Andrew: Again, assuming that you do have an early style rear mount Grand Opera, the machine would be correct with an all brass bell horn rather than a paneled horn.
The paneled horn you refer to came at a later date after the influence of Victor was evident. I'd say 1906-1908. It's possible your horn was replaced or upgraded at some point in time. The early rear mount Grand Opera is shown in The Talking Machine Compendium as Plate 3-100 on Page 111. The later Victorized version of the Grand Opera is shown as Plate 4-92 on Page 164. Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Baron" <a...@popyrus.com> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <phono-l@oldcrank.org> Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 9:47 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Non-Victor Zonophone with Paneled Horn > Thank you, Mark for this nicely detailed reply. > Yes, there is a threaded hole with a groove running to the edge of the > plate, toward the back mount. The crank is on the right as you point > out, and the Grand Opera decal is on the "front", that is, the broad > side of the cabinet facing the user, same side as the mouth of the > backmount horn. I'll email a photo to you tomorrow. > > So it sounds like a have a machine that was probably made in 1904. > Does the eleven panel horn seem unusual to you at this early date? > > Thanks again for these insights, > Andy > > On Feb 4, 2006, at 8:54 PM, Mark Albertson wrote: > >> Hi Andrew: >> >> I can probably help you identify your Zonophone. From the sounds of >> it, you >> probably have an early rear mount Grand Opera with the glass window >> delete. >> The glass window that would normally be seen on the front mount Grand >> Opera >> machine is eliminated so that there is a mounting surface for the rear >> mount >> bracket. But aside from that deleted window, the balance of the >> machine is >> exactly like a front mount Grand Opera with the fancy metal bedplate >> with >> one additional exception. That is that the wood case is rotated 180 >> degrees >> so that the crank is on the right (instead of the left like a front >> mount) >> and thus the Grand Opera decal is on the opposite side as >> well....tricky >> huh..!! >> >> P.S........If you look closely at your bedplate, you will see a >> threaded >> hole where the front mount bracket would have screwed into even though >> yours >> is a rear mount machine. >> >> Regarding the influence on the Zonophone design, this did not come to >> pass >> until a few years after Johnson acquired the company (September 1903). >> >> During the 1904 Saint Louis Exhibition, the Zonophones were still of >> the >> original Zono design. Presumably Johnson was using up remaining stock >> as >> any smart business man would. >> >> But the 1905 Zono catalogue demonstrates machines that start to >> reflect the >> new Victorized look of the Zonophone. >> >> If you would send on to me a photo of your machine, I will then be >> able to >> tell you for sure what you have. >> >> Regards >> >> Mark Albertson >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Andrew Baron" <a...@popyrus.com> >> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <phono-l@oldcrank.org> >> Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 9:06 AM >> Subject: [Phono-L] Non-Victor Zonophone with Paneled Horn >> >> >>>> phonost...@aol.com writes: >>>> >>>> "Wouldn't it be fun" if each month Phono Friends of the groups picked >>>> a >>>> topic for discussion... >>> >>> Great idea! >>> What should it be this month? >>> >>> How about something that there just isn't a wealth of published >>> information about -- Zonophones. >>> >>> I'd love to get some opinions, if possible, on the following: About >>> two years ago, I was the very fortunate recipient of a nicely >>> preserved >>> (and with provenance) Zonophone Grand Opera (no, not the one with the >>> glass side panels -- I wish, but not complaining, mind you). This >>> machine seems to be (I would guess) early in Victor's ownership of the >>> marque. It has no Victor-like features, the classic deeply embossed >>> top plate with stylized symmetrical floral patterns, ZON-O-PHONE, >>> Universal Talking Machine Mfg Co (also engraved in the reproducer), >>> etc. It has the Universal decal on the side of the case just under >>> the >>> crank, Grand Opera stencil on the front panel, external stop, large >>> flat speed knob, and S-shaped crank. The cabinet is also pure >>> Zonophone, with the finely turned corner posts, etc. The motor is >>> clearly Zonophone, and owes nothing to Victor, having the oversized >>> single spring vertical barrel, flat-sided pair of governor weights and >>> so on. >>> >>> What makes me think it's after Victor's acquisition of Zonophone is >>> that it's a rear mount machine with an 11-panel all-brass horn. I >>> tend >>> to think of the panel horns as being introduced around 1904 or 1905, >>> and the published histories of Zonophone seem to put Victor's >>> acquisition of the company a year or two prior to that. >>> >>> I'd love to tap into the Phonolist's knowledge base to learn more >>> about >>> this machine and it's relationship to the Victor buyout dates and >>> paneled horn introduction dates. The horn, although panel, retains >>> the >>> classic Zonophone all-brass construction (including the elbow), and >>> fits perfectly into the back support. This plus the documented >>> history >>> (going back only to about 1930) shows that this horn was with this >>> machine at least as far back as that. It occurred to me that it could >>> be an earlier machine, made just prior to the Victor buy-out, >>> originally equipped with the more conventional belled brass horn, and >>> then changed to a panel horn when it was a couple of years old, but it >>> seems unlikely that Victor would have gone to the trouble to make an >>> all brass panel horn to update the old Zonophones. >>> >>> Any thoughts on any of the content of this inquiry would be most >>> sincerely appreciated. >>> >>> Andy Baron >>> Santa Fe, NM >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Phono-L mailing list >>> Phono-L@oldcrank.org >>> >>> Phono-L Archive >>> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Phono-L mailing list >> Phono-L@oldcrank.org >> >> Phono-L Archive >> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >> > > _______________________________________________ > Phono-L mailing list > Phono-L@oldcrank.org > > Phono-L Archive > http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/
