On 6 July 2011 14:40, Colin Guthrie <mag...@colin.guthr.ie> wrote: > 'Twas brillig, and Ahmad Samir at 05/07/11 10:50 did gyre and gimble: >>> I see packages like gstreamer0.10-soup installed as separate packages. >>> Is there any real gain from this split? Other than pulling in other >>> libraries etc, as it just causes potential problems for some packages >>> that do not require it. e.g. totem and rhythmbox both reqire the -soup >>> package but phonon-gstreamer does not (it should). >>> >>> But really, should this library just be bundled into the main -good >>> package? >> >> I agree about merging -soup, without it gst-based apps can't seem to >> play online streams, this is a basic functionality, I guess. >> >>> Ditto for other "overly split" things, like the pulse plugin, >>> and the neon plugin in -bad.... >>> >> >> I dunno about pulse, it would pull pulseaudio on users' systems (I >> know it's installed by default, but some do a minimal install and >> don't install pulse, even if the some of pulse libs are too dug deep >> down the whole stack :)). > > Hmmm, gstreamer0.10-pulse requires "pulseaudio >= 0.9.7". Interesting. > > I'm not sure why (it could easily be installed on a system that does not > have a PA daemon and operates as a thin client. > > Wonder if we should just drop that require and then the gst-pulse plugin > only really requires libpulse which a *lot* of other things need anyway, > and thus no additional stuff pulled in. WDYT? >
Indeed; and draksound will install pulseaudio when configuring the system to use pulse. > >>> Has anyone sad down and thought about it a bit recently (here or in Mdv?) >> >> (I have to admit, I didn't sit down and think about it before). Here goes: >> >> =========================== >> -good: >> $ urpmf --sourcerpm gstreamer0.10-plugins-good | awk -F: '{print $1}' >> gstreamer0.10-caca >> gstreamer0.10-raw1394 >> gstreamer0.10-soup >> gstreamer0.10-plugins-good >> gstreamer0.10-dv >> gstreamer0.10-wavpack >> gstreamer0.10-pulse >> gstreamer0.10-jack >> gstreamer0.10-speex >> gstreamer0.10-aalib >> gstreamer0.10-flac >> >> I think these can be merged in addition to -soup: >> -flac, an open format, expected to work o-o-t-b, IMHO >> -jack, doesn't matter really, it won't pull any more requires as >> libjack.so.0 is deep in the stack anyway (just tested with urpme >> --test and it wanted to yank 174 packages). >> >> As for the rest I am not sure, e.g. I've never used -wavpack, so I >> think they can remain split. > > Perhaps, but I'm just not convinced of the value of a split generally. Me neither (split only when there's something to gain). > Sure you could argue that pulling in an extra lib here and there can > count for a lot of disk space, but then we end up with various problems > for other packages (like the soup issue - although granted, one as > obvious as that will likely not crop up with the more subtle extras - > until some user plugs in their dv video camera...... :p) > >> ========================= >> -ugly looks OK to me. >> >> $ urpmf --sourcerpm gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly | awk -F: '{print $1}' >> gstreamer0.10-sid >> gstreamer0.10-twolame >> gstreamer0.10-a52dec >> gstreamer0.10-cdio >> gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly >> gstreamer0.10-mpeg >> >> >> Though merging -a52dec looks like a good idea given how widely used >> the AC-3 codec is. >> >> ========================== >> I left the "bad" for last, they look OK too, each sub-package >> pulls/requires a different lib (e.g. rtmp -> librtmp.so.0), I guess >> that's a good splitting criteria; I've never used -neon so I'll take >> your word for it :) >> $ urpmf --sourcerpm gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad | awk -F: '{print $1}' | >> grep -v lib >> gstreamer0.10-rtmp >> gstreamer0.10-nas >> gstreamer0.10-rsvg >> gstreamer0.10-soundtouch >> gstreamer0.10-musepack >> gstreamer0.10-gsm >> gstreamer0.10-resindvd >> gstreamer0.10-kate >> gstreamer0.10-neon >> gstreamer0.10-voip >> gstreamer0.10-jp2k >> gstreamer0.10-ladspa >> gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-doc >> gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad >> gstreamer0.10-celt >> gstreamer0.10-schroedinger >> gstreamer0.10-mms >> gstreamer0.10-dc1394 >> gstreamer0.10-directfb >> gstreamer0.10-dirac >> gstreamer0.10-ofa >> gstreamer0.10-wildmidi >> gstreamer0.10-gme >> gstreamer0.10-vdpau >> gstreamer0.10-mpeg2enc >> gstreamer0.10-vp8 >> gstreamer0.10-cog >> gstreamer0.10-curl >> >> >> (A bit off-topic, I think -nas should be deprecated, NAS doesn't seem >> that used lately?). > > Yeah it is a bit of a grab-bag of stuff, but again, should we still just > bundle everything together anyway and sod the extra disk space needed? > It would be a lot simpler for users ("oh you need $foo? sure, just > installed -ugly/-bad") which is advise they can get direct from upstream > without having to know our particular packaging quirks. > > As someone who does upstream support for other projects, it's a pain to > put caveats in all your advice for distros you don't know. > > That said, the trade off may be too much, hence the canvassing of > opinions here :) > > Col > It would simplify things, for sure (though merging all those ones feels a bit queasy). Maybe we could experiment just to have some numbers, by installing all gst-{bad,ugly} in a clean chroot, respectively, and see how much more disk space that would eat (I could do that later on today or tomorrow). > > > > > -- > > Colin Guthrie > mageia(at)colin.guthr.ie > http://colin.guthr.ie/ > > Day Job: > Tribalogic Limited [http://www.tribalogic.net/] > Open Source: > Mageia Contributor [http://www.mageia.org/] > PulseAudio Hacker [http://www.pulseaudio.org/] > Trac Hacker [http://trac.edgewall.org/] > -- Ahmad Samir