Single page application will be really to maintain. Single page application will be really hard to maintain.
sorry On Sat, Sep 1, 2012 at 8:16 PM, Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]>wrote: > I'll read about real time communication (have no experience with it) > Single page application will be really to maintain. > I'll try to create simple chat example to test how does it fit into > multipage (most probably in the beginning of the next week) > > > On Sat, Sep 1, 2012 at 8:04 PM, [email protected] < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> I agree that there might be exceptions: >> For example the SignIn.html could stay an extra page. No need to bother >> the >> application with authentication stuff for now. >> Also as in the SignIn process there is no need for RealTime-Communication. >> But for the rest, I don't see another way, then doing it with a >> Single-Page >> Design. >> >> Sebastian >> >> 2012/9/1 [email protected] <[email protected]> >> >> > If you have multiple pages the chat will refresh everytime you change >> the >> > menu entry. It is also just an example, we could also have other >> real-time >> > updated components that should stay throughout the whole session. You >> can >> > hardly push messages to a websites if the user constantly could >> > refresh/re-enter the website. >> > I guess WebSockets also require you to stay on the same website all the >> > time, and not switch permanently from one page to another. Otherwise you >> > would constantly re-open the socket and close it xxx times when the user >> > browse's the website. >> > Page Refresh + WebSockets/Real time communication just does not fit >> > together from my point of view. >> > >> > I think you can also access the browser's URL by using JavaScript. For >> > example you could read also the GET parameters of the URL and based on >> that >> > send the user to the "bookmarked" area. >> > Anyhow, bookmarking subpages should be not the reason why we stick to >> > multi-page design. >> > >> > Sebastian >> > >> > >> > 2012/9/1 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]> >> > >> >> Hello Sebastian, >> >> >> >> I agree we need to use Ajax to make pages smooth. >> >> But I thought about multiple pages to make page bookmarking available. >> >> The main page of wicket application is currently mapped to: >> >> http://localhost:5080/openmeetings/html >> >> For example I would like to make following pages: >> >> html -- dashboard >> >> html/signin >> >> html/logout >> >> html/calendar >> >> html/admin/users >> >> etc ... >> >> >> >> all navigations/loadings will be via Ajax inside the pages above. >> >> Chat will be present as component added to the footer of the main page. >> >> (all other pages will derive from it) >> >> >> >> On Sat, Sep 1, 2012 at 2:50 PM, [email protected] < >> >> [email protected] >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> > Hi Maxim, >> >> > >> >> > thanks for adding the Wicket components! >> >> > >> >> > I would like to discuss some basic architectural questions of the >> >> > website before we are going to implement the modules in detail. >> >> > What is important to me it that we build a Single Page Application >> >> > (SPA). That means instead of generating links to subpages that >> >> > completely re-render the whole page we replace components/fragements >> >> > of the website at runtime. >> >> > From my point of view that is very important as we have a number of >> >> > components that should stay the same or initialized at runtime. >> >> > For example the Chat window should stay open no matter where you >> >> > navigate to. Or for example in the conference room you can create new >> >> > instance of the whiteboard. There is no chance to reload everything >> >> > just to add or remove a component. >> >> > >> >> > So I would like to create/find consens about a basic mechanism of how >> >> > to load and create fragements of the website at runtime in Apache >> >> > Wicket. >> >> > One solution is to load all components and only make the visible when >> >> > you need them. I don't think that this is a solution for us as we >> just >> >> > have too many components. Also I think it would be better to load at >> >> > runtime so that it is possible to create some kind of plugin loader >> >> > mechanism later. >> >> > So now comes the issue: How to realize a dynamic component loader in >> >> > Wicket? How to integrate that into our layout? >> >> > >> >> > Practically it would mean we have a single "Main.html" and >> "Main.java" >> >> > and from that one it links / dynamically loads the sub components via >> >> > Ajax. >> >> > That means that we internally of course have sub-pages, however they >> >> > are loaded via Ajax. >> >> > There is an example with Modal Dialogue's in Wickets Ajax library: >> >> > http://www.wicket-library.com/wicket-examples/ajax/modal-window?9 >> >> > A similar mechanism should be realized when you click on our main >> menu >> >> > and load the content for each sub-section (like user-administration, >> >> > dashboard, room-list, et cetera). >> >> > >> >> > What do you think, did you run into a similar problem yet? >> >> > >> >> > Thanks! >> >> > Sebastian >> >> > >> >> > 2012/8/30 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]>: >> >> > > I did create my own SignIn page ant set it in Application derived >> from >> >> > > AuthenticatedWebApplication and perform login based on the >> credentials >> >> > > entered. >> >> > > >> >> > > On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Oliver becherer >> >> > > <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> > >> kay, i see... >> >> > >> >> >> > >> are you using IAuthorizationStrategy Interface? i found that very >> >> handy >> >> > in setting up wicket apps, since it's easy to extend, when starting >> >> > >> with page based navigation rules and later on expanding to >> component >> >> > based/ action based authentication/navigation rules... >> >> > >> >> >> > >> it's also quite good when its planned to provide deep links into >> the >> >> > application, throwing user back to login page with >> >> > RestartResponseAtInterceptPageException in case he's not >> authenticated >> >> and >> >> > redirecting him to deep link page after login... >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> thanks for the update! >> >> > >> >> >> > >> O >> >> > >> >> >> > >> Am 30.08.2012 um 11:18 schrieb Maxim Solodovnik: >> >> > >> >> >> > >>>> for a better understanding : why is the login performed with >> jQuery >> >> > instead of the default Authentication mechanisms provided by wicket? >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> Standard Wicket login page was replaced with custom form so login >> >> via >> >> > >>> LDAP can be implemented. >> >> > >>> Login is not performed using jQuery, login form is just wrapped >> with >> >> > >>> jQuery