Here is what I wrote: "In the discipline of academic logic, propositions are communicated in symbol systems"
Your interpretation of this sentence appears to be responding to concerns beyond academic logic. Interactions of innumerable sorts and kinds, linguistic and behavioral, abound in nature and may be interpreted as communication if you wish. Cheers Jerry > On Apr 7, 2021, at 2:37 PM, Helmut Raulien <[email protected]> wrote: > > Jerry, List, > why confine "symbol" to human language? A symbol is a sign (to be overexact, > the object relation with a sign), whose significance is due to an agreement > ("convention"). But who said, that this agreement should have to be construed > by humans? It also may be a produce of species or other class (mammal) > evolution, or not? E.g. the child scheme is a convention of the vertebrate´s > nature: Fish, mammals, birds, reptiles have it. But snails, insects, spiders, > octopusses don´t. So it is a convention somehow, and so a symbol, or not? > > Best, Helmut > > > 07. April 2021 um 20:16 Uhr > "Jerry LR Chandler" <[email protected]> > wrote: > List, Helmut: > > In the academic community, the notions of communication includes many many > forms of various scales and scopes. > > In the discipline of academic logic, propositions are communicated in symbol > systems. Thus, it is traditional to view formal propositions as a (triaval?) > subset of human communication, even if the proposition is not communicated to > others. > > Just my interpretation of how one can articulate meanings of signals and the > processing of signals, both internal and external to an individual. > > Cheers > > Jerry > > On Apr 7, 2021, at 10:52 AM, Helmut Raulien <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > > Supplement: It just is another kind of grammar. Part of the grammar also is > the child scheme, that says: "you want to keep me feel well". So a child´s > crying even is a quite complex proposition, like: "You have failed about > keeping me well, and thus you have violated not only my well-being, but as > well your responsibility for me, which is grounded on your own wishes, > aroused by my child-scheme, and the fact that I am about to carry on your > genes, as I am your child". Ok. parts of this proposition are not built by > the child´s mind, but by the mind of the species or the mammal nature, but > nevertheless it is a proposition. The "street cry" by Peirce is different, it > just is a sound without other hints, and might have this or that meaning. > > Gary F., List, > > why are smiling and crying not propositions? They mean "I am well" and "I am > not well", not in a language of words, but in a language too, which everybody > understands. > > Best, Helmut > > 07. April 2021 um 17:07 Uhr > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > wrote: > Helmut, logical negation is essentially the denial that a proposition is > true. It has nothing to do with a given experience being painful or > unpleasant. Crying and smiling are not propositions, and infants do not > assert or deny propositions. > > > Gary f. > > > From: [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> On Behalf Of Helmut Raulien > Sent: 7-Apr-21 08:22 > To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Cc: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: Aw: [PEIRCE-L] Paradisaical logic (was Phaneroscopy... > > > John, List, > > > I think, that an infant´s crying is an instance of logical negation, why not? > Negation is distinction (if Spencer-Brown´s calculus and Peirce´s entitative > graphs are - i forgot the word for quasi the same- ), and the needs of any > individual distinguish it from its natural and social environment. Negation > is thus ubuquitous and there from the start, and the concept of a paradise or > a land of milk and honey is a picture created by rulers to show those under > their rule the absurdity of their claim for a better life in this world. The > intention is to justify and excuse suppression. > > > Best, Helmut > > > _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply > All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> . ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, > send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of > the message and nothing in the body. More at > https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html > <https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html> . ► PEIRCE-L is owned > by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and co-managed by him and > Ben Udell. > _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply > All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> . ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, > send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of > the message and nothing in the body. More at > https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html > <https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html> . ► PEIRCE-L is owned > by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and co-managed by him and > Ben Udell. > _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ > ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON > PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> . > ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of > the message and nothing in the body. More at > https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html > <https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html> . > ► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and > co-managed by him and Ben Udell. > _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ > ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON > PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to [email protected] > . > ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to [email protected] > with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in > the body. More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html . > ► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and > co-managed by him and Ben Udell.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to [email protected] . ► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to [email protected] with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in the body. More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html . ► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and co-managed by him and Ben Udell.
