Linux-Hardware Digest #736, Volume #10 Sun, 11 Jul 99 16:13:26 EDT
Contents:
Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT! (Brian Hartman)
Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Trouble w/ ISAPNPTools ("Ryan Michaels")
Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT! (Shice Beoney)
Newbie: RH5.2 and ESS 1869...I/O Ranges ? ("Alex Roussel")
Re: Problemuccio con il cdrom :-) (Joceli Mayer)
Re: Why cant I mount my cdrom? (Joceli Mayer)
Re: Linux and Watcom Tablets (Robert Sheskin)
Re: Trident 4DWAVE-NX sound card problem... (traxxas)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Brian Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 12:54:22 -0400
Shice Beoney wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Jul 1999 13:41:05 -0500 in comp.os.linux.setup,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Hobbyist©) uttered the following profound gem of
> wisdom:
>
> >On Fri, 9 Jul 1999 10:53:45 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] scrawled these
> >sagacious words ...
> >
> >: On Fri, 09 Jul 1999 11:08:35 -0400, Brian Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
> >: >I can't and won't defend M$ product support. However, the sources of support
>are far more numerous for M$ than for Linux. Besides the
> >: >Usenet newsgroups, there are countless articles in mainstream computer magazines
>catered to solving problems in both Windows and its apps.
> >: >My experience of Linux is that you're limited essentially to Usenet and chat
>groups. (Again, there are notable exceptions to this rule, but
> >: >not many). My argument continues to be that if you're not paying for the
>product, the programmer has no reason to support it, other than the
> >: >kindness of his/her own heart.
> >:
> >: What is a magazine but an overpriced Web Page commited to paper
> >: with far too many banner ads? Most of the popular computer press
> >: is a joke, especially Ziff Davis.
> >:
> >: [detetia]
> >
> >
> >It's really amazing how these linux shortcomings are rationalised in
> >these ridiculous ways.
> >
> >Hey linux is hard to install and configure => Well you shouldn't be doing
> >that by yourself. A trained professional should be doing it so your
> >difficulties are irrelevant.
>
> It took me an hour and a half to install RedHat. Then about a week of
> playing with it in my spare time to get it working the way I wanted.
> Now that I've gone through it once, I could probably do the
> install/configuration inside of 2 hours. I didn't have any problems
> that I couldn't solve with RTFM, a few dejanews searches, and the
> comp.os.linux.* NGs. I don't have a single bit of formal training. So
> either I'm some kind of genius computer prodigy, or Linux isn't nearly
> as hard to install as some make it out to be, and while I'd like to
> believe the former, I'm pretty sure it's the latter.
>
One more salient point: Compare 2 hours to install and set up Linux to less than an
hour to do the same with 95 or NT. Also, you were a little
flippant about all the searches that you did. Searching itself has it's own
intricacies. As far as formal training, goes, I have absolutely none.
But there's a difference between being a novice and having no formal training. The
fact that you were even looking at Linux, let alone installing
it, means you're probably not the neophyte you take yourself for. :)
>
> >Hey, Linux lacks some spiffiness in it's appearance. It looks so dusky
> >and dry.... => You microsoft weenies seem to love the glitzy appearance
> >that gives you that warm and fuzzy feeling .... blah, blah, blah. {I
> >don't know about you, but I like when my car looks good and also
> >functions well. The fact that it functions well, doesn't mean that it's
> >looks are unimportant. A car dealer with that viewpoint will soon be out
> >of business. The same goes for a proposed desktop OS.}
>
> Gee, by that logic, Sun should be out of business and Apache should be
> one of the least-used web servers on the market. Is Outlook Express a
> better newsreader than Forte Agent because it's "prettier"? Hell, by
> that argument, the MacOS is better than windows. Not to mention NeXt
> and probably Amiga as well.
>
> <snip>
>
> --
> "Ma cheri... Wait, she'll hate that, she hateth it when I write in
> French. I usually conduct my correthpondence in fag, but it'th amazing
> how often they're the thame thing!" -Scott Thompson as Buddy Cole the
> drag queen, The Kids In The Hall
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 10:38:26 -0700
On Sun, 11 Jul 1999 10:30:05 -0500, Hobbyist© <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On Sat, 10 Jul 1999 20:02:44 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] scrawled these
>sagacious words ...
