Oi Eduardo,
Se fossem leões comendo as zebras, deveríamos deixar isso com eles.
Estão cumprindo a lei natural.
Mas nas bolsa PQ muitas vezes se trata de um grupinho de zebras
entregando as "loosers" para os leões, para salvar a pele, ao invés
de irem brigar ou fugir todas juntas.
Hai capito?
Abs
Walter
2014-01-31 Eduardo Ochs <eduardoo...@gmail.com>:
> Pra mim uma questão subjacente à de "mérito = produtividade" e à das
> cotas é a seguinte: o quanto nós devemos deixar os losers se ferrarem
> só por eles serem losers?
>
> Vou me dar a liberdade de fazer uma citação grande, abaixo, de um
> livro absolutamente genial - "The Lives of Animals", do J.M. Coetzee;
> não tenho a tradução dele para Português ("A vida dos animais" -
> Companhia das Letras) online, mas tem um PDF do original aqui:
>
> http://tannerlectures.utah.edu/_documents/a-to-z/c/Coetzee99.pdf
>
> Deixa eu dar uma explicação. Toda vez que a gente discute
> meritocracia, critérios de mérito acadêmico, cotas, etc, a gente
> indiretamente está discutindo também "esquerda", "direita", "política"
> (tanto micro quanto macro), etc - que são coisas com uma carga
> emocional fortíssima... espero que a gente desta vez tenha a
> maturidade de usar a discussão mais pra cada um explicitar a sua
> posição e entender a dos outros do que pra cair na histeria e nos
> ataques ad-hominem...
>
> Por outro lado, eu SEI que nós - membros da lista, como um todo - não
> temos maturidade pra isto; eu sei que apesar das minhas boas intenções
> daqui a pouco este thread vai ter 200 mensagens, muitas super
> agressivas, como o thread sobre homeopatia, várias pessoas vão estar
> espumando de ódio de outras, vamos ter mais algumas mensagens pedindo
> que o moderador da lista (!!!) tome providências, e meia dúzia de
> pessoas vão se desinscrever da lista... mas uma coisa que eu aprendi
> este ano é que isto é inevitável, e não é problema meu.
>
> Mas voltando à citação que eu vou pôr abaixo. Um dos grandes temas do
> "A vida dos animais" é que não dá mais pra gente fingir que fechar os
> olhos pro sofrimento dos losers é algo que só os monstros fazem - todo
> mundo faz isto, em maior ou menor grau - e tá na hora da gente fazer
> algo melhor com relação a genocídios do que ficar histéricos num
> momento, e depois esquecer deles.
>
> (Lembrem que a minha motivação original pra postar isto era: o quanto
> a gente deve pleitear para coleguinhas losers? E: se a gente estivesse
> na posição do Décio, será que a gente conseguiria ter alguma empatia
> pelos coleguinhas losers? Bom, lá vai...)
>
>
>
> "Between 1942 and 1945 several million people were put to death
> in the concentration camps of the Third Reich: at Treblinka alone
> more than a million and a half, perhaps as many as three million.
> These are numbers that numb the mind. We have only one death of our
> own: we can comprehend the deaths of others only one at a time: in
> the abstract we may be able to count to a million, but we cannot
> count to a million deaths.
>
> "The people who lived in the countryside around Treblinka --
> Poles, for the most part -- said that they did not know what was
> going on in the camp; said that, while in a general way they might
> have guessed what was going on, they did not know for sure; said
> that, while in a sense they might have known, in another sense they
> did not know, could not afford to know, for their own sake.
>
> "The people around Treblinka were not exceptional. There were
> camps all over the Reich, nearly six thousand in Poland alone,
> untold thousands in Germany proper. Few Germans lived more than a
> few kilometres from a camp of some kind. Not every camp was a death
> camp, a camp dedicated to the production of death, but horrors went
> on in all of them, more horrors by far than one could afford to
> know, for one's own sake.
