.
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- insert random misquote here
EAC code #191 6d:17h:02m actually running Linux.
Are you still here?
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: alt.destroy.microsoft,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,soc.singles
Subject: Re: t. max devlin: kook
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 17:31:24 -0400
Brock Hannibal wrote:
>
> On Thu, 12 Apr 2001, Anonymous wrote:
>
> > t. max dumbass:
> > > Said Anonymous in alt.destroy.microsoft on Sun, 8 Apr 2001 06:30:34
> > > -0600;
> > > >T. Max Devlin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > >> Anything with a command line is easier to learn, of course, because it
> > > >> is simpler
> > > >
> > > >i just wanted to see that again
> > >
> > > And I bet the last thing in the world you wanted was for me to explain
> > > it. You're such a putz, pretending like typing is somehow impossible.
> >
> > now that you mention it i wonder how many people can type with sufficient
> > accuracy to effectively make use of the command line...
>
> All but the most uncoordinated. I only really use a few commands from
> the command line. And those few are also available from pull down menus.
>
> > but what i originally had in mind was the difference between memorizing
> > a whole series of cryptic commands and just pulling down the menus and
> > seeing what they say.
> > jackie 'anakin' tokeman
>
> Some people do better with hieroglyphics others do better with
> alphabetical languages. There is nothing that prevents a Unix user or
> the provider of the Unix-based tools from creating a set of pull down
> menus, which then bring up GUI's just like Windows does.
>
In fact, the standard Linux GUIS have that stuff already.
Jackie needs to get out of the late 1980's.
> --
> Brock
>
> "One thing counts in this life: Get them to sign
> on the line which is dotted...A. Always. B. Be.
> C. Closing. Always Be Closing."
>
> http://www.swingout.net/
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
DNRC Minister of all I survey
ICQ # 3056642
K: Truth in advertising:
Left Wing Extremists Charles Schumer and Donna Shalala,
Black Seperatist Anti-Semite Louis Farrakhan,
Special Interest Sierra Club,
Anarchist Members of the ACLU
Left Wing Corporate Extremist Ted Turner
The Drunken Woman Killer Ted Kennedy
Grass Roots Pro-Gun movement,
J: Other knee_jerk reactionaries: billh, david casey, redc1c4,
The retarded sisters: Raunchy (rauni) and Anencephielle (Enielle),
also known as old hags who've hit the wall....
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
her behavior improves.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (C) above.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
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