I don't expect people on this list will stop debating this issue anytime soon 
because we hear about it constantly through the media, at least in the US. So 
why are we talking about atrocities on 10/7 rather than atrocities happening 
today like starvation as a tool of war?  I think the answer is that massive US 
media corporations are setting the agenda and we opt to swim in their wake.  
Atrocious spectacles sell ads and orient the debate a certain way.

I was never on a debate team, but I wouldn't want to defend the proposition 
"Armies don't commit atrocities" if I were.  Because we all know they do.  At 
least anyone informed enough to bother debating would at least be willing to 
look up "abu ghraib prison" or "Nisour Square massacre."  An older cohort will 
remember My Lai.  

Armies commit atrocities and you don't want them coming through your 
neighborhood.  Years ago, Hamas declared that Israeli civilians are their 
legitimate military targets,  and yet successive Israeli governments 
transferred funds to them. Netanyahu ignored warnings and the IDF was 
reportedly redeployed.  Is Natanyahu wagging the dog?  Why did Israel put their 
own people in such jeopardy?  Was it stupidity, or did Israeli leaders make a 
conscious decision to trade the safety of Israelis for a weaker Palestine and 
stronger colonization of the West Bank? That's the atrocity we need to debate.

We should focus less on their propaganda, IMHO, and more on how that propaganda 
serves US-Israel war policies.  In the US we need to keep focus on the Biden 
policy of supplying munitions that are killing tens of thousands of innocent 
civilians and we need to advocate actions that are independent of the 
Democratic Party.


Mark




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