Sounds like a miracle! :) Maybe MS should investigate how their OS should run by looking at Win4Lin. Seriously, maybe Win4Lin provides a 'nicer' system to Windows (more memory, smarter swapping algorithms, etc.) Yeah, I should give it a shot.
Thanks, Tony > -----Original Message----- > From: Jason Van Dellen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 5:11 PM > To: Protel EDA Forum > Subject: Re: [PEDA] Protel under Win4Lin (WAS OpenOffice & 3D CAD) > > > Tony, > > I can see where your coming from. I understand that Win4Lin is a > Virtual PC. > And I don't know all that Win4lin has done, but I do know when I > look at the > system files in the windows install from Linux some of them have > a symlink > that points to Win4Lin files. > Eg. mrgpmon.dll points to /opt/win4lin/mwin95/mrgpmon.dll > > I don't want to argue with you, all I know is my experinces. If > I run the > same amount of applications like Protel, Adobe Acrobat and > Internet Explorer > in Native Windows 98 I have to watch my memory usage very close or else > Protel will crash. When I'm running the same apps under Win4Lin > I don't have > to watch memory usage as closly. This is running on the same computer. > > Right now I have Win98 runing in Win4Lin with > -Protel99SE which has been autorouting for over 7 hours now > running Protels > "PCB Benchmark 94.DDB" in the examples directory. > I just opened > -3 instances of windows Explorer > -Internet Explorer Viewing a google.ca > -Acobat Reader 4.0 Viewing a document > -MS Word 2000 Viewing a document > -MS Excel Viewing a document > -MS Paint Viewing a screen shot > -MS Outlook Express > -PCAD 2001 Trial Version Viewing PCB file > -Resource Meter > -Randy McNally TripMaker 1999 > > And I still have full control, things have slowed down a little, > but it hasn't > crashed. > > Now if I did this under Native windows 98 things would start to > crash. Do you > agree with me? > > So these are my personal experinces and take it as you will. > Until you try it > for yourself you will never know. : ) > > Jason > On Tuesday 09 July 2002 16:13, Tony Karavidas wrote: > > I disagree. From their site, they talk about Win4Lin and Wine: > > > > Wine is a "Windows system call emulator." Win4Lin is not at all > like Wine > > because Win4Lin provides a virtual PC that real Windows runs in. Using a > > virtual PC to run your Windows applications is more reliable than using > > Wine or similar "Windows Replacements." This is the case > because the full > > Windows API is not documented and most Windows applications by design or > > accident rely on undocumented behavior of Windows. Some > applications will > > be able to work fine via Wine, but it is not a general solution. In a > > virtual PC applications generally work because they are being run by > > Windows. > > > > So you see they describe their Win4Lin product as a "virtual PC." Your > > windows apps see only windows because they are running in a MS native > > windows environment. Windows sees the virtual PC that Win4Lin provides, > > including a FAT file system and other hardware specific resources. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jason Van Dellen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 1:37 PM > > > To: Protel EDA Forum > > > Subject: Re: [PEDA] Protel under Win4Lin (WAS OpenOffice & 3D CAD) > > > > > > > > > Tony, > > > > > > It's not all Windows services, Win4Lin uses proprietary DLLs and > > > drivers they > > > have written. So the hardware and resource management services > > > are handled > > > differently then if you were in native Windows. The support staff at > > > Netraverse.com could tell you more I'm sure. I just know from my > > > personal > > > experiences. Try it for yourself. > > > > > > It's not exactly win98. And there are Limitations. For one you > > > can't play > > > games with DirectX, but who's playing games at work. > > > > > > Jason > > > > > > On Tuesday 09 July 2002 12:36, Tony Karavidas wrote: > > > > Well that's just ridiculous. The router's ability to complete a > > > > > > board has > > > > > > > nothing to do with the OS except for when you bump up against memory > > > > limitations (which is fairly unlikely in your system) The > > > > > > autorouter code > > > > > > > is an encapsulated function, and besides, you are still running > > > > Win98SE, it's just wrapped up in Linux. The memory > management for the > > > > > > app is still > > > > > > > the same; it's calling Windows services for everything, not > linux. The > > > > linux memory services only help YOU when the Win98SE barfs. > > > > > > Instead of your > > > > > > > machine coming down, only a controllable piece of Linux is > brought down > > > > which can be successfully managed by Linux. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Jason Van Dellen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 10:56 AM > > > > > To: Protel EDA Forum > > > > > Subject: Re: [PEDA] Protel under Win4Lin (WAS OpenOffice & 3D CAD) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I run ProtelSE sp6 on Win4Lin 4. I switched over almost two > > > > > years now from > > > > > NT4. Win4Lin only supports Win98/SE/ME so I use Win98SE. I > > > > > > have a Dual > > > > > > > > Celeron 300 I build a few years ago and even though win98 > > > > > doesn't sopport > > > > > dual CPUs, under win4lin it utilizes both CPU's. I found that my > > > > > AutoRoutes > > > > > are faster and finish at 100% or very close to it, when the same > > > > > file under > > > > > windows would finish at ~80%. Also I found the memory management > > > > > improved. > > > > > Under native Win98, Protel would crash if you opened too many > > > > > applications. > > > > > Win4Lin still uses up memory but it won't crash. The Windows > > > > > > 98 portion > > > > > > > > might crash it's still Microsoft you know. :) If it dose for > > > > > some reason > > > > > freeze or crash, I just close the window and reopen it. It takes > > > > > only ~15 > > > > > secs to be back up and running. > > > > > > > > > > I started back when Win4Lin 1.0 just came out running on Mandrake > > > > > 7.2. Since > > > > > then there has been great improvements. I'm now running > > > > > > Win4Lin 4.0.2 on > > > > > > > > Mandrake 8.2. > > > > > > > > > > The Win4Lin install