Noel's python content is great, and I think a redesign would push
information like that to the forefront.
I'm willing to migrate the website, which I can play with on a personal
github.io fork. I think you had some experience with avogadro and pandoc -
how did that turn out?
Pat
On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 11:43 AM, Geoffrey Hutchison <
geoff.hutchi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I certainly agree with a need for a better website. Noel's user
> documentation (https://open-babel.readthedocs.org/en/latest/) gives a lot
> about getting started and using Python. If you have suggestions, it's
> welcome. At the moment, I don't have the time to do a website redesign.
>
> As far as packaging, it's not really our job to intercede with OS-specific
> packages. Debian, Ubuntu, etc. have managers and a set policy about updates
> and what to install with the main package (i.e., not scripting bindings -
> that's a separate package).
>
> Now, you mention having a more frequent release schedule. That'd be great,
> but I'd really need people to step up to help as release managers. Given
> 2-3 people willing to help, we can certainly get a more concrete schedule -
> which I think would also help with your frustration at older binary
> packaging.
>
> So if people can provide a little help:
> - Website, possibly migrating to GitHub pages / Jekyll (i.e., re-using the
> Sphinx documentation)
> - Volunteering to serve as release managers
>
> -Geoff
>
>
> *From: *Patrick Fuller <patrickful...@gmail.com>
>
> ...
>
> In more detail:
>
> I think that the complicated install / getting started process is
> dissuading new users. This project would focus on the new user experience,
> particularly the first 30 minutes after someone decides to try open babel.
> The goal should be to get novice programmers properly set up and writing an
> interesting script (an a-ha moment) in this time.This would lead to a
> couple of sub-projects:
>
> - Information organization. There is a ton of information in the open
> babel website, but the home page is daunting for new users. As a good
> example to follow, I’d point to django’s website
> <https://www.djangoproject.com/> - there’s a big “Get Started” button
> right when the page loads. This is an intentional choice, and described by
> the django founder in this talk
> <http://pyvideo.org/video/403/pycon-2011--writing-great-documentation>.
> - Scripting as a first-class citizen. I think a tutorial should
> cover basic tasks through the command line, C++, and python. The
> information is already on the website, but it just needs to be
> presented to
> new users quicker.
> - Installation. A large portion of scientific coders aren’t
> particularly good at software (see software carpentry
> <http://software-carpentry.org/>), and don’t have the ability / desire
> to debug things like cmake output. There are packages out there, but
> they’re tied to an old version of open babel and don’t install everything.
> Hard drive space is cheap- open babel should install everything through
> every installation method with build options to disable. Approaches:
> - OS-specific package managers, e.g. brew, apt-get, yum.
> Maintaining all of these separately is a hassle, but I’ve been told good
> things about effing package management
> <https://github.com/jordansissel/fpm> as a translator. Other
> challenges include: can’t use most recent commit (I think homebrew is an
> exception), and doesn’t play well with virtual environments out of the
> box.
> - Language-specific package managers, e.g. pip. It’s a hassle to
> compile through these package managers, but they play well with
> language-specific virtual environments and git (e.g. pip install
> git+https://github.com/openbabel/openbabel).
> - Conda. The best user experience (if the binaries work), cross-OS,
> language-agnostic, and a great virtual environment. I don’t think
> there’s
> enough support to direct all users to conda, but it would be worth
> supporting conda binaries, mentioning it in the getting started, and
> hoping
> adoption grows.
> - Versioning. New releases every x months, and ideally a simple
> workflow to propagate a new version to all supported package managers.
>
> If I can help further, let me know.
>
> Pat
>
>
>
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