Actually the really interesting cases won't be when gay "rights" apparatchiks sue to force ministers to perform church weddings for gays, or when gays sue private matchmakers to provide them services (as they already did to E Harmony) but when they sue pregnant women who want to give a baby up to adoption, but prefer a traditional family, to give up a quota of their babies to gay couples.
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: marc samberg <[email protected]> Date: Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 11:42 PM Subject: [american_patriotism] Being a "Public Christian"-Gay Marriage Ruling To: whateverreturns <[email protected]> Being a "Public Christian"-Gay Marriage Ruling Being a "Public Christian" Reacting to the Iowa gay marriage ruling today, Rod Dreher writes: This morning, I had breakfast with some guys, including a lawyer.. We weren't aware of this decision, but we talked about this issue. The lawyer said that as soon as homosexuality receives constitutionally protected status equivalent to race, then "it will be very hard to be a public Christian." By which he meant to voice support, no matter how muted, for traditional Christian teaching on homosexuality and marriage. To do so would be to set yourself up for hostile work environment challenges, including dismissal from your job, and generally all the legal sanctions that now apply to people who openly express racist views. That world got a little bit closer this morning. And most people don't even see it. I realize its often hard to appreciate how your words will come across to those who don't share your beliefs, but good grief, is it possible to be more oblivious? Dreher is lamenting the fact that as the law progresses toward recognizing the rights of homosexual people, it will become increasingly hard to be publicly intolerant of homosexuality. Dreher thinks it's getting hard to be a "public Christian" in this country. Yeah, it's pretty rough being a Christian in America. Maybe Dreher should try being a "public homosexual" for a while and compare the experience. If I had a Quantum Leap machine, I'd be tempted to zap Dreher into the life of a gay high school student or maybe a gay man in a small Southern town and see how easy he finds it to publicly be himself. I wonder if Dreyer has any clue how much harder that would be than anything he's ever had to deal with as a straight white christian male. The truth is that while society is much more tolerant of homosexuality than it used to be, it's still not easy to be openly gay, particularly in certain parts of the country and among certain age groups. Tens of thousands of gay Americans (at least) remain closeted, afraid to admit to their family and friends--sometimes even themselves--that they are gay. Gay teenagers are three times more likely to commit suicide than straight teenagers. These facts can both be explained--at least in large part--by the continued willingness of many Americans to publicly display their intolerance of homosexuality. So forgive me if I don't join Dreher's pity party for the poor oppressed Christians who are increasingly being forced to keep their intolerant beliefs in the closet. Which brings me to another point. I find it more than a little pathetic that Dreher and his friends feel that they can't be "public Christians" without going out of their way to advertise their disapproval of homosexuality. First, there are millions of Christians in this country who have no problem at all with gay marriage or homosexuality generally (indeed, there are many gay Christians). But more importantly, since when is expressing disapproval of homosexuality a key part of being a "public Christian"? What about going to church or singing Christmas carols or celebrating Easter or (gasp!) volunteering your time to help those less fortunate? Aren't those pretty effective ways of being publicly Christian? Is gay marriage really going to make it any harder to do any of those things? We still do live in a majority Christian country after all, and I have a feeling that will continue to be the case even after we start treating gay people like full citizens. Marriage Equality in Iowa Today the Iowa Supreme Court issued a unanimous ruling recognizing the right of gay couples to marry. The court held that the Iowa statute prohibiting same sex marriage violated the state's equal protection clause. When you take a step back and look at the basic legal argument behind these cases, the correct answer is remarkably clear. So clear, in fact, that I'm quite certain that future generations of lawyers and law students will look at these cases and wonder why it took so long for the courts to reach such an obvious conclusion, particularly in light of the extensive (and directly analogous) case law dealing with miscegenation laws and segregation. Once you accept the premise that there is nothing wrong with being gay (a premise which, I think, the vast majority of people--especially educated people like judges--accept), it becomes nearly impossible to make a principled legal argument in defense of laws that prohibit gay people from being married. It's just such an obvious and straightforward violation of equal protection. I'll go out on a limb and predict that--within 10 years--the U.S. Supreme Court, in an opinion authored by Justice Kennedy, will issue a landmark ruling striking down prohibitions on gay marriage. I also believe that the next Democratic presidential nominee will be unapologetically pro gay marriage, and it's not inconceivable that at some point during his time in office, President Obama himself will publicly reverse his position on this issue. The political and legal trajectory of this issue is pretty easy to chart out at this point. And when it reaches its logical endpoint, with full marriage equality across the country, we're all going to look back and wonder why it took so damn long to recognize something so obvious. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ -- A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. ~Herm Albright~ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ProJewishProZionistGroup/?yguid=368134690 http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/stillnotjustmusicanymore/?yguid=368134690 http://groups.yahoo.com/adultconf?dest=%2Fgroup%2Fwhateverreturns%2F%3Fyguid%3D368134690 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shieldofdavid/?yguid=373549731 __._,_.___ Messages in this topic <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/message/16999;_ylc=X3oDMTM3aXRzYjllBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRtc2dJZAMxNjk5OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzEEdHBjSWQDMTY5OTk->( 1) Reply (via web post) <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJyYXE5Z2Z0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRtc2dJZAMxNjk5OQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzE-?act=reply&messageNum=16999>| Start a new topic <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZGhvamppBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzE-> Messages<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZjNsYThwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNtc2dzBHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzE->| Files<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJnOTRvNWFyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNmaWxlcwRzdGltZQMxMjM5MDc1ODMx>| Photos<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/photos;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNzFhdmE0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNwaG90BHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzE->| Links<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/links;_ylc=X3oDMTJnYmdoY3Y0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNsaW5rcwRzdGltZQMxMjM5MDc1ODMx>| Database<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/database;_ylc=X3oDMTJkdWxoZWQ0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNkYgRzdGltZQMxMjM5MDc1ODMx>| Members<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOGw5ZzEwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzEyMzkwNzU4MzE->| Calendar<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/american_patriotism/calendar;_ylc=X3oDMTJlbzhzdGUzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEyNjE1MjkxBGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTMwMzI5NgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNjYWwEc3RpbWUDMTIzOTA3NTgzMQ--> [image: Yahoo! 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