program works very well and the support is > > > > > the best I've > > > > > found. I was having an interesting problem with my video driver > > > > > and I worked > > > > > with Win4Lin tech support for a while trying to figure it out. > > > > > They couldn't > > > > > understand why I was the only one having this problem, so > they wrote > > > > > a special driver for my computer. And now it works > great - It's a > > > > > work around > > > > > but it works, so I'm happy. > > > > > > > > > > Some features I like > > > > > > > > > > 1. While I'm performing an AutoRoute, I can switch to my other > > > > > desktops and > > > > > read email (Kmail), perform research on the web, etc... without a > > > > > performance > > > > > loss. > > > > > > > > > > 2. Better memory management, I can't remember the last time > > > > > > it crashed. > > > > > > > > 3. I can back up my whole win98 install in case I'm doing some > > > > > upgrading or > > > > > just doing routine backups. Let me explain the file structure: > > > > > > > > > > In Linux all users have a separate directory in /home eg > /home/john > > > > > Win4Lin installs a separate windows install for each user in > > > > > /home/john/win/ > > > > > As far as Windows98 knows the root directory is /home/john/win/ = > > > > > C:\ So the windows directory for user john would be > > > > > > /home/john/win/windows/ = > > > > > > > > C:\windows > > > > > > > > > > So if I want to back up my windows I just run "tar cvfz > > > > > /home_john_win_backup.tgz /home/john/win" and I have my > > > > > > complete windows > > > > > > > > install tarred or compressed into one file. Like a zip (for > > > > > those who don't > > > > > know about tar) I can now save it to a cd or another computer. > > > > > > > > > > There were times when I could run Win4Lin cause I was messing > > > > > with something, > > > > > but needed to retrieve some files, so I just went to > > > > > /home/john/win/my files > > > > > in linux retrieved them. Then when I had time I fixed the > > > > > problem and all > > > > > was good. > > > > > > > > > > There's one feature that I'm not fond of and that's in the > > > > > > windows files. > > > > > > > > Win4lin creates these .mapfiles which are hiddin directory's > > > > > > in all the > > > > > > > > directory's. Which I can only see from Linux. So I created a > > > > > directory in > > > > > /home/john/User to hold all my working files and then shared it > > > > > through the > > > > > network in Linux with Samba and then used Network Neighborhood in > > > > > Win4Lin to > > > > > map it as a drive. I found this works very well. > > > > > > > > > > Well I think that's enough for now. I hope this helps. > > > > > > > > > > Jason > > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday 09 July 2002 08:52, Bagotronix Tech Support wrote: > > > > > > I have noticed that OpenOffice 1.0 (Windows version) will > > > > > > > > > > sometimes crash > > > > > > > > > > > when opening a Word document if you do it by > double-clicking on the > > > > > > filename in Windows Explorer. But, if you open the Word > > > > > > > > > > document from the > > > > > > > > > > > File->Open dialog it works OK. > > > > > > > > > > > > Could be a file association problem? > > > > > > > > > > > > If you feel like paying for software, you could try > > > > > > StarOffice from Sun > > > > > > > > > Microsystems. It's the paid version of OpenOffice, and I > > > > > > think it also > > > > > > > > > comes with a database program (OpenOffice doesn't). > > > > > > > > > > > > Haven't seen the 3D tool. > > > > > > > > > > > > Did someone on this list say they used Protel 99SE on Linux > > > > > > > > > > with Win4Lin? > > > > > > > > > > > How is that working for you? Any bugs, undocumented > > > > > > > > > > "features", or quirks? > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Ivan Baggett > > > > > > Bagotronix Inc. > > > > > > website: www.bagotronix.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Phillip Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > To: "Protel EDA Forum" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 7:22 AM > > > > > > Subject: [PEDA] OpenOffice & 3D CAD > > > > > > > > > > > > > I just got OpenOffice the other day. I was focused on > > > > > > > > > > reading in a word > > > > > > > > > > > > document at the time. I tried opening a few Word documents, > > > > > > > > > > but all it > > > > > > > > > > > seemed > > > > > > > > > > > > > to do was crash for me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did note while it was installing, that there was some > > > > > > kind of a 3D > > > > > > > > > > viewer or editor tool in OpenOffice too? I had planed to > > > > > > go back and > > > > > > > > > > check it out, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Has anyone used this OpenOffice 3D tool? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm assuming it's a 3D editor. > > > > > > > If this works, it would be nice to see P99SE (and DXP) > > > > > > > > > > support it, as a > > > > > > > > > > > > way to make models for the 3D viewer in P99SE. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > JVD> If I need to create/open/save > > > > > > > JVD> Office97/2000/XP documents I can use OpenOffice.org. If > > > > > > > > > > I need to > > > > > > > > > > > run > > > > > > > > > > > > > JVD> Windows Apps(eg Protel), I run Win4Lin. > > > > > > > > http://www.netraverse.com/ > > > > > > > *********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > >* * Tracking #: 001313E328BB2943A92C3CA75FF860AF0222687A > > > > > > * > > > > > > > *********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > >* > > > > > > -- > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > Jason Van Dellen > > > Trilogy-Net Inc. > > > #4; 1935 - 27Ave NE > > > Calgary, AB > > > T2E 7E4 > > > > > > www.trilogy-net.com > > > Phone (403) 219-8868 > > > Fax (403) 219-8860 > > > Cell (403) 815-1626 > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > -- > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Jason Van Dellen > Trilogy-Net Inc. > #4; 1935 - 27Ave NE > Calgary, AB > T2E 7E4 > > www.trilogy-net.com > Phone (403) 219-8868 > Fax (403) 219-8860 > Cell (403) 815-1626 > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
