On Mon, 13 May 2002 09:15:06 +0200, Koos de Heer wrote: "a truely free being does not exist. We are always "influenced by external factors. It is how we perceive that influence "that determines whether it makes us unhappy or not.
Dear Koos, what you wrote there reminds me of an old development-phasis-model widely used in group dynamics laboratories which started to spread in Europe around the time, Koestler developed his model: 1) Dependency: you accept the 'givens' (given by an authority) as beeing unchangeable. Or: you do, what you are told to do And: You do not want to be free, but to be secure You perceive your envirenment in its quality of being WARM and FRIENDLY 2) Counterdependency: analyzing your situation you perceive, that you do not want do accept any 'givens' of the authority, believing, that beeing free means not to depend from anybody. Or: you do, what you are told, NOT to do. And: you want to be free and are ready to pay whatever price it costs you. So, you are also dependent, but inversely to the first phasis of development You perceive your envirenment in its quality of being RIGID an HOSTILE 3) Interdependency: You perceive, that there is always somebody or something influencing you, BUT you also perceive, that a) you are able to influence the others (your situation) b) you are still free to act on basis of informed choice (that goes along the line, you argued in your post. i.e. you perceive that you never can get rid of the fact that there are givens). Or: you neither always do, what you are told to do, nor do you always do, what you are told NOT to do, but decide on basis of a clear perception of the complex system of influence, what you think, is the Best (or less Bad). This brings a completely different definition of being free, than you had being in the counterdependency phasis. You perceive your self and your environment in the qualities of being WARM & COLD & PLASTIC 1 is the background of false peace (dominance & submission) 2 is the background of revolts and wars 3 is the background for creativity, mediation and true peace processes Now, this model of group dynamics says something I really hated (2), when I was young (1,2): It is a given (that can not be changed), that you start with 1 and It is a given, that you can not reach 3 without passing by 2. For me this model has some key-qualities for this ongoing discussion-thread of the oslist, (and even some other actual and old threads). I would be interested to know, if it seems also useful for you or others in the list. Bernhard ----- [email protected] 13.05.2002 at 14:30:16 (GMT/UT + 02:00) My anti-virus precautions: 1) attached to this e-mail : No file 2) All attached files are mentioned by name in the line above.Please do not open any other attachment! 3) Please send text documents in RichTextFormat/*.rtf, if possible. This also facilitates communication between the mac- and ms-world. ---- Bernd Weber Organization Development Consultant "DEVELOP YOUR CAPACITIES - MATERIALIZE YOUR VISION" C.P. 1462, Beira, Sofala, MOZAMBIQUE fone: +258-3-32 98 59, cellfone:+258-82-43 79 77 ----- WB-TrainConsult management- & human resources training, consulting & development ----- Gumpendorfer Straße 88b/18, AT-1060 Wien, AUSTRIA fone & fax: +431 596 86 57 ----- Inscricao no grupo de discussao "Sistemas organizacionais": Escrever um email para o endereco <[email protected]> * * ========================================================== [email protected] ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of [email protected], Visit: http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html
