At 01:22 PM 10/8/2004, Greg KH wrote:
Hi all,

Enough people have been asking me about this lately, that I thought I
would just bring it up publicly here.

It seems that the Infiniband group (IBTA) has changed their licensing
agrement of the basic Infiniband spec.  See:
        http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=18922
for more info about this.

The main point that affects Linux is the fact that now, no non-member of
the IBTA can implement any working Infiniband code, otherwise they might
run into legal problems.  As an anonymous member of a IBTA company told
me:
        If someone downloads the spec without joining the IBTA, and
        proceeds to use the spec for an implementation of the IBTA spec,
        that person (company) runs the risk of being a target of patent
        infringement claims by IBTA members.

Caution: I'm not a lawyer so the following discussion is just a personal opinion.

Spec for free or spec for a price - neither grants anyone rights to any IP contained within the specifications or on the technologies that surround the specification.  The change in spec cost, while clearly unfortunate, has no impact on the IP rights.   IP rights are defined by the IBTA membership agreement (just like they are for PCI and any number of other technologies used within the industry).  If you want to implement a technology, then you have to be a member of the appropriate organization and agree to the same industry-wide terms that others do.  Hence, this problem is not IB-specific but a fact of life within the industry.

Another person, wanting to remain anonymous stated to me:
        In justification for this position people say that they are just
        trying to get more people to join the IBTA because they need the
        dues, which by coincidence are $9500 per year, and point out
        that some other commonly used specs are similarly made available
        for steep prices. I don't know one way or the other about that
        but this sounds a lot like the reason that we all gave ourselves
        for NOT including SDP in the kernel[1].

So, even if a IBTA member company creates a Linux IB implementation, and gets it into the kernel tree, any company who ships such a implementation, who is not a IBTA member, could be the target of any patent infringement claims[2].


Again, this is true of many technologies not just IB.  For example, if a company has patents on PCI Express and someone implements a device / chipset / whatever and they are not part of the PCI-SIG, then they can be subject to different terms than someone who is a member of the PCI-SIG.  In both cases, the access to specs, etc. has nothing to do with IP licensing.

So, OpenIB group, how to you plan to address this issue?  Do you all have a position as to how you think your code base can be accepted into the main kernel tree given these recent events?

This problem isn't just an OpenIB issue.  It is true for the IETF, PCI-SIG, USB, PCMCIA, etc. which all have technologies with varying degrees of patents.  Even going beyond what is in these various industry organizations, there are also many companies who have patents on protocol off-load, OS bypass, copy avoidance, RDMA, QoS algorithms, etc.   Does any subsystem implemented in or on top of Linux suddenly stop work because there is IP involved?


thanks,

greg k-h

[1] SDP, for those who do not know, is a part of the IB spec that Microsoft has come out and stated they they currently own the patents that cover that portion of the specification, and that anyone who wants to implement it, needs to get a licensing agreement with them.  Of course, that license agreement does not allow for a GPLed version of the implementation.

SDP was derived from Winsocks Direct.  Microsoft may have IP associated with the specification.  Other companies who worked on SDP may also have IP.   One does not know all of the IP that may exist in any technology until someone attempts to enforce their rights.

[2] Sure, any person who has a copy of the kernel source tree could be a target for any of a zillion other potential claims, nothing new there, but the point here is they are explicitly stating that they will go
after non-IBTA members who touch IB code[3].

I don't see how this can be asserted.  The IBTA defines the licensing requirements for member companies.  It is the companies that own the IP that  have to enforce their IP; the IBTA has no role in the process other than to set a level playing field for those that participate in the IBTA.  This is true for other industry organizations as well.

[3] An insanely stupid position to take, given the fact that any normal industry group would be very happy to actually have people use their specification, but hey, the IB people have never been know for their brilliance in the past...

The same can be stated for many different technologies.  The IBTA is no different than the rest of the industry and was founded using the same principles already in use in the industry at that time.  In general, these operating principles are still in sync with other organizations so it is not clear that you can blame the IBTA as doing something outrageous when all of this has been known and published on the IBTA web site from the start.

Mike
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