Feel free to erase the following long & theoretical discussion. Gil writes:>> Having read Jim's article I know what he's getting at in referring to exploitation as "taxation without representation," but this conception does not address the issues I've raised here and thus doesn't contradict what I've said. Why? Referring to profit as taxation addresses the question of *how profit is appropriated* (as indicated by Jim's own summary),<< Gil, please don't put words into my mouth, especially when they involve fuzzy thinking! I didn't use the word "appropriated," since it has more than one meaning. It can mean forcing workers to produce a surplus-product (what I was talking about) or it can receiving surplus-value that someone else has induced workers to produce. The word "appropriate" conflates two issues that need to be separated. >> but leaves *entirely unanswered* my central question concerning the economic *function* of profits: as a necessary payment for productive risk-bearing (or abstinence), or as a rent, a payment in excess of any such "socially necessary" opportunity costs (if they exist). As I've already explained, saying that surplus value corresponds to an economic rent is entirely consistent with the notion that "[p]rofits result from the force applied by the state to preserve capitalist property,....", etc. Thus affirm ing Jim's conception in no way contradicts mine.<< To talk about "economic function" is either to bring in structural functionalism (a major step backward in terms of methodology) OR to talk about the _normative_ dimension, which simply distracts us from the key issue: ** receiving a rent because one owns a scarce item is NOT the same thing as having the _power_ to force people to work to produce a surplus product (the power to "tax").** As I said in my last missive in the "scarcity, strategy, & exploitation" thread, I believe the difference between our views is as follows: Gil believes that a person owning a scarce item is sufficient to induce workers to produce surplus-value. (In other words, though surplus-value _can_ be (and most often is) the result of capitalist dominance, subsumption, it need not be so.) I, on the other hand, see this view (whether or not it is indeed Gil's) as contradicting Marx's accurate view that a surplus-product CANNOT be produced simply via market relations (buying & selling): Workers must be dominated ("subsumed") _in production_ and the passive ownership of a scarce item will not automatically lead to workers being dominated in this way. On the normative issue: if all surplus-value is the result, ultimately and directly, of capitalist domination, then it really doesn't matter very much whether profit is part of the opportunity cost of bringing a product to the market ("a necessary payment for productive risk-bearing (or abstinence)") or an "absolute" scarcity rent ("a payment in excess of any such 'socially necessary' opportunity costs"). BTW, under capitalist social relations, the "socially-necessary" opportunity costs are defined from a _capitalist_ point of view (just as _all_ opportunity costs are defined from a specific point of view) and based on the prevailing average profit rate for society as a whole (i.e., so-called "normal profits"). That is, the definition of opportunity costs reflects capitalist power, takes it as a given. (That does not mean that these opportunity costs are irrelevant or wrong, only that they must be put in perspective.) As I said before, the role of "relative scarcity" in determining profit is a _dependent_ variable, dependent on the macro-structure of power, i.e., the power of the capitalist state, the power of the reserve army of labor, and the power of capitalist managers. To forget about this power is to engage in capitalist ideology. >The kind of exploitation that Gil is talking about above ("the essence of Marx's critique of vulgar political economy," profits as a result of scarcity rents) is that which Henry George applied to land-owners, Keynes applied to rentiers, and Roemer applied to the capitalist class as a whole. These theories aren't wrong as much as _superficial_ compared to Marx's theory (as I understand it); that is, they are explained by Marx's theory.< >>No it isn't, since as explained earlier relative scarcity is essentially dynamic and historically contingent while the basis of, e.g., land rent is essentially static and ahistorical (though not independent of particular social conditions).... And since my conception of relative scarcity accomodates Jim's "taxation" story as well as Marx's "general law of capital accumulation" it can't be like these other theories in being "_superficial_ compared to Marx's theory"; it *embraces* Marx's theory as an important, perhaps the central, case. << Your theory only incorporates or "embraces" the "taxation" theory (which is simply a restatement of Marx's theory in "modern" terms) only in the sense that it is exploitation-as-taxation is one kind ("perhaps the central" kind) of capitalist exploitation along with your theory in which rentiers can induce workers to produce surplus-value by passively taking advantage