CB
On 7/25/11 10:57 AM, David Taylor wrote:
Which would all make web based chat and apps better than any Mac app currently is, especially if you can do neat things like have a live region with apps like Adium in the future if VO will support that, saving the need to rely on Growl. I think FB chat on the website may end up being the way to chat for many of us though. Cheers Dave On 25 Jul 2011, at 15:48, Chris Blouch wrote:I think I can fill in some gaps here. I haven't upgraded to Lion yet but I do know about live regions on web pages. This is part of the w3c spec for ARIA or Accessible Rich Internet Applications and has been supported on other browser on other platforms for some time now. Generally it's used for areas on the page which get updated and the web developer wants the screen reader to announce the changes. The common example is a web-based chat where you want it to read any incoming messages added to the chat log. Normally the only way to notice changed content in a particular spot on a page is to move focus away and back or set a hot spot manually. Live region attributes added by the web developer tell the browser to pass changes to the assistive technology to be announced. There are also some settings like only read the changed text and whether to defer to any other stuff already being read. For example, the chat log might be one big container with new items inserted at the end. So when a new item is added we only want the new item read, not the entire chat log. More on the w3c's spec site here: http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria/terms#def_liveregion http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria/states_and_properties#attrs_liveregions CB On 7/23/11 8:20 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:Hello. This whole discussion about live regions and the like starts to make me wonder a bit. What are live regions and what are they supposed to do for us? I know they are a part of the "area" or how it's spelled thing, but what are they doing and why would we want them. This doesn't apply only to VO but also to other screen readers on other platforms that support Area. If a live region updates a page such that the whole page changes and thus forces the cursor back to the beginning of a page after each update, do we really want those areas? What it all boils down to, i guess, is that in VOs case, there must be a reason for that Live areas check box to be there and checked and for why they can be unchecked. I would love to know that reason. /Krister 23 jul 2011 kl. 05:28 skrev Christopher-Mark Gilland:It's OK Quinn, don't worry about it. As you said, we all make mistakes. As far as I see it, your apologise greatly is accepted. I wonder if this would solve the issue with my item chooser list. Now you got me curious! Chris. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Quinn Haberl"<quinnhaber...@gmail.com> To: "MacVisionaries"<macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> Sent: Friday, July 22, 2011 11:13 PM Subject: Re: Voice over lag and other lion issues Thought I would updatethis quickly. I figured out why safari was being Soleil D and why I was having so many problems with voice over in Safari. Why was sitting on my computer I was thinking maybe I should check the voice over Control Panel thing. I did so and is the web category in the voice over control panel at the very bottom of the settings page there is a checkbox that in lion comes checked. This check boxes called live regions. In a nutshell what it does is it updates parts of the website that are continually updated for example ad banners and things like that. I uncheck the checkbox and now everything seems to be working fine. So unless you really know what that checkbox does on CheckIt and life will be made much easier at least it was for me. I didn't mean to be so critical of apple in my last post. As a matter of fact being a recent Windows convert I have found that Apple accessibility is amazing. And yes I do agree that we do need to show some patients on our part. Everyone makes mistakes it's just hard to deal with those mistakes when voice over and the other Mac accessibility features are the only way in which you have access to all your information. I don't mean this to directly criticize anyone on this blog. I have found the Mac blog very helpful in solving and answering questions. The criticism is more geared toward myself as self-criticism. On Jul 22, 9:50 pm, "Christopher-Mark Gilland"<clgillan...@gmail.com> wrote:I wouldn't so much say that they are losing commitment, as much as I'd say, they seem to be getting very sloppy. I mean, ok, here's my thing. I totally am with all you all in saying everyone just chill. the only reason I'm keeping my stance so strong on this is the fact that look at this. I mean, this looks like we should still be running a beta with all these bugs. come on, lookit! We have some beta testers on here, do we not? Admit it, did you all see any of these bugs? If not, then wow. I apologize. Really I do. I'm then out of lign severely, and for that, I'm ashamed of myself, but, really, think about this for justa minute. OK, you all can shoot me, I know you may want me to shut up, as does a few people who we won't mention, but, if they and all you others will please I beg you, just! for once, hear me out for a second. If you will, and will at least acknowledge me, then I'll perhaps shut up. Just let me have this for a sec. Look, let's addres this from a fact stand point rather than a Chris's opinion standpoint, ok? this way it's more fair. 1. We all agree this is a new O S, right? 2. We all agree that things are very buggy in many areas, right? Uh dab dab dap? Holdit! I'm not done, listen to me! I'm still talking. You'll get your chance. I didn't ask you all if th3e problems can be addressed in a software update. I'll address that in a second. right now, we're just looking at the facts. OK? So I repeat: 2. Is it not true, that we all agree that lots of things are buggy? Yes, or no. 3. Do we all agree that these are problems that should have probably been addressed at least to some extent during the beta cycle before the official release? Yes or no>? 4. Do we all agree that most of these bugs can be delt with and tollerated to some degree? OK then. I think we all agree on all the above, so why such hostility toward me and everyone else on list by some members. Look, I feel you all's frustration, we just want things to work, but we also are getting frustrated at the nonconstructive messages cluttering the inbox of many. But, there is a delete key, and I assure you, things will die down once Lion is more progressed. Right now, everyone is just kind of in that what the bird state right now. do we need to chill? OK, maybe so, but, really people, do you really think that an O S should be this buggy before official release? I know you all don't like hearing what I'm saying, and it's pissing you all off hearing it, but that's because I am not afraid to speak my mind nor the truth. The blunt truth is, at least in my view of things, Apple is beginning to fail miserably at there line of duty with accessibilty. Now, does this mean I'm saying that they are purposefully? doing this? No! Mark it in red what I say here: Ab, suh, lootly? not! I think they're just becoming more and more lazy, maybe not wanting to be so involved. Maybe they're trying to take on too much at once. I, don't, know! I don't know what goes on behind the scenes there? I probably don't, wanna? know! The point is, we really can't make accusations, can we! We don't know if they're really working behind the scene or not. So, on the one hand, should we probably just chill? Yes, but, having said that, is it mortally wrong for me to constructively complain about observations I've found? Yes. Is it justifiable to say negative things about bugs I find which we all knkow exist? Yes! It's just an observation/opinion people? It's not your spouce who won't... umm... I'm not finishing that... LOL! ROFL! You get the point. So in my defense, I ask jpeole, please be more gentle with me. I'm only trying to help you all, and make suggestions. I may come on harsh at times, I know I do, but for god sake, cut me some slack! I'm frustrated! Can you blame me? Are we not all at one point or another in life? Bluntly? Deal with it, or don't read my mail! It's not rocket science! OK, I'm not gonna keep ranting and raving about htis. I've said my peace and hopefully've been heard. Enough is enough, in all respect fiarness to all of you all. I rest my case. Chris.-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
