Hi Anthony,
Obviously I don't have your knowledge and background of Northumbrian music,
so I don't have the same depth of feeling for these matters that you do. My
purpose in following the threads on this group is to get an understanding of
piping as it is, and was, from experienced people like you, and this is an
incredibly rich source of knowledge.
Because there is such a diverse range of opinions, often based on historical
or geographical connections, often deeply held, the picture is rich and
colourful. Long may that continue.
You are perhaps correct that the direct relevance of masonry to the first 30
tunes is had to see, and maybe a new title was appropriate, but as a
"thread" of thought I felt it was pertinent, and indeed the mason's decision
was perhaps food for thought. I don't think there is any wish to gloss over
the heritage, just a lack of knowledge, which is why your contribution is
so valued.
Re "many of these pieces were still
being played by a strong cohort of traditional musicians in north
Northumberland in a style which pleased them and fitted their needs
extremely well."
Do you feel, as you have used the past tense, that this is no longer so? Is
the (North?) "Northumbrian" style of playing lost apart from recordings? Has
it been subsumed by Tyneside influences? Which current players do you feel
best demonstrate that style? Is that style better/truer then other styles
currently in evidence? Should any style be preserved in aspic or should we
accept evolution, whilst treasuring, and being influenced by styles of the
past be they on vinyl or in mp3?
Discuss.
Tim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Robb" <anth...@robbpipes.com>
To: "NSP group" <nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu>; "Richard York"
<rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk>
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:20 AM
Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes
Sorry to butt in folks, especially since I'm not sure what the exact
context is! As the subject matter is the First 30 tunes the relevance
of Victorian / Medieval masonry escapes me. I do get the impression,
Richard, that you might be regarding these tunes as treasures from an
earlier age. Let me reassure you that many of these pieces were still
being played by a strong cohort of traditional musicians in north
Northumberland in a style which pleased them and fitted their needs
extremely well. It is the lack of appreciation of this and the fact
that they played their "reels" with a phrasing that was neither march,
polka or reel. This pulse fitted the dance step of choice, the Rant, so
perfectly that they referred to the tunes themselves as rants.
This was far more than a social pastime for the likes of Will Atkinson
whose payment from "The Tanner Hops" made his, Bella's and their 10
bairns lives, much more bearable. It is the glossing over of this
unique heritage that drives me to bring it to a wider audience. If you
haven't already done so buy Will Atkinson's wonderful CD and you'll see
what I mean.
Regards
Anthony
--- On Wed, 11/3/09, Richard York <rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk> wrote:
From: Richard York <rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk>
Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes
To: "NSP group" <nsp@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Date: Wednesday, 11 March, 2009, 8:48 PM
In a way, that's the least important part of the story :)
It struck me at the time what a parallel it was with our treatment of
music which comes to us from before our time, or at least before deadly
accurate sound recording, whether it's medieval or anything else.
But to answer your question, Tim, if I remember aright, he treated
them each variously according to how much was evident from the original
form, how much damage the dear Victorians had done, and in what
condition and how stable each was. Perhaps that's relevant too.
Best wishes,
Richard.
tim rolls BT wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> Hi Richard,
>>
>> Don't leave us hanging........ what did he choose to do?
>>
>>
>> Tim
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard York"
<[1]rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk>
>> To: "NSP group" <[2]...@cs.dartmouth.edu>
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 6:10 PM
>> Subject: [NSP] Re: First 30 tunes
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Some years ago I met a man who was responsible for some work on the
>>> musicians carvings in Beverley Minster, most famous of course
being the
>>> pipers.
>>> His quandary was whether to simply clean them up as they were, or
to
>>> restore them to what the Victorians had imposed on them, mistakes
and
>>> all, or to try to restore them to what he thought the medieval
carvers
>>> had intended, though that last was now very impossible to do with
any
>>> certainty, given changes in their condition over time, so he'd be
>>> imposing on them. And whatever he did would be right for some
people,
>>> wrong for others, and whatever he did they'd never be as they once
used
>>> to be.
>>> Or he could simply leave them to fall to bits by themselves.
>>>
>>> Richard.
>>>
>>> Anthony Robb wrote:
>>>>
>>>> <...>
>>>> There is much room for personal interpretation on top of this
basic
>>>> style difference. Letting people hear these differences is
important.
>>>> As for so-called "bad habits" these must surely be/have been
pleasing
>>>> to the players themselves at some point and are therefore valid
in
>>>> their own right even if others may find them displeasing.
Copying these
>>>> personal idiosyncracies is one thing, and each player can
decide this
>>>> for themselves, ignoring the regional accent completely is
another
>>>> thing altogether!
>>>> I would say go for it Colin, a person with your background can
not help
>>>> but make a valuable contribution to the body of piping
knowledge.
>>>> As aye
>>>> Anthony
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> [3]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
--
References
1.
http://uk.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rich...@lizards.force9.co.uk
2. http://uk.mc11.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=...@cs.dartmouth.edu
3. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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