On Jan 24, 11:08 pm, frankg <[email protected]> wrote:
> You told me you had no more time to waste the last time.. why did you
> post again?
>
> You provided two editorials, not facts. I'm not impressed with someone
> citing what funds were cut when. I'm far more interested in
> engineering documents that state the basic design of the NOFDS failed.
> Pylons anchored way to shallow and sitting in peat; soil failure
> (piping) that caused the foundations of sea walls to wash away; real
> problems to the system, problems that were NOT being addressed by the
> maintenance.
>
> Every engineering study done to date supports this assessment. The
> ACoE, responsible for the design of the system, concedes it was a weak
> design that was incapable of holding back a storm like Katrina. No one
> directly responsible has wavered from this position. There isn't a
> single engineering report that contradicts this conclusion.
>
> You are a member of a very small minority of people who choose to
> ignore the facts in order to pursue your political attack on Bush.
> Just admit you're not interested in why the levees failed, you want
> the political capital you thought you had and you're not going to let
> no stinkin engineering reports screw that up for you. Thankfully your
> type of rhetoric didn't distract those who truly did care and as a
> result the NOFDS is targeted for some major engineering changes to
> address the true causes for the failure.
>
> Have a nice weekend...
>
> On Jan 24, 3:14 am, "liberal mike532 !" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > i provided you with the facts from people who were and are there . and
> > you ignore them in favor of trying to cover up for bush . there are
> > none so blind as those who will not see! and i have no more time to
> > waste with you on this topic !
>
> > On Jan 23, 11:11 am, frankg <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > I provide you a technical report by;
>
> > > Peter Nicholson, Ph.D., P.E.
> > > Associate Professor of Civil and Environmental Engineering and
> > > Graduate Program Chair
> > > University of Hawaii
> > > On behalf of the AMERICAN SOCIETY OF CIVIL ENGINEERS
>
> > > I provide you with;
>
> > > Reflections on the Draft Final U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
> > > Interagency Performance Evaluation Task Force (IPET) report titled
> > > Performance Evaluation of the New Orleans and Southeast Louisiana
> > > Hurricane Protection System
> > > Dr. R. G. Bea
> > > Professor
> > > Member Independent Levee Investigation Team (ILIT)
> > > Co-Director Center for Catastrophic Risk Management (CCRM)
>
> > > Which opens with the following observation;
>
> > > Overarching Findings
> > > Yes, the hurricane flood defense 'system' for the greater New Orleans
> > > area (NOFDS) was "a system in name only". Even though there had been
> > > only one agency in charge of concept development, design, and
> > > construction - the Corps of Engineers - it is clear that the NOFDS was
> > > not a coherent defense system. It was and continues to be an assembly
> > > of disjointed and defective components.
>
> > > And then goes on, in great depth, to explain the various faults in the
> > > current system’s design that led to the failures.
>
> > > I give you professional reports by experts in their field who did
> > > extensive analysis of the levee system and you give me Bill Ryan and
> > > Will Bunch? These people are not ‘the Bush Administration’ but are
> > > professionals who had but one mission; to analyze the failure and
> > > determine why it happened. Are Ryan and Bunch engineers? -No. Were
> > > they on the ground in New Orleans doing first hand examination of the
> > > levee system? –No.
>
> > > Ryan’s piece is immediately dismissible because he couldn’t even
> > > identify where the greatest storm surge in New Orleans struck, which
> > > was the river, not Lake Pontchartrain. The storm surge in the lake was
> > > actually quite mild.
>
> > > Bunch’s piece isn’t much better. Citing the frustrations of Maestri a
> > > year before Katrina hit is misleading. Yes, people were frustrated
> > > that funding had been cut. Yes, the levees had sunk (and btw, the same
> > > reason why the levees were sinking is behind the eventual failure –
> > > soil collapse – something that was not being addressed by the repairs
> > > that were impacted by funding… but you knew this already because
> > > you’re an expert on the subject). Bunch captures the story a year
> > > before Katrina and is focused on the projects designed to restore the
> > > system to the original design specifications, not the reengineering
> > > project, which was not targeted to be completed until 2015 at the
> > > earliest. It’s not an inaccurate report, but it is misleading.
>
> > > I can’t explain this any better for you. Apparently trying to blame
> > > Bush is more important to you than understanding the true cause of the
> > > failure so it isn't repeated. There are none so blind as those who
> > > will not see.