[deletia]
>What started all this was one writer saying that he gets a lot of windows
>helpers from magazines and popular media websites.
Notice the complete lack of any actual detail. This is just
a bald assertion and generalization on it's own.
>
>You proceeded to say:
>
> "What is a magazine but an overpriced Web Page committed to paper
> with far too many banner ads? Most of the popular computer press
> is a joke, especially Ziff Davis."
>
>I guess that first sentence in the quote is referring to linux journal as
>well right? :)
Is english your second language? You missed MOST. Mind you,
my most favorite computer mag for quite some time has been
a German one: c't.
[deletia]
The assertion that the content in popular computing publications
is actually useful was simply never supported.
--
It helps the car, in terms of end user complexity and engineering,
that a car is not expected to suddenly become wood chipper at some |||
arbitrary point as it's rolling down the road. / | \
Seeking sane PPP Docs? Try http://penguin.lvcm.com
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ()
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 10:29:21 -0700
On Sun, 11 Jul 1999 10:30:00 -0500, Hobbyist© <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On Sat, 10 Jul 1999 20:09:52 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] scrawled these
>sagacious words ...
>
>: Better in some instances is irrelevant. The notorious static
>: webserving benchmarks touted much as of late are a good example
>: of this. One does not need what one is not using. Being to saturate
>: an 100BaseT or even 4 is irrelevant when you are serving on a DS3
>: and serving dynamic content no less.
>:
>:
>
>How refreshing to hear this argument from you. Splendid. Most of linux's
>key strengths are irrelevant to me because I can either reproduce them
>with what I'm presently using or I'm not interested in those strengths at
>all.
Even as an advocate, I typically don't encourage those that
don't have stability issues, registry issues, pnp issues or
other such issues with Windows to dump it.
Forcing one option down everyone's throat is the Microsoft
lemming way, not ours. Thus many of us recommend Macs to
some or tell others that Linux is not yet ready for them.
If you had quoted more than just the small bit of my reply
that was most convenient to you, that would be evident even
without further re-explanation.
--
It helps the car, in terms of end user complexity and engineering,
that a car is not expected to suddenly become wood chipper at some |||
arbitrary point as it's rolling down the road. / | \
Seeking sane PPP Docs? Try http://penguin.lvcm.com
------------------------------
From: "Ryan Michaels" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Trouble w/ ISAPNPTools
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 14:02:22 -0400
I got a modem from my friend (CommWave PnP) and Linux still isn't
recognizing anything. Is it even possible to set up a PnP modem in Linux???
1.) The modem works under windows on COM3 (3E8) IRQ 4. Why does Linux think
it's under COM4 (/dev/ttyS3 port 2E8) and IRQ 3??
2.) I've done these steps with isapnptools:
pnpdump > isapnp.conf
find and uncomment 0x03e8 and IRQ 4; save
isapnp isapnp.conf
(with this new modem, it says "error... add (VERIFYLD N)
to top of script" so I did that, no errors)
run minicom... nothing.
3.) When isapnptools didn't work, I figured it's because Linux thinks my
modem is on COM4 instead of COM3 like it's supposed to be (so I try to
switch the ports and irqs). I typed "setserial /dev/ttyS3 port 0x03e8 irq 4.
Ran minicom... nothing. I figured since I made ttyS3 have a port of 0x03e8,
it might conflict with ttyS2, so I tried "setserial /dev/ttyS2 port 0x02e8
irq 3". Still nothing...
I know for a fact both of these modems work. Is there something I'm missing,
doing wrong, or something else I'm supposed to type?? This is the 4th time a
modem hasn't recognized, so I have to be doing something wrong. The only
modem that worked was one with jumpers on it, but that magically stopped
working one day...
Anything I read (redhat.com's HOW-TO) doesn't give good enough
explanations... does someone have an example of what they typed or did to
get their PnP modem to work?
Thanks...
BTW - I don't know much about ports and irqs and stuff, so if I need to
change something like that, please give an example.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Shice Beoney)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Windows easy to install? BULLSHIT!
