hi, I was reffering to a high quality reference file, similar to a RAW but already optimized and saved in a low compression jpeg format, not a file just suitable for 4x6 prints. jco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Maas Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 8:06 AM To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: K10D review online
The irony of this is that for prints, especially small ones like the 4x6's that are the most popular for general use, the Pentax JPEG output is actually better than a more heavily sharpened print. Most minilabs oversharpen everything they print. -Adam J. C. O'Connell wrote: > I would think the goal of the highest quality level jpeg output is to > make it as closely as possible match what you can do with a RAW file > tweeked and saved as a jpeg, but do it automatically. This simply > may not be possible any or all the time, but its a good goal to try to > achieve. > I think that some of these diehard RAW users may be forgetting that > one of the biggest "features" of any digtal camera is for instant > results on the output. If you have to go spend a lot of time tweeking > each one of RAW images in photoshop, that good "feature" is lost. > jco > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf > Of Tom C > Sent: Saturday, December 16, 2006 1:06 AM > To: pdml@pdml.net > Subject: Re: K10D review online > > > Then they misread what MOST people, not myself, MOST people want out > of the camera. That is the best possible result w/o any post-exposure > manipulation. > > I don't know why they refuse to get that simple fact. If we shoot RAW > it's one thing, but people readiing the review thatwant the best > possible .jpg > w/o manipulation will likely fail to be impressed. > > Tom C. > > > > >> From: Godfrey DiGiorgi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List <pdml@pdml.net> >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List <pdml@pdml.net> >> Subject: Re: K10D review online >> Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2006 18:02:08 -0800 >> >> >> On Dec 15, 2006, at 5:21 PM, Alexandru-Cristian Sarbu wrote: >> >>> .. In fact now I'm thinking that the jpeg "issue" may be a design >>> decision. *If* it's tuned for better tonal gradation (I hope I'm >>> using the correct words), the dynamic range will be lowered (since >>> you have only 8 bits/channel to store the data). But I have no idea >>> if this is really the case. .. >> I am sure that this is the case. >> >> There is a thread at DPReview >> http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp? >> forum=1036&message=21284539 >> where someone is calling for a mass request to Pentax for a firmware >> update. I found this reply interesting. >> >>> Forum Pentax SLR Talk >>> Subject received this reply: >>> Posted by chrswggl >>> Date/Time 9:03:20 PM, Friday, December 15, 2006 (GMT) >>> >>> >>> >>> Dear Sir/Madam, >>> >>> Thank you for contacting Pentax. >>> >>> Quotes from DPReview: >>> http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pentaxk10d/page11.asp >>> >>> "Sharpness: >>> As we have seen on previous Pentax digital SLR's the default >>> sharpness level is a little more conservative than other cameras, >>> that's not a bad thing and simply means that if you want your images > >>> a little sharper out of the camera just select +1 or +2. We also >>> note that Pentax appear to be using a sharpening algorithm which >>> produces 'undershoot' (a darkening of black side of contrast on an >>> edge) rather than 'overshoot' (white halos), this can be seen most >>> obviously on the watch fingers in the +3 crop. Unfortunately this >>> appears to leave some black edges looking a little soft and >>> increasing the sharpness setting doesn't help. " >>> >>> "When we reviewed the K100D we thought Pentax had got their image >>> processing just right, however the single element of the entire K10D > >>> equation which left us scratching our heads was just that. Either a >>> poorly implemented demosaicing algorithm or a strange choice of >>> sharpening parameters means that while the K10D's JPEG images have >>> plenty of 'texture' they can lack the edge sharpness we're used to >>> seeing from semi-pro digital SLR's. >>> >>> Pentax may well have been aiming for a smooth film-like appearance >>> but I at least feel that the inability to tweak this out by >>> increasing sharpness is a mistake. That said it's unlikely you'll >>> see this difference in any print up to A3 size, it's a 100% view >>> thing so you have to decide if that's important to you or not. To >>> get that absolute crisp appearance you'll need to shoot RAW, and use > >>> Adobe Camera RAW or another third party converter (as the supplied >>> converter produces similar results to the camera). >>> >>> With the criticism out of the way we return to the K10D as a >>> 'photographic tool', something it does very well. It's a camera you >>> get used to very quickly and never really leaves you searching for >>> the correct setting or control. It's also a camera you can grow >>> into, the unique exposure modes are both creatively interesting and >>> useful, a range of options such as this encourage you to experiment. > >>> At just under $900 it's a very strong proposition, so despite our >>> reservations about the slightly soft image processing the K10D just >>> achieves a Highly Recommended." >>> >>> >>> This is something that we could change with a firmware update, but >>> to the best of my knowledge the camera is working as intended by our > >>> designers, so such a firmware update is unlikely. >>> >>> If you prefer a sharper shot to a softer feel, then you will >>> probably wish to shoot in the DNG RAW format instead of PEF RAW or >>> JPG. >>> >>> If you prefer a smoother image, then you will want to shoot in PEF >>> RAW or JPG. >>> >>> >>> If you are in need of further assistance, please respond to this >>> email or call our technical support center at 800-877-0155. >>> >>> Best Regards, >>> Dorian B. >>> Pentax Imaging Technical Support >>> ---- >> Now the intriguing question, to me, is Dorian's statement: >> >>> -- >>> If you prefer a sharper shot to a softer feel, then you will >>> probably wish to shoot in the DNG RAW format instead of PEF RAW or >>> JPG. >>> >>> If you prefer a smoother image, then you will want to shoot in PEF >>> RAW or JPG. >>> -- >> This implies one of two things: >> >> Either there is some image processing applied to the RAW data in PEF >> and JPEG output modes that isn't applied to the DNG output mode, or >> Dorian is assuming Pentax Lab for PEF conversion which performs >> different smoothing/cleanup compared to when it processes K10D PEFs. It > >> might also be an answer to the comments that Pentax Lab and Silkypix >> produce different RAW conversion results with PEF vs Camera Raw and >> Lightroom with DNG. This is an interesting question mark and I'm >> curious to see what happens when Adobe supports K10D PEF files. >> Meanwhile I'm going to devise a test to see if I can find subtle >> differences ... >> >>> I don't use jpeg anyway. So I don't really care :) >> :-) >> >> Ach. Someday all this flap will be over and I'll spend more time >> doing >> PHOTOGRAPHY again, rather than being an equipment weenie. >> >> Godfrey >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