>
> > > On Jan 23, 9:43 am, "liberal mike532 !" <[email protected]>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > THE PEOPLES' TRAGEDY AND THE ERA OF 'PRIVATISATION'
> > > > The following comments are from American social crediter 'Bill Ryan'
> > > > "The lesson that should be learned (from the horrible aftermath of
> > > > Hurricane Katrina) is that we ignore the necessity for continuous
> > > > improvement to infrastructure at our peril. The damage came from wind,
> > > > wind driven water or "storm surge," and flooding. New Orleans missed
> > > > most of the storm surge from the gulf because the eye of the storm
> > > > passed to the City's east, but did have some surge in reverse off Lake
> > > > Pontchartrain due to the counter-clockwise rotation of the storm,
> > > > hence the broken segments to the I-10 causeway.
> > > > Most of the damage to New Orleans is from flooding due to the broken
> > > > levees, which should have been strengthened years ago. If they had
> > > > been strengthened, New Orleans would now be mostly intact today. The
> > > > city is now submerged in Lake Pontchartrain. A decision will have to
> > > > be made to recover the city or abandon it forever, like Pompeii. Most
> > > > of the damage to the east of New Orleans is from storm surge. We have
> > > > had the technology to mitigate the effects of storm surge for more
> > > > than a century. After the 1900 storm that devastated Galveston, the
> > > > Corps of Engineers built a magnificent seawall to protect the
> > > > developed area of the island, which was extended in the 60s.
> > > > The era of "privatization" has ended such projects.
>
> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> > > > "IT'S MORE THAN THAT," EXPLAINS WILL BUNCH
> > > > Will Bunch is a senior writer at the Philadelphia Daily
> > > > News.http://www.alternet.org/story/24871/1September2005.
> > > > "Washington knew exactly what needed to be done to protect the
> > > > citizens of New Orleans from disasters like Katrina. Yet federal
> > > > funding for Louisiana flood control projects was diverted to pay for
> > > > the war in Iraq."
> > > > On June 8, 2004, Walter Maestri, emergency management chief for
> > > > Jefferson Parish, Louisiana, told the Times-Picayune:
> > > > "It appears that the money has been moved in the president's budget to
> > > > handle homeland security (furthering the USA police state…ed) and the
> > > > war in Iraq, (furthering their new world order agenda…ed) and I
> > > > suppose that's the price we pay. Nobody locally is happy that the
> > > > levees can't be finished, and we are doing everything we can to make
> > > > the case that this is a security issue for us."
>
> > > > Levees are sinking: That June, with the 2004 hurricane seasion
> > > > starting, the Corps' Naomi went before a local agency, the East
> > > > Jefferson Levee Authority, and essentially begged for $2 million for
> > > > urgent work that Washington was now unable to pay for.
>
> > > > From the June 18, 2004 Times-Picayune: "The system is in great shape,
> > > > but the levees are sinking. Everything is sinking, and if we don't get
> > > > the money fast enough to raise them, then we can't stay ahead of the
> > > > settlement," he said. "The problem that we have isn't that the levee
> > > > is low, but that the federal funds have dried up so that we can't
> > > > raise them."
> > > > The panel authorized that money, and on July 1, 2004, it had to pony
> > > > up another $250,000 when it learned that stretches of the levee in
> > > > Metairie had sunk by four feet. The agency had to pay for the work
> > > > with higher property taxes. The levee board noted in October 2004 that
> > > > the feds were also now not paying for a hoped-for $15 million project
> > > > to better shore up the banks of Lake Pontchartrain.
>
> > > > Federal Government funds reduced:
> > > > The 2004 hurricane season was the worst in decades. In spite of that,
> > > > the federal government came back this spring with the steepest
> > > > reduction in hurricane- and flood-control funding for New Orleans in
> > > > history. Because of the proposed cuts, the Corps office there imposed
> > > > a hiring freeze. Officials said that money targeted for the SELA
> > > > project -- $10.4 million, down from $36.5 million -- was not enough to
> > > > start any new jobs. According to New Orleans CityBusiness this June 5:
> > > > The district has identified $35 million in projects to build and
> > > > improve levees, floodwalls and pumping stations in St. Bernard,
> > > > Orleans, Jefferson and St. Charles parishes. Those projects are
> > > > included in a Corps line item called Lake Pontchartrain, where funding
> > > > is scheduled to be cut from $5.7 million this year to $2.9 million in
> > > > 2006. Naomi said it's enough to pay salaries but little else. "We'll
> > > > do some design work. We'll design the contracts and get them ready to
> > > > go if we get the money. But we don't have the money to put the work in
> > > > the field, and that's the problem," Naomi said.
> > > > There was, at the same time, a growing
>
> ...
>
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>
> - Show quoted text -
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