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 18:13:42 GMT
On Sun, 11 Jul 1999 12:54:22 -0400 in comp.os.linux.setup, Brian
Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> uttered the following profound
gem of wisdom:
>Shice Beoney wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 9 Jul 1999 13:41:05 -0500 in comp.os.linux.setup,
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Hobbyist©) uttered the following profound gem of
>> wisdom:
>>
>> >On Fri, 9 Jul 1999 10:53:45 -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] scrawled these
>> >sagacious words ...
>> >
>> >: On Fri, 09 Jul 1999 11:08:35 -0400, Brian Hartman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>wrote:
<snip>
>> >Hey linux is hard to install and configure => Well you shouldn't be doing
>> >that by yourself. A trained professional should be doing it so your
>> >difficulties are irrelevant.
>>
>> It took me an hour and a half to install RedHat. Then about a week of
>> playing with it in my spare time to get it working the way I wanted.
>> Now that I've gone through it once, I could probably do the
>> install/configuration inside of 2 hours. I didn't have any problems
>> that I couldn't solve with RTFM, a few dejanews searches, and the
>> comp.os.linux.* NGs. I don't have a single bit of formal training. So
>> either I'm some kind of genius computer prodigy, or Linux isn't nearly
>> as hard to install as some make it out to be, and while I'd like to
>> believe the former, I'm pretty sure it's the latter.
>>
>
>One more salient point: Compare 2 hours to install and set up Linux to less than an
>hour to do the same with 95 or NT.
I was counting into that time things like setting up TCP/IP
networking, which actually took less time for me in RedHat than in
Windows (none of that adding device, then adding protocol, then
binding the protocol to the adapter, then configuring the adapter,
etc). With RedHat is was basically just pick the type of NIC, and
input the variables (hostname, ip address, etc...). I also had older
versions of Win95 fail to detect my S3Trio64V+ video card, requiring
me to get drivers from the S3 website (which is NOT something that I
would wish on a newbie). XConfigurator and Autoprobe on the other hand
detected my card with no problems.
This is not of course to say that my first install of Linux was
flawless. I didn't buy an official distrib, so I had to figure out by
the trial and error method that when DiskDruid wanted me to created a
root partition, it really meant that it wanted me to name one of them
/. And at first I had to screw around quite a bit to get the
resolution how I wanted it (RH 5.1 doesn't come with XF86Setup). Also,
I in order to get my ethernet card to work, I had to disable PnP on
it, as well as manually specify the IRQ for it to use. So neither were
completely hassle free.
>Also, you were a little
>flippant about all the searches that you did. Searching itself has it's own
>intricacies.
Well, I didn't find it particularly difficult, most of the time all I
did was type in the error message I was getting into a DN power
search, and put in comp.os.linux.* for the forum.
>As far as formal training, goes, I have absolutely none.
>But there's a difference between being a novice and having no formal training.
Agreed. I have a cousin who never took any formal training (but always
had computers around during his childhood) and who now works in the
media lab of a rather large computer company. Formal training can
often be a poor substitute for personal experience. I think there have
actually been studies proving that a person is more likely to remember
something he/she had to figure out on his/her own than something
he/she was taught. I can attest to that.
>The fact that you were even looking at Linux, let alone installing
>it, means you're probably not the neophyte you take yourself for. :)
No, not a neophyte, but not exactly an expert either.
<snip>
--
"Ma cheri... Wait, she'll hate that, she hateth it when I write in
French. I usually conduct my correthpondence in fag, but it'th amazing
how often they're the thame thing!" -Scott Thompson as Buddy Cole the
drag queen, The Kids In The Hall
------------------------------
From: "Alex Roussel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Newbie: RH5.2 and ESS 1869...I/O Ranges ?
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 14:16:16 -0400
Hi there,
I have an integrated ESS 1869 sound card that sndconfig doesn't want to
config. Indeed, it is not in the choice list. I tried almost all the other
choices, and it says there'a an error occurring when trying to connect to
/dev/audio.
my setup is such
DMA1 01
DMA2 03
IRQ 05
I/O Range 0220-022F
I/O Range 0388-038B
I/O Range 0330-0331
If someone could actually tell me how I should read these I/O Ranges
Thanks
Alex
------------------------------
From: Joceli Mayer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Problemuccio con il cdrom :-)
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 12:04:19 -0700
"Claudio P." wrote:
> L' avviso KDE è il seguente :
>
> Impossibile smontare il dispositivo
> Resoconto dell' errore :
> unmount : /dev/hdd is not in the fstab (and you are non root)
>
> Infatti da root va tutto bene .
