Adding the users list. Cheers, Mathi.
-----Original Message----- From: Guilherme Moro [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, November 18, 2016 11:45 PM To: Arndt, Jonas Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: [devel] Openstack By the way, does anyone has anything at all like that already? I mean, in shareable code/examples. On 18 November 2016 at 18:09, Guilherme Moro <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi, > > some comments inline, but be aware is mostly a mental exercise from my > part, a brainstorm if you will :) > > On 17 November 2016 at 15:59, Arndt, Jonas <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi Guilherme, >> >> I don't think there currently is an effort inside the OpenSAF Project >> to accomplish this. There are many different use cases here though >> and I wanted to understand exactly which of these you think would be >> the first thing to go after. >> >> (1) OpenStack Services >> In this scenario OpenSAF could be used to give service availability >> to the actual OpenStack's centralized services (e.g. NOVA, Cinder, >> Neutron, Keystone...). >> > Here we have the basic scenario, Openstack is not capable of HA > alone, and right now all upgrades are quite painful and prone to > errors, maybe upgrade campaigns could prove useful for people working > on getting stable and reliable upgrades? Maybe even make some of the > components SA_AWARE so they could be pre-instantiable? > Apart from the obvious fit, most of the conversation in Openstack > communities is shifting with the trend to containerize Openstack > components and rely on kubernetes and the likes for this job, not sure > how HA this can be tho, not enough information, maybe is worth exploring. > >> >> (2) OpenStack computes >> Here we could monitor VMs health and restart as needed. The trick >> here is of course to make sure that NOVA is in sync with this. For >> quick restarts on the same node it might be less of a problem but in >> scenarios when a whole node goes down NOVA needs to be involved. >> Should we here sit between NOVA and libvirt or should we change NOVA >> itself? Would OpenStack embrace such change? >> Then there is Neutron and detecting issues with networking. We could >> obviously plug into OVS and detect issues here. This would be a "No >> Redundancy" type of approach as OVS wouldn't fail over. How to >> isolate and recover? What about DPDK enabled OVS? How to tie into Neutron... >> > I would think that is a good scenario to explore as well, but I lack > the insight in how openstack implemented that. > But to exemplify I will talk about a scenario I saw, and that > initially triggered my idea of asking here in this list, > - deployment is done through HEAT templates > - you have no way to guarantee that the resources created will be > there, meaning, if a instance described in the template crashes, you > have no way to know. > > They started a revamp in HEAT so he could a smarter engine, they > created what they called convergence engine, a lot of the work is > already in place, and they have a better way to control resources > while creating them, but after is created there's no monitoring, they > have the blueprint to do what they are calling continuous-observer, > that would restart machines (and associate resources) in case of them > disappearing, but this work was postponed (was supposed to be > delivered in the Newton release) and from the info I got in their > community seems it's not coming in the next release either, MAYBE the next > after that. > >> >> (3) SA_AWARE VNFs >> We could also offer up OpenSAF APIs to the VNFs (or applications >> inside >> VMs) so that the VNF vendor could use these APIs to develop SA_AWARE >> solutions. Kind of like HA as a service. The big question here is >> whether or not anybody would use these APIs. >> > This could prove useful, Telcos will probably be willing to try it at > least > >> >> I am sure there are many more use cases here but this is what I could >> thinks about initially. Feel free to comment on what you feel is the >> low hanging fruit or what to go after first. Also, the OpenSAF >> project historically have not stepped outside the AIS spec much. That >> is, any solutions on top of OpenSAF is not really addressed by the >> project. That's why you don't see a flashy GUI that shows you the >> status of the cluster and so on. >> >> As you said, there are probably several areas of overlapping and > integration points. > I understand that the idea is to be a "framework" and not a do-it-all > thing, not trying to push any funny idea here :) In a general rant > now, my main point here is that, besides all the buzz, Openstack and > cloud in general does not give you HA like they keep saying, not five > nines at least, and I keep struggling to understand why they keep > feeding this NIH syndrome instead of trying to rely or at least > leverage prior work/studies done in the area. The example I gave for > example, I know already some people trying to circumvent the problem > using a mix of the available components they have (e.g. > https://www.openstack.org/ > videos/video/building-self-healing-applications-with- > aodh-zaqar-and-mistral), so basically would be very similar to the AIS > approach, a monitoring system with alarming (aodh), a messaging system > (zaqar) and a task scheduler (mistral). > So basically I see that at several levels the AIS specs are still very > relevant, and maybe some demos could show that there's a lot of value > in trying some sort of integration. > But let's get this conversation going, I just started thinking in > possible scenarios, and initially my idea was to implement a very > simple demo showing OpenSAF doing this piece of monitoring/restarting > they are lacking and trying to get done. > > Cheers, > > Guilherme > > Cheers, >> >> // Jonas >> >> >> ----Original Message----- >> From: Guilherme Moro [mailto:[email protected]] >> Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 10:52 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: [devel] Openstack >> >> Hi, >> >> Is there anyone working/planning/thinking anything related to >> Openstack and OpenSAF integration? >> >> I know that in the very basic there would be two scenarios, using >> OpenSAF to run Openstack itself (currently they use >> Pacemaker/corosync to achieve >> HA) and running OpenSAF within the VM's to achieve application HA. >> >> Is there anyone thinking beyond this point? >> >> Regards, >> >> Guilherme Moro >> >> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Opensaf-devel mailing list [email protected] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opensaf-devel ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Opensaf-users mailing list [email protected] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/opensaf-users