dialog to look similar to current Om login dialog. >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 4:14 PM, Oliver becherer >> >> > >>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> hi, >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> this is great news for me - unfortunately, i've been inactive >> for a >> >> > long time in OM now, but will try to catch up with you guys. >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> -> Implementing Wicket as UI technology is perfect way to go, >> in my >> >> > opinion, since we can reduce the technology stack for developing OM >> on >> >> the >> >> > long run (as soon as openLaszlo is no longer required in future times >> >> ^^). >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> Chapeau! from my side... >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> for a better understanding : why is the login performed with >> jQuery >> >> > instead of the default Authentication mechanisms provided by wicket? >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> thanks! >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> O >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>> Am 30.08.2012 um 09:53 schrieb Maxim Solodovnik: >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>>>> I have no public server to run this. >> >> > >>>>> You can run it locally: >> >> > >>>>> >> >> > >>>>> 1) svn up >> >> > >>>>> 2) edit web.xml (uncomment Wicket Filter) >> >> > >>>>> 3) ant -Ddb=mysql >> >> > >>>>> 4) http://localhost:5080/openmeetings >> >> > >>>>> >> >> > >>>>> On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 2:42 PM, Alexei Fedotov >> >> > >>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>> Maxim, that's great! >> >> > >>>>>> Can I check a demo somewhere? >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>> With best regards / с наилучшими пожеланиями, >> >> > >>>>>> Alexei Fedotov / Алексей Федотов, >> >> > >>>>>> http://dataved.ru/ >> >> > >>>>>> +7 916 562 8095 >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>> On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 10:50 PM, Maxim Solodovnik < >> >> > [email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>> Just have commited Initial "HelloWorld" OM Wicket application >> >> (to >> >> > use >> >> > >>>>>>> need to uncomment wicket filter in web.xml) >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> What was done: >> >> > >>>>>>> 1) Wicket is starts and handle pages >> >> > >>>>>>> 2) All OM labels are displayed from DB >> >> > >>>>>>> 3) You can login using your OM username/pass (login dialog >> uses >> >> > jQuery >> >> > >>>>>>> UI dialog) >> >> > >>>>>>> 4) OM user levels are in effect (user or admin) >> >> > >>>>>>> 5) OM Navi menu is displayed from the DB >> >> > >>>>>>> 6) Navi link to Admin users page displays stub for admin >> users >> >> page >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> What was not done: >> >> > >>>>>>> 1) wicket currently handles all URLs (this is why it is >> >> currently >> >> > commented) >> >> > >>>>>>> 2) Entity list is not displayed from the DB as paged table >> >> (going >> >> > to >> >> > >>>>>>> do as next task) >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> Please take a look and tell me what do you think? >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 5:08 PM, [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>> There have been no votes against using OpenLaszlo and >> compile >> >> to >> >> > >>>>>>>> DHTML. However the OpenLaszlo project seems currently no >> more >> >> > >>>>>>>> maintained. There has been no release since 2010 of the >> >> project. >> >> > The >> >> > >>>>>>>> comunity has downsized by factor of 10. >> >> > >>>>>>>> This is the community activity in the last years: >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > http://www.openlaszlo.org/pipermail/laszlo-dev/2012-June/024912.html >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> It is likely that if we are switching to DHTML that we will >> run >> >> > into >> >> > >>>>>>>> issues as soon as new browser features of HTML5 will come >> up as >> >> > the >> >> > >>>>>>>> Openlaszlo platform does not implement them. It would be >> >> actually >> >> > our >> >> > >>>>>>>> task not only to develop OpenMeetings but also OpenLaszlo. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> As DHTML compilation is a quite future orientated task I >> think >> >> we >> >> > >>>>>>>> should choose technology that support mobile devices and >> >> > constantly >> >> > >>>>>>>> improves its cross-browser capibilities. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> And last but not least the question is of course: How can we >> >> > attract >> >> > >>>>>>>> new users? Chossing OpenLaszlo does actively look-out >> people as >> >> > they >> >> > >>>>>>>> are not willing to learn it. We will have much better >> chances >> >> to >> >> > find >> >> > >>>>>>>> new contributors if we choose a technology people are >> familiar >> >> > with. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> jQuery and Wicket do not bundle out of the box, simply >> because >> >> > jQuery >> >> > >>>>>>>> is an UI framework and Wicket is a server side framework. >> There >> >> > are >> >> > >>>>>>>> projects and components that combine jQuery and Wicket >> >> > >>>>>>>> code.google.com/p/wiquery/ >> >> > >>>>>>>> code.google.com/p/jqwicket/ >> >> > >>>>>>>> code.google.com/p/wickext/ >> >> > >>>>>>>> code.google.com/p/wicket-jquery-ui/ >> >> > >>>>>>>> www.7thweb.net/jquery-ui-samples/ >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> And those are only the "projects" actually combining those >> >> > >>>>>>>> technologies needs nothing more then an import statement of >> the >> >> > jQuery >> >> > >>>>>>>> library in the page header. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> *It make little sense copying existing workflow. It adds >> value >> >> to >> >> > >>>>>>>> improve the workflow.* >> >> > >>>>>>>> => I agree on that, however Flash is dead. We have to >> provide a >> >> > DHTML >> >> > >>>>>>>> alternative. We will not replace our server side workflow. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> *We need to add value to the product on any step. That >> makes us >> >> > >>>>>>>> user-oriented, not technology oriented.* >> >> > >>>>>>>> => We will keep existing Flash frontend as long as its >> needed. >> >> It >> >> > is >> >> > >>>>>>>> my intention to have a running OpenMeetings package all the >> >> time. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> *Maybe we should use java management API and embed the >> existing >> >> > >>>>>>>> management console? >> >> > >>>>>>>> Maybe we should ship admin as a separate release bundle? >> >> Splitting >> >> > >>>>>>>> will help re-using other technologies. >> >> > >>>>>>>> Maybe we should ask designer guys on look & feel concept, >> and >> >> > apply it >> >> > >>>>>>>> to our product?