> Il cdrom.kdelnk da cui dovrei smontare il cdrom ha tra le proprietà del
> dispositivo /dev/cdrom e NON /dev/hdd come dice lui !!!
either add your /mnt/cdrom to the fstab, read "man mount" and take a look
in your actual /etc/fstab
or use "mount -t iso9660 /dev/hd* /mnt/cdrom" where "*" in "/dev/hd*"
stands for either "c" or "d" (depends if your CDROM is connected to the
first IDE or the second.
------------------------------
From: Joceli Mayer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why cant I mount my cdrom?
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 12:17:43 -0700
==============38C336E59271A4A1CB12C40D
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Devon Taylor wrote:
> Here are the specifics:
> Source Mount Point FsType Partition Type Status
> /dev/hda10 / ext2 Linux(83)
> mounted
> /dev/hda5 /boot ext2
> " mounted
> /dev/hda6 /usr ext2
> " mounted
> /dev/hda9 /usr/local ext2
> " mounted
> /dev/hda0 /mnt/floppy ext2
> /dev/cdrom /mnt/cdrom ISO9660
> none /dev/pts
> devpts mounted
>
> I am in Linuxconf, running Red Hat 6.0
> I see where is says cdrom, I press the button that says mount.
> It says do you want to mount this device, I press yes button.
> Save all changes, exit.
> Boot into user, using KDE gui, I click on cdrom (with cd already
> inside), and it prompts that only root can mount device! Why is it not
> accepting my changes in root? I saved whenever I exit, and Activate
> changes. Its not that. Please help someone. I need my tunes!
>
> -Devon
Just add "user" to your /etc/fstab like:
/dev/cdrom /mnt/cdrom iso9660 user,exec,dev,suid,ro,noauto 0
0
==============38C336E59271A4A1CB12C40D
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
Devon Taylor wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE> Here are the specifics:
<br><b><u>Source </u></b>
<b><u>Mount
Point</u></b> <b><u>FsType</u></b>
<b><u>Partition
Type</u></b> <b><u>Status</u></b>
<br>/dev/hda10
/
ext2
Linux(83) mounted
<br>/dev/hda5
/boot
ext2
"
mounted
<br>/dev/hda6
/usr
ext2
"
mounted
<br>/dev/hda9
/usr/local
ext2
"
mounted
<br>/dev/hda0
/mnt/floppy
ext2
<br>/dev/cdrom /mnt/cdrom
ISO9660
<br>none
/dev/pts
devpts
mounted
<p>I am in Linuxconf, running Red Hat 6.0
<br>I see where is says cdrom, I press the button that says mount.
<br>It says do you want to mount this device, I press yes button.
<br>Save all changes, exit.
<br>Boot into user, using KDE gui, I click on cdrom (with cd already inside),
and it prompts that only root can mount device! Why is it not accepting
my changes in root? I saved whenever I exit, and Activate changes. Its
not that. Please help someone. I need my tunes!
<p>-Devon</blockquote>
Just add "user" to your /etc/fstab like:
<br>/dev/cdrom /mnt/cdrom
iso9660 user,exec,dev,suid,ro,noauto 0 0</html>
==============38C336E59271A4A1CB12C40D==
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Linux and Watcom Tablets
From: Robert Sheskin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 11 Jul 1999 15:13:54 -0400
Patrick Mendoza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Hello there. Does Linux support those Watcom Tablets?
> Is there a website for this information?
> I just can't seem to get the hang of using a mouse and
> GIMP.
Check out www.freshmeat.net. I remember seeing some stuff on Wacom tablets.
Type it in the search and it should light you up.
------------------------------
From: traxxas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Trident 4DWAVE-NX sound card problem...
Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1999 12:55:34 -0700
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ALSA is the only way to go. Just read the docs and follow the steps. It
may seem hard but you will learn with time.
"À±»óÇÊ" wrote:
>
> This card is not supported by the kernel.
> So, I tried ALSA. But it was too difficult for me(I am a beginner).
> Therefore.... I need help!!! Somebody help me!!
> Thanks in advance.
------------------------------
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