of the scarcity of their resources. However, since the latter doesn't work (given Marx's principle that surplus-value cannot be created in circulation, only in production), the passive taking advantage of scarcity ends up simply being a redistribution of the surplus-value that was already produced by the application of capitalist power. In sum, "passive theory" is a superficial aspect of the capitalist power theory. The theory of relative scarcity (i.e., Marshallian quasi-rents) as the source of profits is simply the same as that of Keynes (at least according to Minsky, JOHN MAYNARD KEYNES). I never denied that the means of production must be (relatively) scarce for capitalists to receive profits; I instead emphasized that capitalist class _power_ preserves that scarcity over time, so that scarcity should be seen as dependent on power. But relative scarcity or quasi-rent theory only gives a small part of the story: it says that individual capitalists have the ability to claim a part of the societal surplus-product (surplus-value) but it does NOT tell us how the surplus-product actually can be produced. If claims exceed the product, we get inflation. That is, the average productivity of labor must exceed the real wage and the mere quasi-scarcity of of MofP CANNOT cause this to occur; it must be complemented and preserved by institutional factors (capitalist power). If the power of workers to push up wages and to restrict the intensity of work is high, there will be NO surplus product, so that the quasi-scarcity of MofP does the capitalists no good. BUT the physical coercion of the state, the structural coercion of the reserve army of involuntarily-unemployed labor, and the instrumental coercion of managers (threats of firing, etc.) prevent the workers from having this kind of power. The capitalist class POWER is the source of their ability to dominate workers, to induce them to produce a surplus-product, which THEN allows individual capitalists to claim parts of that product. >note that Gil's "relative scarcity" corresponds to what Marshall called "quasi-rents."< Gil quibbles about terminology: >>It may seem like it corresponds to "quasi-rent", but it most certainly does not, which is why it is necessary to invent a new term. Here's the test: for Marshall (as well as modern mainstream economics) a quasi-rent is a payment that acts like a rent in the short run (or more precisely, subsequent to an investment in a non-fungible asset, like a specialized machine), but acts like a "natural price" in the long run (i.e., *prior to* any such investment)--that is, as a socially necessary payment for the opportunity cost of providing some productive service (on this point see pp 424-426, Marshall's Principles, 8th edition, especially footnote 1 on p. 424).<< BTW, all or almost all of the MofP that are relevant to our discussion are fixed MofP, non-fungible, and specialized. (We're not talking about a scarcity of paper assets, which is a function of the scarcity of real assets, except for government bonds which are based on the state's power to collect taxes.) Also, again: "socially-necessary" here must mean from the perpective of capitalists. >>But there is *no* sense or decision horizon [for whom?] in which economic rent understood as a return to *relative* scarcity as I've defined it constitutes a payment necessary to call forth a productive service. Thus my notion of return to relative scarcity cannot possibly correspond to the Marshallian notion of quasi-rent.<< Gil earlier defined "*relative* scarcity ... as aris[ing] if (a) the long-run supply curve defined for any period of *real* time becomes vertical at some quantity, but (b) this quantity expands over real time. The visual representation of this case is as in (2), except that this representation has an explicitly *dynamic* aspect: the vertical portion of the supply curve shifts out over time." The quibbling arises because Gil has discovered a distinction that's been around for awhile and is usually not made, but in the end is not very important. If one wants to think about the phenomenon of capitalists receiving profits because the MofP are scarce in the short run, I would follow Paul Davidson's model (see ch. 4 of REAL WORLD MACROECONOMICS), which shows up with some simplification in Dornbusch and Fischer, MACROECONOMICS, applied to residential investment. The key distinction is between the stock-supply (SS) and the flow-supply (FS) of fixed MofP. At any point in "real" (i.e., historical) time, the SS of fixed MofP is vertical or close to it, above the maintenance cost. The vertical SS curve usually shifts to the right over time -- because the stock-price or asset-price of fixed MofP (determined by the intersection of the stock-demand and the SS curves) is high relative to the supply-price of (i.e., the marginal opportunity cost of producing) new fixed MofP at a quantity of zero. The volume of net investment and the actual supply-price of new MofP are determined by where the asset-price equals the FS curve. The latter is upward-sloping but relatively flat. (The asset-price of course equals the present discounted