Perhaps, but is a hard thing not to do. I will definitely keep this in mind, though, and try harder to take the mac for what it is. I think I am just looking for ways of doing the same things I did in windows that made navigation easier, like dialog access keys. For instance, I am writing this on the mac in the mail app. Is there a command to send, or do I have to tab/arrow to the send buton? It is really more about efficiency, at least regarding this point, than a windows comparison. On 18 Aug 2011, at 21:31, Mik e Arrigo wrote:
> Based on your questions, I do think you're comparing voiceover and the mac to > windows too much, and this may cause you problems. While there are some > similarities, the mac has its own way of doing things. For instance, on the > web, you mainly move element by element, it doesn't navigate line by line the > way windows screen readers do. You can still read an entire page by pressing > control option a. The main place you find shortcut keys are in menus. They > usually don't appear in dialog boxes. The more you use it, the easier it > should become for you. > On Aug 18, 2011, at 9:10 AM, Alex Hall wrote: > >> Hello all, >> I was on here a few months ago asking some basic questions about vo. >> Now, I am proud to say, I have a Mac Mini sitting on the desk all >> shiny and new from Best Buy as of two nights ago. I can get around >> the basics, like system or vo settings, and I can do things like >> checking for updates, but beyond that I am stuck. Here, in no >> particular order, is my list of questions. Rest assured, more will be >> coming! >> >> 1. It seems that dialogs have access keys (on Windows, one might >> press alt-a to activate the "add" button, for instance), since I found >> that pressing s within the shutdown dialog will make the computer >> sleep. However, vo will not read these keys, if they exist at all, so >> I never know what letter will activate a button. I have found the >> option to use cmd+letter to move to elements starting with that >> letter, but that is not the same thing since developers can assign any >> letter to be the access key. >> >> 2. I have trouble with html content (web pages, the App Store, and so >> on). I can get around by arrowing from one element to another or by >> using the rotor, but I cannot figure out the following: >> a. I have enabled single-key navigation on webpages, but nothing >> wraps. For instance, if I am below a search edit which is the page's >> only input field and I press f, I am told "text field not found" >> instead of being taken to the field above me (at the top of the page). >> b. How can I just read the page? With jaws on Windows, I can arrow up >> and down on the page to read it like a document, which is great if I >> don't know what the page looks like or do not have a destination in >> mind. Arrowing in vo, though, seems impossible. Am I to read pages >> element by element only? If I go to a heading which is, say, an >> article title, how can I just arrow down to see what the article is, >> instead of reading the page from my current position? This is useful >> if there is a by line, a social network sharing frame, or other >> content after the heading but before the article. >> >> 3. How do I use the Finder? I have no idea what it is doing, and only >> found a file I was looking for by accident. Should I use Spotlight >> instead? What is the difference? Is there a third-party file and >> folder manager that people recommend? >> >> 4. From what I can gather, the left-hand menu is kind of like the >> system tray in Windows, with network information, sound, bluetooth, >> and the like. How do I access it? >> >> 5. When the mac starts, vo does not. I have to hit cmd-f5 to run it >> each time, and I am not sure how long to wait (I think I could wait a >> lot less time than I am). How can I fix this? I am running a usb >> keyboard, no mouse, and no monitor at the moment. >> >> 6. Can vo announce the time and date like most other screen readers? >> This is not a big deal to me, but it would be nice sometimes. I have >> enabled the keyboard commander, but the speech used is not my vo >> speech, but rather the system speech, and there is quite a delay >> between the keypress and the speaking. >> >> 7. Why is it that, when I go into the launcher and try to open my >> downloads folder, nothing happens? It should have two files in it, so >> I know it is not empty. I am pressing enter, space, vo-space, the up >> and down arrows (quick nav is on), but nothing happens. >> >> 8. Nothing ever goes onto the desktop. I am not sure how to use it >> or what good it is, since everything goes to the dock/launcher. I was >> listening to a podcast last night, and the host had somehow set things >> up so that his desktop had his home folder opened on it. How do I >> manage my desktop, and how is it different from the dock? >> >> 9. Safari: aside from the html questions, how do I do things like >> view bookmarks, sort bookmarks into folders, view open tabs, switch >> between tabs, and so on? Will vo work with Firefox? Might I be better >> off using that over Safari? >> >> 10. How do I get to things I download so I can open them? I have so >> far downloaded two programs, but I am not sure how to run either one >> of them. I think I ran one, but I'm not sure, and now I can't get the >> other to work at all. >> >> 11. Is there a way to read daisy, for free, using Alex? I know >> Bookshare has a program, but I don't want the voices it comes with, I >> just want to use Alex to read bookshare and other content. >> >> 12. I see that there are some scripts in the keyboard commander. How >> do I view these scripts or assign my own? I am not asking for >> programming help, but rather for help on how to view the contents with >> a mac or tell vo where to find scripts I may make in the future. >> >> 13. I am thinking about a trackpad of some kind (this is, after all, >> a mini, not a laptop). Would there be any advantage to the Magic >> Mouse over the Magic Trackpad? As I understand it, they are the same >> except that the mouse lets you click. Is that of any help in vo, or >> should I just go for the trackpad? >> >> 14. Maybe macs don't work this way, but how do I bring up the context >> menu for an item? For instance, I was trying to figure out how to >> remove icons from the dock, and I thought that if I could just >> right-click the icon I could select the option to remove it. How does >> one right-click, or does that even do the same thing as it does in >> Windows? Do items have contextual menus at all? >> >> 15. How can I quickly access more menus? The tutorial talked about >> vo-m to get to the menu bar, but that only brings me to the Apple >> menu. Is there a way to jump directly to edit, view, and the others? >> >> 16. I installed Ventrillo, but it just kept saying "busy" when I >> tried to activate any of its buttons. I couldn't shut down because >> Ventrillo wouldn't quit, and the force quit keystroke the mac told me >> to use just resulted in vo saying "busy" over and over again. >> Finally, for the second time today (the first while installing) I had >> to do a hard shutdown. How often does something like this happen, and >> how do you resolve it? >> >> 17. How do I quickly switch tabs? In the vo utility, for example, is >> there a keystroke like Windows' ctrl-tab to move from category to >> category, or at least from tab to tab inside a category? It seems very >> slow to have to keep tabbing until I wrap back to the tab selection. >> >> Thanks in advance for any help, and sory there are so many questions! >> So far, this is quite a shock, having been a Windows man for all the >> years I have used a computer. I am hoping that, in the two weeks >> before I can no longer bring it back to Best Buy, I come to love the >> Mac... Time will tell, I suppose, but I am rather frustrated at the >> moment with my near inability to use the internet or app store, among >> other things. That said, I recently discovered the full customization >> and power available with commanders and activities, all much easier >> and (seemingly) more powerful than jaws or nvda. I also love the >> activity monitor - much easier to use than the resource monitor in >> Windows, especially the processes tab. >> >> >> -- >> Have a great day, >> Alex (msg sent from GMail website) >> mehg...@gmail.com; http://www.facebook.com/mehgcap >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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