* >> >> > >>>>>>>> => Sorry but now you are actually the one the broadens the >> >> whole >> >> > >>>>>>>> discussion to a much larger scale. >> >> > >>>>>>>> I agree with you that we need to define small steps to >> improve >> >> > our project. >> >> > >>>>>>>> But having more modularization like "separate release >> bundle" >> >> has >> >> > >>>>>>>> actually nothing to do with DHTML compilation. It is just >> >> another >> >> > >>>>>>>> topic. Same as "ask designer guys on look & feel concept". >> >> > >>>>>>>> This is just not the topic of DHTML or not. You can do it >> >> > regardless >> >> > >>>>>>>> if you compile DHTML or Flash. >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> 2012/8/28 Alexei Fedotov <[email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>> I do not stop people from volunteering. My thanks to Maxim >> >> for 1) >> >> > >>>>>>>>> proactivity; 2) good technology choice. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> I missed few items, Maxim told the first one is somewhere >> in >> >> the >> >> > thread. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 1. Why not to recompile OpenLaszlo to DHTML? >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 2. What is the plan and is it actually doable? What is time >> >> > estimate? >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> My friend who worked for our competior told me that they >> have >> >> > >>>>>>>>> re-written design four times during the last for years. We >> >> don't >> >> > have >> >> > >>>>>>>>> resources for this. So my suggestion would be the >> following: >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 1. Find Openmeetings usability problems or most wanted >> >> features. >> >> > Maybe >> >> > >>>>>>>>> Marco can help. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 2. Develop that using new technology, making minor >> >> adjustments to >> >> > >>>>>>>>> already working things. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> So main concerns >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 1. It make little sense copying existing workflow. It adds >> >> value >> >> > to >> >> > >>>>>>>>> improve the workflow. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> 2. We need to add value to the product on any step. That >> >> makes us >> >> > >>>>>>>>> user-oriented, not technology oriented. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> How good wicket is with jquery? It does not seem to work >> with >> >> > jquery >> >> > >>>>>>>>> out of the box. >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>> With best regards / с наилучшими пожеланиями, >> >> > >>>>>>>>> Alexei Fedotov / Алексей Федотов, >> >> > >>>>>>>>> http://dataved.ru/ >> >> > >>>>>>>>> +7 916 562 8095 >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 11:51 AM, [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> What are your alternatives? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> There are already people volunteering to start >> contributing >> >> to >> >> > it. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> It can be realized without breaking functionality, we >> still >> >> > have the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Flash interface available while we build DHTML. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Thanks! >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/28 Alexei Fedotov <[email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Guys, please do not rush, let me think a bit. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> With best regards / с наилучшими пожеланиями, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> Alexei Fedotov / Алексей Федотов, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> http://dataved.ru/ >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> +7 916 562 8095 >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 27, 2012 at 12:55 PM, [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ok >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/27 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> I prefer develop in trunk. I would vote for this >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 27, 2012 3:49 PM, "[email protected]" < >> >> > [email protected]> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> That sounds good. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Do you want to create a new branch for the DHTML tree >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> or will trunk become the DHTML tree and we create a >> 2.1 >> >> > branch ? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/27 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We need to add following lines to our ivy.xml: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <dependency org="org.apache.wicket" >> >> > name="wicket-core" >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rev="6.0.0-beta3" conf="openmeetings->*"/> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and that is all >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can create "sample Om main page" and them both of >> as >> >> can >> >> > add >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> components to it. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 27, 2012 at 3:38 PM, >> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wickets standard project setup require Maven. What >> is >> >> > your proposal to >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> integrate Wicket into the current stack? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/27 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't really understand why do we need maven? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why ant+ivy is not enough? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I always thought it is similar tools. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Could you please explain it? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 27, 2012 at 2:10 PM, >> >> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well lets give it a try with Wicket. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However when it comes to the real collaboration >> and >> >> UI >> >> > effects I think >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we will heavily use jQuery. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We will first have to integrate our application >> in a >> >> > Maven styled >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> project. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I guess we can still use ANT to compile certain >> >> aspect >> >> > of our >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> application, Maven can trigger ANT build scripts. