On a related topic (withering wiki projects), whatever happened to wikiwyg. It looked quite promising at one point but I never could quite get it to work. Now, I'm searching the internet and it seems to have died. Pretty much all the link to it are invalid.
I see someone took a stab at it on PmWiki but not much success there. As I remember it had the nice option of three modes: wysiwyg, markup, and html and you could alternate between them. Very challenging for a powerful wiki, but for a comment editor or simple blog editor or something could be useful to non-Admin content creators... Cheers, Dan On Tue, Aug 11, 2015 at 3:41 PM Petko Yotov <[email protected]> wrote: > On 2015-08-11 12:08, Randy Brown wrote: > > "WikiCreole 1.0 support” is still on PmWiki's roadmap. But do any > > PmWiki developers actually offer or encourage the use of Creole? > > I don't use Creole and I neither encourage nor discourage the use of it. > :-) But I would prefer people to use PmWiki markup, as it is better > tested and known, and thus easier for me to help them. > > There was never question to change PmWiki to Creole-only markups. Creole > markups can be added to PmWiki without disabling core markups. > > > I use it and I’d like to see it succeed, but if the Creole ship is > > slowly sinking, I don’t want to throw more luggage on board. > > That project was started when wikis were very popular as a very easy way > to publish for the web. Before wikis, one would have to write HTML. Wiki > markup is much, much easier to learn than HTML and to use, and the > automatic organization (links) and easy monitoring (recent changes) are > great for community-driven websites. > > WikiCreole questioned the choices of different existing wiki markup and > tried to find the best compromise to unify them. This took a long time. > > I am not aware of any wiki that stopped using their original markup > rules and started using WikiCreole. > > > What do you think? Does it have a future? I don’t hear much about it > > anymore. > > The question should probably be if wikis as they currently are have a > future for novice users, see below. > > > Some plusses: > > > > - its similarity to other wiki markup languages, > > - its use of backslashes mid-line to make a line break, and > > - its non-use of apostrophes as markup > > The apostrophe key is present on my touch-screen keyboards in the > "letters" layouts, and neither / nor * are. I feel that it is easier to: > > type 3 apostrophes then the bold text, then 3 apostrophes > > than to: > > switch the layout to numbers/symbols, type two asterisks, > then switch back the layout to letters, > type the bold text, > switch the layout to numbers/symbols, type two asterisks, > then switch back the letters. > > (or: switch the layout, type ****, try to position the cursor at the > middle, switch the layout, type bold text, position the cursor at the > end.) > > > Some minuses: > > > > - asterisks and equal signs, like brackets, can be hard to type on a > > touchscreen device. But that’s somewhat counterbalanced by the fact > > that positioning the cursor between two apostrophes can be hard, and > > visually two of them look just like a double quote - especially to > > beginners. > > This is correct, it is also sometimes difficult to correctly position > the cursor where you want even between larger characters, especially if > your fingers are big. > > On a touch-screen device, it is also more difficult to select text and > help yourself inserting markup with the edit toolbar, and to scroll > within the scrollable text area when the content is larger. > > > - PmWiki’s documentation is not in Creole, so that can be confusing. > > If you really need this, you can write it yourself. Creole has a tiny > tiny subset of the features possible with PmWiki, so it doesn't need > dozens of documentation pages - probably one page will be enough. And > Site.EditQuickReference. > > > > What would you do if you were starting a new wiki for novice users? > > Enable Creole? Encourage it? Discourage it? > > I feel that unfortunately novice users are preoccupied with a huge > number of other things more important than learning wiki markup. Unless > they use it daily or at least once a week, they forget the markup rules > and have to re-learn them. > > Novice users have two publishing experiences: > - text processors on a desktop computer, where they get what they see, > but which is terrible in a browser, cross-browser and cross-device, and > which is terrible to store and index in a text-based CMS like PmWiki; > - SMS, and social media websites or apps, where they enter plain text > but in very small input boxes, so again they see what they get, as only > a tiny element of the page is updated after their action, in real time. > > I've been observing for a year a large wiki community which tries to > welcome newcomers but the wiki markup, and the editing really more > adapted for a physical keyboard, is something that scares the users. On > the other hand, advanced users sometimes abuse the wikimarkup, adding > too many things like bold + big + wikistyle on a single heading, > sometimes advanced tables for presentation, which makes the page hardly > readable for me, and even more scary for a novice user. > > I don't have a solution, but I mentioned I'm working on a structured > page editor, not completely WYSIWYG but close enough for the most often > used types of content. We'll see if it helps novice users in a few > weeks. > > Petko > > -- > Change log : http://www.pmwiki.org/wiki/PmWiki/ChangeLog > Release notes : http://www.pmwiki.org/wiki/PmWiki/ReleaseNotes > If you upgrade : http://www.pmwiki.org/wiki/PmWiki/Upgrades > > If this message helped you and saved you time, feel free to make > a small contribution: ♥ http://5ko.fr/donate-ml (mailing list). > > > _______________________________________________ > pmwiki-users mailing list > [email protected] > http://www.pmichaud.com/mailman/listinfo/pmwiki-users >
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