>
> "It is not because they waged an expansionist war, and lost it,
> that Germans of a particular generation are still regarded as
> standing a little outside humanity, as having to do or be something
> special before they can be readmitted to the human fold. They lost
> their humanity, in our eyes, because of a certain willed ignorance
> on their part. Under the circumstances of Hitler's kind of war,
> ignorance may have been a useful survival mechanism, but that is an
> excuse which, with admirable moral rigor, we refuse to accept. In
> Germany, we say, a certain line was crossed which took people beyond
> the ordinary murderousness and cruelty of warfare into a state that
> we can only call sin. The signing of the articles of capitulation
> and the payment of reparations did not put an end to that state of
> sin. On the contrary, we said, a sickness of the soul continued to
> mark that generation. It marked those citizens of the Reich who had
> committed evil actions, but also those who, for whatever reason,
> were in ignorance of those actions. It thus marked, for practical
> purposes, every citizen of the Reich. Only those in the camps were
> innocent.
>
> "`They went like sheep to the slaughter.' `They died like
> animals.' `The Nazi butchers killed them.' Denunciation of the camps
> reverberates so fully with the language of the stockyard and
> slaughterhouse that it is barely necessary for me to prepare the
> ground for the comparison I am about to make. The crime of the Third
> Reich, says the voice of accusation, was to treat people like
> animals.
>
> (...)
>
> "The question to ask should not be: Do we have something in
> common -- reason, self-consciousness, a soul -- with other animals?
> (With the corollary that, if we do not, then we are entitled to
> treat them as we like, imprisoning them, killing them, dishonoring
> their corpses.) I return to the death camps. The particular horror
> of the camps, the horror that convinces us that what went on there
> was a crime against humanity, is not that despite a humanity shared
> with their victims, the killers treated them like lice. That is too
> abstract. The horror is that the killers refused to think themselves
> into the place of their victims, as did everyone else. They said,
> `It is they in those cattle-cars rattling past.' They did not say,
> `How would it be if it were I in that cattle-car?' They did not say,
> `It is I who am in that cattle car.' They said, `It must be the dead
> who are being burnt today, making the air stink and falling in ash
> on my cabbages.' They did not say, `How would it be if I were
> burning?' They did not say, `I am burning, I am falling in ash.'
>
> "In other words, they closed their hearts. The heart is the
> seat of a faculty, sympathy. that allows us to share at times the
> being of another. Sympathy has everything to do with the subject and
> little to do with the object, the `another,' as we see at once when
> we think of the object not as a bat (`Can I share the being of a
> bat?') but as another human being. There are people who have the
> capacity to imagine themselves as someone else, there are people who
> have no such capacity (when the lack is extreme, we call them
> psychopaths), and there are people who have the capacity but choose
> not to exercise it.
>
> "Despite Thomas Nagel, who is probably a good man, despite
> Thomas Aquinas and René Descartes, with whom I have more
> difficulty in sympathizing, there is no limit to the extent to which
> we can think ourselves into the being of another. There are no
> bounds to the sympathetic imagination. If you want proof, consider
> the following. Some years ago I wrote a book called The House on
> Eccles Street. To write that book I had to think my way into the
> existence of Marion Bloom. Either I succeeded or I did not. If I did
> not, I cannot imagine why you invited me here today. In any event,
> the point is, Marion Bloom never existed. Marion Bloom was a figment
> of James Joyce's imagination. If I can think my way into the
> existence of a being who has never existed, then I can think my way
> into the existence of a bat or a chimpanzee or an oyster, any being
> with whom I share the substrate of life.
>
> "I return one last time to the places of death all around us,
> the places of slaughter to which, in a huge communal effort, we
> close our hearts. Each day a fresh holocaust, yet as far as I can
> see our moral being is untouched. We do not feel tainted. We can
> do anything, it seems, and come away clean.
>
> "We point to the Germans and Poles and Ukrainians who did and
> did not know of the atrocities around them. We like to think they
> were inwardly marked by the aftereffects of that special form of
> ignorance. We like to think that in their nightmares the ones whose
> suffering they had refused to enter came back to haunt them. We like
> to think they woke up haggard in the mornings, and died of gnawing
> cancers. But probably it was not so. The evidence points in the
> opposite direction: that we can do anything and get away with it;
> that there is no punishment."
>
> [[]],
> Eduardo Ochs
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--
-----------------------------------------------
Prof. Dr. Walter Carnielli
Director
Centre for Logic, Epistemology and the History of Science – CLE
State University of Campinas –UNICAMP
13083-859 Campinas -SP, Brazil
Phone: (+55) (19) 3521-6517
Fax: (+55) (19) 3289-3269
Institutional e-mail: walter.carnie...@cle.unicamp.br
Website: http://www.cle.unicamp.br/prof/carnielli
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