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> http://maven.apache.org/plugins/maven-antrun-plugin/ >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seems to be a perfect tool for us. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However some of the Ivy dependency management >> might >> >> be >> >> > difficult to >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> set up. Lets try that out. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/27 Maxim Solodovnik <[email protected] >> >: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Sebastian, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sorry for the late reply (was out of city with no >> >> > internet access) >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While proposing using Apache Wicket I thought of >> >> > following: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Displaying of lists: configuration, language >> >> > labels, rooms etc. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) Use of Ajax to refresh only parts of page >> >> displayed. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We definitely can use JS libraries (like jQuery >> UI) >> >> > only but this >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> will >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> make code less readable. I believe Apache Wicket >> >> will >> >> > be good for >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Admin menu etc. And we can easily add jQuery UI >> to >> >> it. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Instead of Wicket we can use Spring MVC and >> >> Velocity. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have proposed Wicket only because I have more >> >> > experience with it >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from my point of view it is easy to maintain. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Aug 27, 2012 at 12:23 AM, >> >> > [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> After some discussion I would like to propose to >> >> > integrate Apache >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wicket and try it out. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have update the document: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OPENMEETINGS/DHTML+Proposal >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Please add your notes. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 [email protected] < >> >> > [email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This would be my proposal: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OPENMEETINGS/DHTML+Proposal >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 [email protected] < >> >> > [email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What if we instead of Apache Wicket use Apache >> >> > Velocity to >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> provide the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> basic structure of the HTML websites? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All dynamically loaded data, rendering of >> items >> >> > could be then >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> done by jQuery. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That way we will have a set of html templates >> to >> >> > work on and a UI >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> framework to manipulate it. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 [email protected] < >> >> > [email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would like to share this use-case >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In the next iteration I would like to put the >> >> Chat >> >> > box as a >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> permanent >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> box similar to what is in Google+ and >> Facebook >> >> on >> >> > the bottom. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That mean no matter where you go, admin >> section, >> >> > room list, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> dashboard >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> => the chat always stays the same, so a >> complete >> >> > page refresh is >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> not possible. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would simply replace the DIV that contains >> the >> >> > main content >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with new >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one when switching between main menu entries. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What do you think about that? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How would that affect the framework >> discussion? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 [email protected] < >> >> > [email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When it comes to rendering and UI component >> >> > frameworks you come >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> projects like: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> code.google.com/p/wiquery >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.7thweb.net/jquery-ui-samples/ >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Simple search for "Apache Wicket UI samples" >> >> and >> >> > you find tons >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> jQuery examples that are used in Apache >> Wicket. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So from my point of view Apache Wicket is >> >> simply >> >> > no UI >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> framework. It >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is a web-framework. How things render is not >> >> part >> >> > of it. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Practically >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it might mean that we could combine Apache >> >> Wicket >> >> > with jQuery >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> too. But >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> why use Apache Wicket then at all? We have >> >> > already a backend >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with Rest >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Services and everything. Wicket would >> duplicate >> >> > that. What >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> parts of >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wicket would we really use? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 [email protected] < >> >> > [email protected]>: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Can you show examples of Apache Wicket UI >> >> > widgets and >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> animation? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2012/8/24 Maxim Solodovnik < >> >> [email protected] >> >> > >: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would recommend to review Apache Wicket. