On 5/24/06, Zak B. Elep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
You are not on the same plane as I. I deem technical questions to be solvable with objective answers, not with subjective ones. Again, questions such as "what's the best distro..." does generate subjective answers. I'm a member of this list and of SLUG (Sydney Linux Users Group) as well. I'm not into bashing this list, but I've seen how much cleaner SLUG is than this list.
No room for your Shakespeare-ish comments here either....
Now that is an example of a subjective answer. It is misleading with respect to the thread.
Yes, it's nice to have someone to turn to, especially someone who can give you a straightforward answer, not an opinion.
At least I know the "F" part is beautiful with a partner, indeed....
As long as they are technical questions that generate objective answers, yes.
What's the org website doing for you?
YOU? I hope not....
Communication is a two-way process, older/more experienced members of this list should do their duty as well; we should not respond to emails that will render tons of useless emails. Have you not been reminded to not reply to spam?
Hi Warlin!
On 5/24/06, Warlin Pantoja <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm not really into engaging in philosophical debates on what is the
> better pedagogy but I will just like to drop some thoughts and leave it
> for the vultures to feast on.
Amen, brother, there's the rub.
> But then again, I've also a need to balance this approach with the need
> to _properly_ instruct them to do so. Ethicality does not need to give
> way for well intended but rudely placed instructions.
You are not on the same plane as I. I deem technical questions to be solvable with objective answers, not with subjective ones. Again, questions such as "what's the best distro..." does generate subjective answers. I'm a member of this list and of SLUG (Sydney Linux Users Group) as well. I'm not into bashing this list, but I've seen how much cleaner SLUG is than this list.
This goes for the lists too, as I am inclined to think that along with
the new folks posting questions here, cometh the cynics and crackpots
who can't think much of anything better to do than to to confusticate
and bebother them. I hope someone prays for them.
No room for your Shakespeare-ish comments here either....
> For one, I personally believe that many of not most of the resources
> available in Google do not very well connect with the newbie ( i.e., most
> are written for intermediate or expert users). We could take this in the
> positive by way of reflection on how poorly *nix materials are organized
> in the web and the need to organize these body of knowledge (thus
> explains the impetus for such projects as the Linux Documentation
> Project).
Now that is an example of a subjective answer. It is misleading with respect to the thread.
Well, the Web pretty much like an intelligent person with a mixed-up
memory, which is kind of interesting for theorists, but scary for
simple folks. I do suppose writing a set of truly coherent and
integrated help documents (or even improving the existing hodgepoge)
would be of tremendous help, but that's just one half of the solution.
The other half lies in conditioning the people to be confident that
they can do their work in GNU/Linux, and that there's always someone
`out there' who they can turn to for help.
Yes, it's nice to have someone to turn to, especially someone who can give you a straightforward answer, not an opinion.
RTFM is a two-edged sword. It is beautiful indeed, but if we as
GNU/Linux advocates were to live the way of the sword, then we would
definitely die by it (metaphorically speaking, lest the cynics contest
some Tasyo debacle.)
At least I know the "F" part is beautiful with a partner, indeed....
> One cannot really blame them to pose these questions because their
> problem stems not so much as being non-resourceful and non-diligent in
> personally searching for answers to their questions as to not knowing
> how to formulate the proper question to ask. Had it been easy to pose
> the question properly, Google would have been an easy tool for them (and
> also for us) in exploring the big world of *nix.
Actually, asking questions is a basic instinct, even if one lacks the
capacity for asking. Everybody has an inquisitive mind, and thus,
everybody will sooner or later stumble upon a question or two that has
been answered once or twice, but they'll ask anyway, since that
action, for them, will be more convenient in the short term.
As long as they are technical questions that generate objective answers, yes.
> What I'm driving at is this: we do not need always to rudely tell
> newbies to search for the answer first on the net. They may have already
> and probably they've been passing keywords erroneously on these search
> engines or were missing the solution right before their eyes. They just
> probably need a nudge on the right direction... also a mild exhortation
> for them to always exhaust all possibilities within their reach before
> bringing it up to any ML or fora.
What's the org website doing for you?
I'm somehow reminded of Constantine's dialog: humans are capable of
doing evil things, but once in a while, someone comes along and nudges
them in the right direction.
YOU? I hope not....
> There are other alternatives... one of them is to completely ignore
> newbie questions and the other is to limit the ML for technical
> questions only (this then gives us license to lambaste such amateurish
> queries).
I do not believe we can afford the latter option, for that will be the
nail for our coffin. Nor does the former sound really feasible, for
the silent treatment is more often than not worse than the verbose
lambaste.
Communication is a two-way process, older/more experienced members of this list should do their duty as well; we should not respond to emails that will render tons of useless emails. Have you not been reminded to not reply to spam?
--
Zak B. Elep || http://zakame.spunge.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED] || [EMAIL PROTECTED]
1486 7957 454D E529 E4F1 F75E 5787 B1FD FA53 851D
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