thank God bush was blocked from turning SS into a slush fund for the stock market .
On Nov 9, 7:37 am, margareth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I flush the same king of paper in in the toilet on a daily basis. What > has been happening with many firms in North America, is that there is > more and more money exchanging hands. Stocks and bonds may have > intrinsic value, in the purchase of goods and services, but they > cannot be eaten, and they produce very little energy if burned.(Even > those that are owned by major oil companies.) > What happened during the eighties, with the many tax cuts, was that > many companies started to change hads. At first it was obvious, as > (for esample, Newspapers bought out pulp and paper producers. Every > time they did, there was a bump up in the value of the shares, at > least temporarily.) but later some of the world wide conglomerates > included many unrealted industries. But still there was a problem with > the cost of acquisition. This also represented a major shift in the > way stocks worked. The backbone behing stocks, was that in return for > the investment, the owner took a share in the ownership of the > corporation. If the company made a profit, they paid out a dividend. > As the company became more profitable, the value of the shares > increased. But that is not what is happening now. > People who have invested in the tools, and the resources of > productivity. whether on their own, or in groups, are the people who > are best positioned to weather the economic storm. That is as long as > their ownership is not encumbered by a need to satisfy the bankers. I > am talking about such items as plows, forges, ets. > That is where Capitalism and Socialism start to become very similar. > Both Adam Smith, and Karl Marx, the two greatest thinkers of political > economy, would have agreed that the control of the means of production > is the greatest predicter of long term wealth.The current banking > scandal is really an aberration in the system. It is probably for that > reason that the correction is as protracted as it has become. > Unforunately if the system, particularly the global part of the system > is now permitted to fail, it is only those who have access to the > tools and local resources that have any hope of surviving. People will > also need to adjust their lifestyles to what they can barter for, as > money in addition being worthless, will also be a rare commodity. > > On Nov 9, 3:58 am, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > what a foolish statement ! > > > On Nov 8, 9:02 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > No, paper backed by the U.S. Government. > > > > On Nov 8, 12:38 am, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > wrote: > > > > > do you mean that " paper " supposedly backed by materials and goods ? > > > > > On Nov 8, 1:20 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > Takes "Paper" to Buy that stuff... > > > > > > Seems you believe someone is just going to "give it" to you. > > > > > > Imagine that. > > > > > > On Nov 7, 9:19 pm, PhreedomPhan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > Just the fact that you say I "claim" those things are wealth show > > > > > > you > > > > > > know nothing. Tell you what Gaar. Give me title to the factories, > > > > > > machinery, patents, and land and let me assemble the trained > > > > > > employees > > > > > > to run them and you keep all your paper certificates. While I'm > > > > > > producing the machinery to work the land and produce food for the > > > > > > rest > > > > > > of us, you can eat the paper. Bon Apetit! > > > > > > > On Nov 7, 5:37 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > How the Hell do you think they BUY those things you claim are > > > > > > > "Wealth"? > > > > > > > > On Nov 7, 1:47 pm,PhreedomPhan<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > You pathetic little bitch, do you have any idea what real > > > > > > > > wealth is? > > > > > > > > The stock market is a roulette table in the desert. Winnings > > > > > > > > can blow > > > > > > > > away with the first strong wind as many have the intelligence > > > > > > > > to have > > > > > > > > learned, but apparently you have not. > > > > > > > > > Factories, machinery, trained employees, patents, land, etc. > > > > > > > > These > > > > > > > > are real wealth and they are not destroyed in the roller > > > > > > > > coaster of > > > > > > > > the Stock Market. They just change hands. > > > > > > > > > Ask your sargeant, Gomer, he knows a lot more than you do. > > > > > > > > > On Nov 7, 10:48 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > You insipid weed, do you own any stock other than a couple > > > > > > > > > shares of > > > > > > > > > Walmart? > > > > > > > > > > Are you employed? Do you have a 401k with your employer? > > > > > > > > > Maybe a 529 > > > > > > > > > for your inbred kids? What happens to each when your > > > > > > > > > company's stock > > > > > > > > > rises? > > > > > > > > > > Quit burning my time Gilligan. > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 6, 10:52 pm,PhreedomPhan<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Always good to hear from the kiddies in the Pre-K. Initial > > > > > > > > > > issues of > > > > > > > > > > stock helps the company, trading stocks is nothing but > > > > > > > > > > speculation. > > > > > > > > > > The "wealth" created is ephemeral and can blow away with > > > > > > > > > > the first > > > > > > > > > > breeze of downturn. Those making financial gain through > > > > > > > > > > speculating > > > > > > > > > > in stocks are parasites. After market stocks are gambles not > > > > > > > > > > investments. > > > > > > > > > > > Your coffee cup is probably the only one dumb enough to > > > > > > > > > > listen to you, > > > > > > > > > > Gomer. > > > > > > > > > > > I can't believe there are two people this dumb and ignorant > > > > > > > > > > in this > > > > > > > > > > group. Gaar, is Kamakazee your screenname, too? > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 6, 1:54 pm, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > "You have said in the past that you make your living as a > > > > > > > > > > > Day > > > > > > > > > > > Trader in the stock markets. That means that by > > > > > > > > > > > speculating you are > > > > > > > > > > > able to draw wealth from the system without actually > > > > > > > > > > > producing > > > > > > > > > > > anything." > > > > > > > > > > > > Nice attempt at kindergarden econ. > > > > > > > > > > > > Increasing the worth/value of a company, through > > > > > > > > > > > purchasing it stock, > > > > > > > > > > > not only helps the company in the financial markets, it > > > > > > > > > > > also benefits > > > > > > > > > > > those employees whose 401ks are tied to the stock price. > > > > > > > > > > > And that's > > > > > > > > > > > just for starters.... > > > > > > > > > > > > I've dumbed this down to the point of my coffee cup > > > > > > > > > > > nodding in > > > > > > > > > > > agreement, hope that you can grasp it Gilligan. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 6, 10:41 am,PhreedomPhan<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Gaar, you should know by now that I fully oppose both > > > > > > > > > > > > the Welfare and > > > > > > > > > > > > the Warfare State. I think both are created for the > > > > > > > > > > > > deficit spending > > > > > > > > > > > > that enriches those who finance the debt. Still, it > > > > > > > > > > > > never ceases to > > > > > > > > > > > > amaze me how you, a self professed parasite, can talk > > > > > > > > > > > > of living off > > > > > > > > > > > > the sweat of others. > > > > > > > > > > > > > You don't remember professing to be a parasite? Let me > > > > > > > > > > > > refresh your > > > > > > > > > > > > memory. You have said in the past that you make your > > > > > > > > > > > > living as a Day > > > > > > > > > > > > Trader in the stock markets. That means that by > > > > > > > > > > > > speculating you are > > > > > > > > > > > > able to draw wealth from the system without actually > > > > > > > > > > > > producing > > > > > > > > > > > > anything. You draw a profit which you can then compete > > > > > > > > > > > > for goods and > > > > > > > > > > > > services with those who actually work for a living and > > > > > > > > > > > > put value into > > > > > > > > > > > > the system. You are living off the sweat of others. > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have in our bodies various bacteria and other > > > > > > > > > > > > organisms that > > > > > > > > > > > > contribute in some way to our well being while drawing > > > > > > > > > > > > nourishment > > > > > > > > > > > > from us, but any creature that draws nourishment from > > > > > > > > > > > > the host body > > > > > > > > > > > > without returning anything useful to that body is a > > > > > > > > > > > > parasite. You > > > > > > > > > > > > Gaar, by definition, are a parasite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rick > > > > > > > > > > > > 18th Century Liberal > > > > > > > > > > > > 21st Century > > > > > > > > > > > > Reactionaryhttp://PhreedomPhan-lostliberty.blogspot.comhttp://phreedomphan-ameri... > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 6, 10:16 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just making the point that he CHOSE to respond. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Usually, those who have no interest don't waste the > > > > > > > > > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guess you Loony Liberals have plenty of time to > > > > > > > > > > > > > waste, since you are > > > > > > > > > > > > > going to be Living off the sweat of others... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No surprise there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 5, 11:44 pm, "mike [move on] 532" <[EMAIL > > > > > > > > > > > > > PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > he is just trying to piss in your pocket hollywood > > > > > > > > > > > > > > . because the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > people rejected his hero ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 5, 10:51 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Gaar, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just didn't find the subject all that > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting. So sue me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Obama won, deal with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 5, 12:02 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 4, 8:24 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dosen't much matter what I think about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The better question with you holly is do you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > think? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You have shown here, time and again, to be only > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in what you > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > have and have not said, and not really > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > interested in discussing things > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > any further than your smantical rantings... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Imagine that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could list a few very simple > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups. 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