I find a lot of neo-con/trumpian political stances moronic, short-sighted, and anti-intellectual and therefore consider them offensive, an affront on my way of life, and a stain on my country.
1) Can I report anyone holding such views and discussing them on a 3rd party forum? 2) Could I be reported for saying the above on a 3rd party forum? Obviously the pg mailing list isn't a place for such discussion, but is being a member of this community a deal with the devil to give up my right to free speech elsewhere? Jim On September 14, 2018 6:10:47 AM EDT, Chris Travers <chris.trav...@gmail.com> wrote: >On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 11:45 AM Ilya Kosmodemiansky <i...@dataegret.com> >wrote: > >> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 10:31 AM, Chris Travers ><chris.trav...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > I really have to object to this addition: >> > "This Code is meant to cover all interaction between community >members, >> > whether or not it takes place within postgresql.org infrastructure, >so >> long >> > as there is not another Code of Conduct that takes precedence (such >as a >> > conference's Code of Conduct)." >> > >> > That covers things like public twitter messages over live political >> > controversies which might not be personally directed. At least if >one >> is >> > going to go that route, one ought to *also* include a safe harbor >for >> > non-personally-directed discussions of philosophy, social issues, >and >> > politics. Otherwise, I think this is asking for trouble. See, for >> example, >> > what happened with Opalgate and how this could be seen to encourage >use >> of >> > this to silence political controversies unrelated to PostgreSQL. >> >> I think, this point has nothing to do with _correct_ discussions or >> public tweets. >> >> If one community member tweets publicly and in a way which abuses >> other community members, it is obvious CoC violation. It is hard to >> imagine healthy community if someone interacts with others correctly >> on the list or at a conference because the CoC stops him doing things >> which he will do on private capacity to the same people when CoC >> doesnt apply. >> >> If someone reports CoC violation just because other community >member's >> _correct_ public tweet or whatsoever expressed different >> political/philosophical/religious views, this is a quite different >> story. I suppose CoC committee and/or Core team in this case should >> explain the reporter the purpose of CoC rather than automatically >> enforce it. >> > >So first, I think what the clause is trying to do is address cases >where >harassment targeting a particular community member takes place outside >the >infrastructure and frankly ensuring that the code of conduct applies in >these cases is important and something I agree with. > >However, let's look at problem cases: > >"I am enough of a Marxist to see gender as a qualitative relationship >to >biological reproduction and maybe economic production too." > >I can totally imagine someone arguing that such a tweet might be >abusive, >and certainly not "correct." > >Or consider: > >"The effort to push GLBT rights on family-business economies is nothing >more than an effort at corporate neocolonialism." > >Which would make the problem more clear. Whether or not a comment like >that occurring outside postgresql.org infrastructure would be >considered >"correct" or "abusive" is ultimately a political decision and something >which, once that fight is picked, has no reasonable solution in an >international and cross-cultural product (where issues like sexuality, >economics, and how gender and individualism intersect will vary >dramatically across members around the world). There are people who >will >assume that both of the above statements are personally offensive and >attacks on the basis of gender identity even if they are critiques of >political agendas severable from that. Worse, the sense of attack >themselves could be seen as attacks on culture or religions of other >participants. > >Now neither of these comments would be tolerated as viewpoints >expressed on >PostgreSQL.org email lists because they are off-topic, but once one >expands >the code of conduct in this way they become fair game. Given the way >culture war issues are shaping up particularly in the US, I think one >has >to be very careful not to set an expectation that this applies to >literally >everything that anyone does anywhere. > >So maybe something more like: > >"Conduct that occurs outside the postgresql.org infrastructure is not >automatically excluded from enforcement of this code of conduct. In >particular if other parties are unable to act, and if it is, on >balance, in >the interest of the global community to apply the code of conduct, then >the >code of conduct shall apply." > >> >> > -- >> > Best Wishes, >> > Chris Travers >> > >> > Efficito: Hosted Accounting and ERP. Robust and Flexible. No >vendor >> > lock-in. >> > http://www.efficito.com/learn_more >> > > >-- >Best Wishes, >Chris Travers > >Efficito: Hosted Accounting and ERP. Robust and Flexible. No vendor >lock-in. >http://www.efficito.com/learn_more -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.