Dear Stewart
You can find the reference and the music in page 597. Best wishes, Antonio On Friday, 10 January 2020, 07:16:36 GMT-6, Stewart McCoy <lu...@mail.cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: Dear Antonio, I have been searching my house high and low for my photocopy of Barberiis' _Libro Decimo_. It must be here somewhere, but I just can't find it. However, help is at hand at Sarge Gerbode's lute site. If you search there under "facsimiles", you will find a copy of Barberiis' book: http://www.gerbode.net/facsimiles/Barberiis_intabolatura_di_lauto_v10_1549/hh1v.png . The type face for the guitar music looks to me the same as for the lute music. It is interesting that the top line is marked "canto", presumably to clarify that this line represents the first course (highest in pitch), unlike all the lute music earlier in the book. By the way, although each of the guitar pieces has the title "Fantasia", they are really more modest in character. I would be very interested to know what the music is. There is a facsimile copy of Salinas' book at the IMSLP site. Please could you tell me which page he gives the tenor of Conde Claros. (I find the Latin heavy going.) Where possible I would like to link Spanish romances such as Conde Claros to simple melodies, to be able to create a more folky performance (unaccompanied, or with simple chords strummed on the guitar) than the sophisticated arrangements for voice and vihuela which survive in the vihuela books. Best wishes, Stewart. -----Original Message----- From: Antonio Corona Sent: Friday, January 10, 2020 10:58 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: Milan's name - Postludium to the CODA Dear Stewart What a pleasant surprise! I'm ever so glad to hear from you. Thank you very much for the information - I stand corrected, and happy to do so, Is it in the same type as the lute music? Sounds very intriguing. Best wishes, Antonio On Friday, 10 January 2020, 04:38:13 GMT-6, Stewart McCoy <lu...@mail.cs.dartmouth.edu> wrote: Dear Antonio, A pleasure to make contact with you via this thread. Strictly speaking there is another example of Milan's tablature, albeit for guitar, in Melchiore de Barberiis, _Libro Decimo_ (Venice: Hieronymus Scotum, 1549). Most of the book contains music for the lute in Italian lute tablature, but at the end of the book are four short pieces for the 4-course guitar. The tablature for the guitar music is the same as Luys Milan's. Best wishes, Stewart McCoy. -----Original Message----- From: Antonio Corona Sent: Friday, January 10, 2020 2:35 AM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: Milan's name - Postludium to the CODA Dear G. C. As I stated before, it would be foolish to deny that Milán was influenced by Italian culture; what I do not find is evidence of any possible influence by the Italian lutenists before him. I, for one, would welcome any information about it, but I'm still waiting to be enlightened. As far as I know, with the exception of Dalza's, pavans "alla venetiana" and "alla ferrarese" which are quite different from Milan's, there is no Italian lute source of pavans before 1536 (Attaingnant does have some, but so far nobody here has proposed a French influence). An interesting point would be that, according to Milán, his pavans resemble those played in Italy (parecen en su ayre y compostura a las mesmas pauanas que en Ytalia se tañen). Valid questions would then be: what were his sources? Manuscripts? Did he listen to them? I have to admit this is a big lacuna in our knowledge of the matter, but so far we do not have any satisfactory answers: speculation may contribute to our peace of! mind, but not to our knowledge. Valencian tablature should be called, in fact, Milan's tablature: there are no other examples of it. To me this is another proof of Milán's unique condition (an interesting antecedent would be the Marineo Siculo fragment but that is, too, one of a kind). It could nevertheless be argued that Milán used rhytmic flags above each cipher, as can be found in Petrucci's previous publications (and unlike Casteliono in 1536 and later vihuelists), but that is all I can find in common. Since I am not Spanish, I feel I can hardly be found guilty of championing any issue of honour or ownership; I just try to judge from what available evidence can tell us and form my own criteria from it. I don't care where I step as long as there is a sound basis to justify where I place my feet. Best wishes Antonio P.S. What does "italianate music in a general sense" mean in the context of Milán´s pieces? On Thursday, 9 January 2020, 15:23:56 GMT-6, G. C. <kalei...@gmail.com> wrote: I meant to say: "An improvement to neapolitan tab" (Which was in Valencian hands at the time) (Also only one remaining ms. and de Milano at that!) It's fascinating to think of what influences were at work there.) G. On Thu, Jan 9, 2020 at 8:23 PM G. C. <[1]kalei...@gmail.com> wrote: Pavanas in italian style, songs in italian, italianate music in a general sense, etc. etc. I don't understand this tip-toeing around the fact that Milan was heavily influenced by Italian art and (lutenist) culture, as many were around this time. And also his surname, which I cannot see has satisfyingly been explained yet. Not to speak about the fascinating Valencian tablature, an improvement (in my view) to italian tab which just didn't catch on. Are we afraid of steping on some misguided Spanish sense of honour and ownership for one of the early vihuelists here? Just intrigued G. -- To get on or off this list see list information at [2]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- References 1. mailto:kalei...@gmail.com 2. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
