To T. McDonough: Actually it is a discussion in ecological theory, and so far Alan McGowen, an ecologist very active on the ecol-econ list has not responded to my latest message. Very briefly there is a theory about ecological hierarchies with a lot of subpoints, such as that higher levels constrain lower levels and that higher levels oscillate on lower frequencies than lower levels. This is supposedly an outcome of the operation of the law of entropy and is argued by people such as Tim Allen at the University of Wisconsin-Madison where I am for the summer. McGowen, who is very anti-economics and thinks that global human population should be much much lower than it currently is, presents these arguments as if they are natural laws on the order of Newton's laws of motion, rather than reasonable hypotheses with some empirical support. I presented a counterexample, that a spruce forest subject to 50-year spruce-budworm cycles might have individual trees that survive the crash and thus operate at a lower frequency despite being at a lower ecosystemic hierarchic level. Hope this has not been too distracting for most. For those interested in more on this with a link to economics, you can see my "Discontinuous Changes in Hierarchical Ecological Economies" in _Land Econmics_, May 1995 where much of this theory is laid out in more detail and a lot of sources are provided. Barkley Rosser