> > Reading this question makes me feel uncomfortable. How would defining > above criteria shape the way the documentation is going to be built? > And isn't using that criteria to define the shape presumptuous, forcing > you and me to make assumptions about groups of people you're/I'm not > part of? IMHO, inclusiveness is not achieved with identity politics.
Thanks thanks a lot for taking a stand and explaining gaps in my communication! What I pretend is to put ourselves open to welcome other points of view, welcome the needs of others than us when they surface. I don't know at this moment how to surface this need without some friction. Sorry about that and I think we can continue from the point of the explicitness of the need of welcoming diverse points of view. I'm sorry for not giving you a more interesting/challenging view. I'm > not saying the documentation cannot be improved, but I fail to see > obvious problems with it. OTOH, I'm interested to hear about problems > people face with the current documentation. I think you showed strong points of the actual documentation that has to be kept in a review if needed. About the point 2. It is addressed to open the scope of feedbacks. I think that the effort to create a new standard for documentation should cover as many opinions as possible at first (like this one). It's like a brainstorm. Then we will try to systematize and organize the material we have in order to constitute a form that satisfies everyone as much as possible with easy maintenance, open to collaborations. Thanks again Roman! Em ter., 25 de mai. de 2021 às 11:00, Roman Haefeli <reduz...@gmail.com> escreveu: > Hi > > On Mon, 2021-05-24 at 20:49 -0300, Esteban Viveros wrote: > > > 1. What is the audience that you believe will make use of the Pd > > documentation? Things like, advanced english speakers, academics, the > > gender, low/high earning power, if they are programmers, musicians, > > open source people, nationality... whatever you can write in a few > > words. > > Reading this question makes me feel uncomfortable. How would defining > above criteria shape the way the documentation is going to be built? > And isn't using that criteria to define the shape presumptuous, forcing > you and me to make assumptions about groups of people you're/I'm not > part of? IMHO, inclusiveness is not achieved with identity politics. > > I'm rather interested in what _you_ think is wrong with existing > documentation and what _you_ think how it can be improved. I think this > would lead to a more honest discussion. > > Just to give you one data point: > > For me the most important part is a comprehensive reference. Pd already > covers what I need with the existing help-files (section 5) describing > object classes and their supported methods. However, the reference is > only interesting once you know how the language works and when you are > familiar with its concepts. I learned Pd with the documentation it is > delivered with. So, the sections 1-4 - for me at least - already did a > great job at introducing me into Pd. Having said that, it took me years > until I even tried to use data structures and I am not even sure I > understand them now. > > I'm sorry for not giving you a more interesting/challenging view. I'm > not saying the documentation cannot be improved, but I fail to see > obvious problems with it. OTOH, I'm interested to hear about problems > people face with the current documentation. > > > 2. Issues you see in actual way to document the objects, suggestions > > to improve documentation to meet your imagined pd user. > > Why imagined? What you think is already interesting I find. Also, you > may have made your experiences with other Pd users and gained some > insight from that? > > Roman > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list@lists.iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Esteban Viveros www.estebanviveros.com
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