value of future profits from owning fixed MofP. If the asset-price exceeds the supply-price, it is profitable to increase the stock of assets. The ratio between the asset-price and the supply-price is "Tobin's q.") One might see the owners of the fixed MofP as receiving a "scarcity rent" (represented by the area between the asset-price and the maintenance cost, to the left of the SS curve). If I understand Gil correctly, this is due to his "relative scarcity." On the other hand, the capitalists organizing the production of the fixed MofP get a "scarcity rent" if the FS has an upward slope (the area below the price and above the FS). This is by-the-book Marshallian quasi-rent. But though these two kinds of rents are different, they are highly related and are due to the same problem: they are both due to the upward slope of the FS curve (see the discussion of the long run, below). Because they are highly related and due to the same cause, I don't think much is lost by calling them both "quasi-rents." The first kind of scarcity rent (the "stock scarcity rent") is usually just "on paper"; it can only be _realized_ (i.e., actually received as income) by an individual if she buys low and sells high. On the aggregate, this only happens when the SS curve is shifting to right more slowly than the stock-demand curve. (Otherwise, a seller's gain is a buyer's loss, cancelling out on the aggregate level.) Even then, for this profit to correspond to real goods and services, somewhere in the economy workers have to be induced to produce surplus-value. (A neoclassical might object that the owner of a fixed MofP would be gaining in terms of "opportunity cost," i.e., by the gap between the cost of running MofP one owns and the cost of leasing that MofP, just as home-owners often gain relative to renters. But that gain is not in terms of actual goods and services produced or actual money changing hands and is thus not surplus-value. Further, that gain might easily be negative and, in the hypothetical long run, equals zero unless there is some special tax treatment by the government.) Similarly, the second kind ("flow scarcity rent"), the profits made above the "normal" profit, though realized through sale of new MofP, must correspond to workers being coerced into producing surplus- value somewhere in the economy. As noted, the two types of rent are highly related and due to the same cause. This can be seen if we consider the long run (which constant shifts of supply and demand and ultimately capitalist power, i.e., their control over the investment process, never allows to happen). Here, the FS curve is totally elastic (like flow-supply curves for most products), abolishing the producers' flow scarcity rents (Gil's Marshallian quasi-rents), so that they have to rely on merely "normal" profits (which exist if capitalists have the power to extort surplus-labor from the direct producers). In the LR, the asset price of fixed MofP also equals the flow-supply-price of new means of production, which is independent of the volume of investment. In long-run equilibrium, this price also equals the maintenance cost, so that even "paper" scarcity rent doesn't exist. Pure owners of the fixed MofP receive no stock-scarcity rents at all, though the capitalists organizing the maintenance of the equipment can receive "normal" profits. The question remains: does the non-scarcity of MofP affect the power of the capitalists, i.e., their ability to extract "normal" profits? Of course it does, ceteris paribus. But the non-scarcity induces reactions that imply that all else does not stay equal. There have been many situations, i.e., "crises," in which over-accumulation leads to unemployed MofP. In that case, the capitalists have to compensate for the abundance of their MofP by raising the reserve army of labor, via speed-up and stretch-out, via wage cuts, and by arranging intensified state coercion. They might also arrange for the physical destruction of fixed MofP. The rise in unemployment happens automatically, due to the capitalist excercise of their power to control investment, which in K1, ch. 25 (i.e., at a very high level of abstraction), Marx represented by the fixed proportionality of accumulation (saving-and-investment) and surplus-value. (I would add that a falling rate of profit also reduces the incentive to invest.) Given the capitalists' control over production, this rise in U means that speed-up, stretch-out, and wage-cuts can be imposed (assuming that workers' organizational power doesn't change). Only in extreme cases, i.e., when these relatively automatic mechanisms fail, are increased state oppression and the physical destruction of MofP necessary. Of course, if workers' organizational power increases due to the crisis, everything is much more complicated. in pen-l solidarity, Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] <74267,[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Econ. Dept., Loyola Marymount Univ. 7900 Loyola Blvd., Los Angeles, CA 90045-8410 USA 310/338-2948 (daytime, during workweek); FAX: 310/338-1950 "It takes a busload of faith to get by." -- Lou Reed.