That's on my list for 0.44... not there yet though (and I'm up to my eyes in debugging problems right now :)
M On Sat, Nov 03, 2012 at 01:16:49PM -0700, Scott R. Looney wrote: > for me, it's more a matter that a lot of objects are available that make > the basic coding and patch building tasks themselves much easier. the one > that currently comes to mind is [coll] which is part of cyclone. i really > have no idea what can be substituted for it that only requires PD vanilla, > but i'm coming from Max, and not having good list management is an obstacle. > > is there is a good way for PD-vanilla to read and manipulate a list of > lists like coll? or split lists? i can make my own [counter] and [swap] > objects easily enough, but having no obvious and apparent means of > storage/recall/manipulation, except arrays and tables which are one index > one value. not trying to pull this off the licensing discussion, but i'm > trying to point out a genuine storage/manipulation need here. i'm happy to > stay with vanilla only if PD can do these things. [qlist] + [textfile] are > the closest but seem to come with severe manipulation restrictions. cyclone > comes with [zl] manipulation. > > if i'm needlessly complaining please let me know. i'm just a midrange > MaxMSP guy trying to see how to get something running on iOS. > > scott > > > > On Sat, Nov 3, 2012 at 10:51 AM, Dan Wilcox <danomat...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I'll chime in on what Peter said. > > > > Pd-Extended itself doesn't have a global license, the licenses are > > individual to the externals. libpd itself is BSD so we can use it on iOS > > while some externals are GPL and we can't. I personally would *like* to > > have some available, but I also value the GPL and would not wish anyone to > > change a license just for my convenience at a cost to protections the GPL > > is designed to ensure. I'm not anti-Apple or anti-GPL, it's just a > > pragmatic approach to getting a working solution on good hardware. > > Unfortunately, Android still does not have good audio latency worked out, > > for instance. > > > > As I told Frank B, I've seen the "vanilla light". There is a whole lot you > > can do without externals and I'd highly recommend checking out rjlib: > > https://github.com/rjdj/rjlib. I will be rebuilding my patch library to > > work with rjlib and be vanilla compatible as it's the best way to know it > > works in libpd-land as well as on desktop. > > > > On Nov 3, 2012, at 11:08 AM, pd-list-requ...@iem.at wrote: > > > > *From: *Peter Kirn <pe...@createdigitalmedia.net> > > *Subject: **Re: [PD] Licensing issues (was rjdj is gone, robotcowboy is > > coming ...)* > > *Date: *November 3, 2012 7:17:06 AM EDT > > *To: *pd-list <pd-list@iem.at> > > > > > > Hello, I just want to chime in here. > > > > I don't think it's accurate to say pd-extended is "GPL." pd-extended is > > essentially a distribution of externals, abstractions, and other > > conveniences. Obviously, developers are free to use what license they want. > > > > Yes, libpd and Pd-vanilla use an extremely permissive license. > > > > I believe it's possible to develop free software for iOS. I think on > > reflection it makes a stronger statement to reach that platform - > > locked-down as it may be - with free software than it does to ignore it. > > This means using a BSD- or MIT-style license and not GPL or LGPL; the > > earlier thread was right. Note that I think you *can* use a copyleft > > license for your patches, because these will run independently of iOS. > > > > There are other reasons - compatibility and simplicity being foremost - to > > favor vanilla in development with libpd whether or not you're using iOS. I > > think we may be overstating the problem here a bit. > > > > In other words, yes, Apple has a problem with GPL. But libpd developers I > > think don't have a problem with Apple, if that makes sense. And I think we > > make a stronger statement by showing how well the free solution works than > > we do banging our head against a brick wall. > > > > I believe in the GPL license, which is why we're using it on MeeBlip. But > > I think the short answer is, use BSD with libpd, try to default to vanilla, > > and maximize the contexts with which your software can be used. Add GPL or > > copyleft to patches to encourage others to share. That for me seems a > > pretty nice solution. > > > > Now, Apple aside, it does seem that it makes sense for external developers > > to use the same license as Pd. (Patches and abstractions are a different > > issues, because they're effectively content rather than part of your code.) > > But that's up to developers. > > > > Peter > > > > > > -------- > > Dan Wilcox > > danomatika.com > > robotcowboy.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list@iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list@iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list _______________________________________________ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list