I guess I am part of the stupid left that is blinkered by imperialist propaganda. I
don't see see how the ratio of state ownership in the former Yugoslavia is deeply
relevant to socialism or whether the regime was worth defending; I am aware that it
was high, but it was as high or higher in the former Soviet Union. I myself do not buy
the Trot line that public ownership is enough of a progressive achievement to warrant
"critical support" for an otherwise appalling and debased regime.
The former regime chopped up the country on ethnic lines, engaged in large scale
ethnic cleansing, which is not genocide, but which is not admirable or socialist;
supported murderers in Bosnia and drew the country into two wars--I don't hold NATO
guiltless, but if Slobo hadn't been so keen on partition (in one case) and ethnic
cleasing and repression (in the other), it would not have happened. The regime drove
the worker control that was once the glory of Yugoslav socialism into the dust. It
properly drew the hatred of the Serbian people--the Montenegrins too. I am sure that
they will be in for an unpleasant surprise with the new order, but at this point they
are going into it with open eyes. They can see what happened in the ex-Bloc states.
The choice was theirs, and if you disagree, well, who asked you.
Don't assume that everyone who disagree with you is an ignorant dupe and a tool or
patsy of imperialism. Some us, who may know a thing or two about Yugoslavia, may just
disagree with your political analysis. --jks
In a message dated Wed, 11 Oct 2000 2:10:06 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Yoshie
Furuhashi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
<< Ian:
>Yoshie Furuhashi dijo:
>
> > What has not changed,
> > however, is the idea that it is Americans who should bring criminals
> > of the world to justice. It goes without saying that this self-image
> > makes Americans forget the fact that they are the biggest criminals:
> > the only remaining superpower that acts with impunity, for there is no
> > one in the world who can bring Americans to justice.
>*************
>Yoshie,
>Do you really mean such a blanket statement or do you prefer to mean the
>American ruling class? There are lots of US citizens who'd love to haul
>persons of power and wealth in "our" country before some international
>tribunal, they're just too time poor and financially strapped to do it [I
>leave aside the mobilization of competencies necessary to make it so].
Exceptions exist (exceptions are _very_ few), but more and more
American leftists are acting like Amasa Delano, for sure. Hence an
inability to hold intelligent or even intelligible discussion on
Rwanda, Yugoslavia, etc. After you post an analysis of material
conditions, ideological conditions, political conditions, etc. of
Rwanda, Yugoslavia, etc. that does not include caricatures of the
Official Enemy of the moment, you always get an insidious response
that _ignores everything that is said in the post_ and then asks,
"But do you support Milosevic, Hussein, Putin, etc.?" "Do you condone
genocide?" "Do you deny that mass murders were committed?" And so
on. And so forth. You never get the same sort of insultingly stupid
response, though, if you post an analysis with similar complexity on,
say, American politics, American labor movement, American polls,
American anything. Therefore, I conclude that the _dominant
ideological reflex_ of American leftists is to appoint themselves as
the police, prosecutor, judge, & executioner of peoples who
unfortunately live in countries under America's Official Enemies
while excusing themselves from moral and political responsibilities
for their own government's conduct, which has been worse than all its
Official Enemies, past & present, put together. They have forgotten
what they learned through the reawakening of the Left during the
anti-Vietnam War movement. When did they begin to forget? During
the Gulf War? The invasion of Panama? After the end of the draft?
When did this dumbing down of the Left begin?
Yoshie
>>