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is MVC it has lots of UI components >> like >> >> > paged lists table >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> views etc. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It had built-in AJAX support. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In general I'll vote for moving to DHTML >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 24, 2012 3:57 PM, " >> >> [email protected]" >> >> > < >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I would like to start a discussion about >> >> > options to migrate >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and a >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Roadmap for the upcomfing versions. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is our current situation: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We currently have two client side >> >> application >> >> > a) + b) >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a) Audio/Video related stuff is all the >> >> SWF10 >> >> > app >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> b) whiteboard, administration + all the >> rest >> >> > in the SWF8 app. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The two SWFs communicate via >> LocalConnection >> >> > with each other. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are three options from my point of >> >> view: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) refactor the SWF8 app to SWF11 and >> keep >> >> the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> LocalConnection >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2) refactor the SWF8 and merge SWF8 with >> >> SWF10 >> >> > app to a >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> single SWF11 >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> app and get rid of the LocalConnection >> >> > workaround >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3) refactor the SWF8 app to HTML5 and >> only >> >> use >> >> > SWF for the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> audio/video >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> part. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option 1 is the easiest thing to do >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option 2 is the best from architecture >> point >> >> > of view >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option 3 is the best for moving to HTML5 >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From my point of view it would be the >> best >> >> > option to start >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> DHTML >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> refactoring now (in a version 3.0 branch) >> >> and >> >> > release the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> current >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> trunk tree (as version 2.1). >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For the transition to DHTML we have >> several >> >> > options: >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I) Refactor to DHTML using OpenLaszlo >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> II) Refactor to DHTML using a JavaScript >> >> > framework (jQuery, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dojo, >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache Wicket, Spring+MVC) >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My personal preference is using jQuery. >> It >> >> > provides >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> components for UI >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and animation and is the most widespread. >> >> From >> >> > a project >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> point of view >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it will be more easy to attract new >> >> developers >> >> > if they can >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> use tools >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that they are comfortable in. And I >> really >> >> > don't want to >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> code a client >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> side application that requires heavy >> usage >> >> of >> >> > the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> page-refresh. That >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be like moving back in time. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are some architectural questions >> that >> >> we >> >> > should >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> discuss for the >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JavaScript refactoring. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However there should be some kind of >> consens >> >> > on the overall >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> RoadMap first. >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So what do you think? >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WBR >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WBR >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WBR >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>>> Sebastian Wagner >> >> > >>>>>>>> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > >>>>>>>> http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > >>>>>>>> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > >>>>>>>> [email protected] >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> >> >> > >>>>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>>>> WBR >> >> > >>>>>>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >>>>> >> >> > >>>>> >> >> > >>>>> >> >> > >>>>> -- >> >> > >>>>> WBR >> >> > >>>>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >>>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> >> >> > >>> -- >> >> > >>> WBR >> >> > >>> Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >> >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > -- >> >> > > WBR >> >> > > Maxim aka solomax >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Sebastian Wagner >> >> > https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> >> > http://www.webbase-design.de >> >> > http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> >> > [email protected] >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> WBR >> >> Maxim aka solomax >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Sebastian Wagner >> > https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> > http://www.webbase-design.de >> > http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> > [email protected] >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Sebastian Wagner >> https://twitter.com/#!/dead_lock >> http://www.webbase-design.de >> http://www.wagner-sebastian.com >> [email protected] >> > > > > -- > WBR > Maxim aka solomax > -- WBR Maxim aka solomax
