On 10/22/2013 02:52 PM, Dan Wilcox wrote:
On Oct 22, 2013, at 1:07 PM, pd-list-requ...@iem.at
<mailto:pd-list-requ...@iem.at> wrote:
*From:*Jonathan Wilkes <jancs...@yahoo.com <mailto:jancs...@yahoo.com>>
*Subject:**Re: [PD] Building externals on OSX*
*Date:*October 22, 2013 1:14:41 PM EDT
*To:*pd-list@iem.at <mailto:pd-list@iem.at>
On 10/21/2013 09:38 PM, Dan Wilcox wrote:
Errr. That's not so easy. You need the 10.5 SDK which you can only
get with a *really* old version of Xcode which you probably can't
install on anything newer than OSX 10.6. It's possible to put older
SDK's themselves into the "right place" but, for something as old as
the 10.5 SDK, it may not even work anymore. The only reliabel way to
use an old machine with 10.5 or 10.6 and an old version of Xcode,
probably Xcode 3.something.
IMHO, at this point, it's best to drop support for PPC for new
versions of pd. The *vast vast vast* majority of OSX users have
moved on at this point.
Just to make sure I understand: if someone has an old PPC Mac, they
cannot
run stuff compiled for i386 or x86_64. There is no
compatibility-mode or anything
they can use to run the software. Is this correct?
Yes. It's a different instruction set and Rosetta, the PCC
compatibility layer, won't run an OSX 10.7+.
Well, if it's an enormous amount of trouble to continue supporting it
then I can see dropping it.
Also, do you have any references for the claim that the vast majority
of OSX
users have moved away from PPC?
http://update.omnigroup.com/ (Hardware / CPU type): Intel 97.8% PPC 2.2%
https://www.adium.im/sparkle/ (CPU type): Intel 97.83% PPC 2.71%
Thanks. Those are low numbers, but I'd imagine the number of PPC users is
still fairly high:
http://www.statisticbrain.com/apple-computer-company-statistics/
I find Jobs' claim that Apple doesn't ship
junk to generally be true, and combined with their development model the
unfortunate result would seem to be that poor people still using
their once
sleek and sexy devices are ignored along with their now ugly,
unprofitable
devices.
Well, those "sleek and sexy" PPC devices were last made & sold in
2005, so it's not a surprise the vast majority of people using OSX
have Intel machines mainly because software developers (& the OS) have
moved on to 32 bit and now 64 bit intel years ago.
Debian supports PPC, no? Anyone know how it does on the old machines?
I suppose since Pd is in the repos one could say it still supports PPC. :)
Your political bias notwithstanding (I say use what works for you),
Well, I'd call it a political stance. And where it seemed quirky and deeply
personal when I first adopted it, it now seems simply to be a restatement
of the scientific method for computer security, at a time when there have
been revelations that show our computers really need to be as secure as
possible against attacks.
I'd also point out that yours is a political stance. While I understand
it, I must disagree with it because in terms of security it is much more
difficult to use the scientific method to check whether the specs actually
fit the implementation. In some cases on proprietary OSes neither are
known so you're forced to reverse engineer the software, and for
complex systems that's too time consuming and expensive to do.
I have a 4 year old Apple laptop that still does everything I need
with the latest version of OSX and I plan to upgrade to OSX Mavericks
when it comes out. That's pretty good, as I had a job when I bought it
and I am currently an unemployed artist working on his thesis right
now, so it's good this "sleek and sexy device" is not yet an "ugly,
unprofitable" one. As with anything, not everyone buys the newest one
every iteration and I can say, without any hardware issues whatsoever
so far, I got what I paid for.
In any case, I've long thought of helping with the OSX compatibility
for Pd (updating GEM to Cocoa/64 bit for instance) but I honestly
don't have the time or support right now. Maybe next spring I can do a
"reverse kickstarter"?
It's probably a much better idea to just do a "Kickstarter". :)
Best,
Jonathan
--------
Dan Wilcox
@danomatika
danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com>
robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com>
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