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Resurgence
NATURE IS MY GOD
Mikhail Gorbachev
(Resurgence 184)
An Interview by Fred Matser
The name of Mikhail Gorbachev, who dismantled the
Communist empire, seems to have disappeared into distant memory. Yet, this
is the man who still holds a dream of democracy, ecology and spirituality
for Russia and for the world.
WHAT VALUES ARE important to you?
I am glad that you ask about values. The twentieth century has been
one of the most tragic centuries, a century with a lot of bloodshed,
domination and destruction. It is the most paradoxical century. On the one
hand, we have made big breakthroughs in knowledge which has resulted in new
technologies. On the other hand, because of these technological
breakthroughs, for example, nuclear weapons, our very survival is in
jeopardy. We are witnessing a breakdown of the proper relationship between
humankind and the rest of nature.
I believe that this situation has arisen because we have retreated
from the perennial values. I don't think that we need any new values. The
most important thing is to try to revive the universally known values from
which we have retreated.
As a young man, I really took to heart the Communist ideals. A young
soul certainly cannot reject things like justice and equality. These were
the goals proclaimed by the Communists. But in reality that terrible
Communist experiment brought about repression of human dignity. Violence was
used in order to impose that model on society. In the name of Communism we
abandoned basic human values. So when I came to power in Russia I started to
restore those values; values of "openness" and freedom.
When did you understand that this model had to be rejected?
There was no ''one day" when I understood. It took a whole life to
draw conclusions. But when I realized what was happening and when I had the
chance, I started to make changes. My philosophy is a philosophy based on
common sense. Common sense refers to a sense of measure, a sense of
moderation. If, for example, freedom is not linked to morality, it is not
freedom. It is permissiveness. It is just self-seeking, rather than freedom.
Life has value in itself. Even if some methods are claimed to be
progressive, if they result in destruction of life, then they are
unacceptable. I believe that the twenty-first century must be the century of
human beings living in harmony with nature, rather than being enslaved to
technology.
We must encourage those who favour economic liberalism in Russia,
but they must abandon the idea that they can use this ideological vacuum in
order to impose Westernization as a way to solve our problems. I think that
economic liberalism is no less vulnerable than Socialism or Communism.
Economic prosperity must go hand in hand with social cohesion and ecological
sustainability. What good is a lot of money when the social fabric is
destroyed and the environment polluted?
Values such as solidarity, a socially-oriented economy, and the need
to harmonize relations between humankind and the rest of nature are equally
important. The future will depend on whether we will be able to find a
synthesis, to find a fusion of ecological, liberal and social values. These
I call "the perennial values''.
I want to put great emphasis on the intrinsic value of nature,
because without nature people cannot exist. We must preserve both people and
nature. If we do not respect nature, we could eventually disappear; and once
again on Earth we could have nature without humankind. Humans gaining better
knowledge of themselves and their role in the cosmos is of paramount
importance. If we do that, then we can insure ourselves against many
dangers. Humankind should become more modest in terms of its needs and more
respectful of the environment of which we are just a part.
If we do not learn to live in harmony with nature, we shall make our
own lives hopeless and we shall eventually jeopardize our own existence. In
that sense I believe that we should go back to a new kind of renaissance.
This new renaissance should be based on the idea that people should live
more naturally.
How could people rebuild their self-respect whilst also respecting
nature?
We need to go back to the universal values in order to gain such
respect. However difficult, we should try to preserve strategies that do not
abandon those most important values. We should seek to incorporate those
values in practical ways. First of all, we have to abandon all kinds of
violence. Secondly, to understand that we should not resort to extremism.
Politicians in Russia, as elsewhere, need to understand that a free-market
economy is no guarantee for safeguarding universal values. Once you have a
free market you will not find overnight that you are living in a free
country. A lot of experience has to be gained in how to use that freedom. So
one has to be willing to go along the path step by step and incorporate
other principles. If we fail to restore human dignity and ecological
sustainability, the free market is of no use.
If the social cost and environmental cost of the free market are not
taken into account, trust will evaporate. People today are disenchanted with
politics. They do not trust politicians and feel that politicians just
regard them as the means to power.
When people want change, it is very important that they get
inspiration from the ''leaders".
There is no doubt about it. Without inspiration, all attempts at
reform would fail. Human beings are not just dust in the air; they want to
be involved in changing life for the better. Today, people with power in
Russia are incapable of being in touch with the people who initially trusted
them. The result is that the people have lost their inspiration, they live
in a survival mode. This again cultivates the old mindset, dependent on
having a good tsar or general secretary. But in a country where many nations
and ethnic groups live, you can only achieve your goals when the entire
society is involved.
Can you speak about your personal life? For example, what did you
learn from your parents?
Firstly, I learned common sense from my parents, which is so typical
of rural people. They have a feeling for nature, for the cosmos, for the
world, for real life. They are born on the land and they live on the land.
They have a feeling for that land and they know that land. Often they raise
their heads to look at the sky, not just to see the clouds that bring the
rain, but they look at the stars. People who are associated with the land
interact with the stars. This association with nature gives people a very
good hold on common sense.
I also learned modesty and humility. In rural communities there is a
lot of very hard work which brings tolerance and solidarity and this is
something I saw in my family and in my village. This has remained with me
throughout my life. I have never forgotten where I come from. Sometimes
people whose roots are from peasant stock, whose family is barely literate,
are embarrassed by it. But I am never embarrassed by it; in fact, I am proud
of my rural roots.
The wife of the president of Finland once asked me how I endured
difficult times. I said, "I have to thank my parents who were peasants and
who really put a solid foundation in me, who gave me fortitude, who gave me
stamina and a kind of wisdom.''
I also said that I was grateful to my wife. She is not just a wife,
but she is a true friend. She has shared my life in good times and in bad.
She is a great source of strength to me.
What are your spiritual beliefs?
Well, I believe in the cosmos. All of us are linked to the cosmos.
Look at the sun. If there is no sun, then we cannot exist. So nature is my
god. To me, nature is sacred. Trees are my temples and forests are my
cathedrals.
If you knew you were to die soon, what would be your message to the
world?
I am not afraid of death. Which does not mean I am indifferent to
life: I like living. I am very curious and life is interesting. I am not a
nihilist. We come to the world, we will leave the world, but I do not think
that it will be without trace. Death is not the end.
Were I to know I was going to die, I would not make a big fuss about
it. I would be living naturally as before. I would not want to use the
remaining time to send any particular message. I would use all the remaining
days to communicate and to be in contact with nature. Being at one with
nature. I remember when we went to our village. Wheat was growing. We saw a
field of wheat and in the evening we heard quails singing. It was like a
symphony, a concert. Then, during the night, I saw all those stars in the
sky and my feeling was that I was being supported by nature and that I was
dissolving into nature. So the remaining days I would just leave for this
kind of communication with nature. I would not want to trouble the living
with any message.
What does the word ''love" mean to you?
Love is a mystery of nature. I think it is good that it will remain
a mystery. Of course, there has been a lot of comment on love. First of all,
love for me is what unites man and woman. Love also unites humans and
nature. I believe that we are dealing here with a mystery that is too big
for us. Once you try to define it, it is the end of love. It dies once you
think you know its secret.
________________________________
Fred Matser has initiated many environmental projects in The
Netherlands.
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