On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Jeffrey Goldberg wrote: > On Thu, 1 Aug 2002, Russ Allbery wrote:
>> Basically, they won't archive any list that doesn't want to be >> archived, but if the list is open for subscription, the list >> owner has to either notice the subscription message or opt out. > That makes sense. Either the list owner pays attention to who > subscribes or doesn't. As a list member, I know that anyone or > anything can be lurking on most lists. I really don't see a > problem here. I disagree. Most list-owners by default doesn't pay attention to who subscribes because the default setting of the "notify-list-owner of subscriptions-and-unsubscriptions" setting is set to no; that includes Mailman and many other listservers. So it takes an active effort, choice and knowledge about the listserver on the list-owner's part just to be able to receive the notifications. 95 % of list-owners just go with the default settings when they create a list. Because of the default settings, paying attention to subscriptions is "going against the grain", and since only a small minority will go against the grain, the end result is a license to hijack lists. >> Hm. Yeah, I think Lars hasn't thought hard enough about this. >> He's a smart guy, though, and quite willing to work with >> people, so maybe someone here who runs a list with public >> subscription but that they don't consider public should try to >> explain their point of view. > And maybe we should take this discussion to gmane.discuss. Forwarding is OK with me. >> (I consider all lists that I run with public subscription to be >> public lists exactly as described on that page, so I'm not of >> any help there.) > Me, too. Well, I don't. Two of my lists have voted against public archives even though the subscription mode for both lists is open. Concern about spam-harvesting of addresses is one concern, but not the only one. The list members feel that they are a community, and that access to the community should at least require the minimum effort of being a member of the community (even if a passive/lurking one). Also: Why should a list-owner have to manually approve every subscription just to avoid public archiving? Incidentally, there is no such thing as a "public subscription", unless you regularly or automatically post a log of all your subscriptions to a public web page or newsgroup. Thomas Gramstad [EMAIL PROTECTED]
