Fine with me :) On Sun, 10 May 2020 at 12:45, Sumana Harihareswara < sumana.hariharesw...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey all -- I've heard no opposition, onlist or offlist. As I asked in > April: please speak up if I'm wrong, or if there's some other reason to > keep this Google group going. And please reply if you agree with the idea - > Jason's the only one who's replied so far. > > Reply by May 12th (2 days from now). > > -Sumana > > > On Friday, May 1, 2020 at 6:02:16 PM UTC-4, Sumana Harihareswara wrote: >> >> Thanks, Jason. >> >> Nudge to the group; 11 more days to comment. >> -Sumana >> >> On 4/14/20 9:20 PM, Jason R. Coombs wrote: >> > My initial reaction was that I _need_ this list, but after a moment’s >> consideration, I think you’re right. +1 >> > >> >> On 13 Apr, 2020, at 22:18, Sumana Harihareswara <s...@....nyc> wrote: >> >> >> >> TL;DR: ok to archive this Google group? Reply by May 12th. >> >> >> >> Below: Context and proposal, reasoning, and timeline. >> >> >> >> >> >> Context & proposal: >> >> >> >> People talk about Python packaging problems, work, and plans in many >> different media: https://discuss.python.org/ , distutils-sig, blogs, >> Twitter, conference talks, IRC, https://python.zulipchat.com/ , >> individual GitHub issues on several different repositories, Stack Overflow, >> and more. So people frequently ask me: where should I go to keep up, or to >> announce something or ask for feedback? It's hard to guide them, because of >> this proliferation and fragmentation. And people have commented on that >> before, both senior folks like Donald[0], and people who are earlier in the >> learning curve[1]. >> >> >> >> We can't and shouldn't stop people from talking about Python packaging >> on social media, at conferences, and so on. But three mailing lists/forums >> on nearly identical topics strikes me as more than we need. >> >> >> >> So I suggest that, one month from now, we stop posting to this list ( >> pypa-dev@googlegroups.com) and essentially archive it. >> >> >> >> >> >> Reasoning (why close THIS one?): >> >> >> >> We now have three mailing list-type places to talk about Python >> packaging tools and progress. All of them allow both reading and posting >> from the web or from an email client, and all of them have web archives >> with built-in search. Generally, the people who want to talk about one of >> these topics want to hear about the same topics (things happening in PyPA >> and about related things in Python that will affect PyPA) no matter what >> venue they're in. >> >> >> >> 1. pypa-dev (here). Started in 2013. About 5 posts in the past month, >> mostly cross-posted to other places as well. Hosted by Google in a >> closed-source application that doesn't seem to get much love from Google's >> product folks. >> >> >> >> 2. The distutils-sig mailing list[2] which has expanded in its scope. >> It's a place to discuss and resolve problems that cut across different >> parts of the Python packaging ecosystem, and to announce new releases or >> in-progress work. You can log in an account, or with Facebook, GitHub, >> GitLab, or Google authentication. About 12 threads in the past month. >> Hosted by Python Software Foundation with an open source application that's >> under active development. >> >> >> >> 3. The Packaging category on Python's Discourse forum >> https://discuss.python.org/c/packaging , which started about a year and >> a half ago[3]. Very wide scope. You can log in with an account, or with >> Facebook or GitHub or via email. About 21 posts per month. Hosted by PSF >> with an open source application that's under active development. >> >> >> >> Maybe I'm missing something. Maybe there is a function being served by >> having a mailing list that is specifically labelled "PyPA" (for instance, >> we could add "get on the Google Group and that makes you a member of PyPA" >> to the pypa.io docs[4]). Maybe there are people actively reading/posting >> here who feel unwelcome on the other two lists/forums, because of >> atmosphere or user interface. As a person doing a bunch of work on PyPA >> stuff over the past ~2.5 years, I haven't noticed either of those >> conditions, so please speak up if I'm wrong, or if there's some other >> reason to keep this Google group going. >> >> >> >> >> >> Timeline and methods: >> >> >> >> Here's what I suggest, and what I will carry out if there is no >> objection. >> >> >> >> In one month, on May 13th, I would verify that no one has argued here >> for why this Google group should continue to be open for posting. Or, even >> if a few people have objected to closing the list, I would check for rough >> consensus, especially of people who are doing SOMETHING productive having >> to do with PyPA (teaching, answering questions online or in person, running >> key infrastructure, writing documentation, making or fixing software, >> etc.). >> >> >> >> I would post a final message to this list, marking its close and >> suggesting that people use distutils-sig or discuss.python.org instead. >> >> >> >> Then, I would stop members from posting to this Google group. That is, >> I would stop members from creating new posts, but leave past posts up at >> their current URLs, so links, browsing and search would work. >> >> >> >> And then I would look through relevant documentation within PyPA >> repositories to see what needs updating (READMEs and so on pointing to the >> old list), and submit pull requests. >> >> >> >> >> >> I appreciate the work folks here have done to carry forward Python >> packaging over the past several years. I don't mean to diminish that or to >> insult anyone here. I want to help us out, and I think closing this list >> will help focus that energy better. But I am open to hearing that I am >> wrong. >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Sumana Harihareswara >> >> Changeset Consulting >> >> https://changeset.nyc >> >> >> >> [0] >> https://mail.python.org/archives/list/distutils-...@python.org/thread/YDGSVFLTFYVXEJ3QFK655DTYI4VTHA3U/#F7IKOB42INCX75A3KFMVP22CHWFBQTZ5 >> >> >> >> [1] https://groups.google.com/d/msg/pypa-dev/U6NO55bExbE/-tGFQX8EBgAJ >> >> >> >> [2] https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/distutils-sig.python.org/ >> >> >> >> [3] >> https://mail.python.org/archives/list/distutils-...@python.org/thread/VXXPZCVRLH27N46TR3P6IEOKIA47POCM/#NIVBGNL3WTOHYENGIBB4H5ZR3ENRGJOU >> >> >> >> [4] https://github.com/pypa/pypa.io/issues/28 >> >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "pypa-dev" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to pypa-dev+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pypa-dev/ffe5fe5e-f692-49d5-be95-88568790a03d%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pypa-dev/ffe5fe5e-f692-49d5-be95-88568790a03d%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pypa-dev" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pypa-dev+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pypa-dev/CAA4OSDBhds-jMXbUftTo%3D8%3DM%3DVRh3WgXARGR2qASRjAyOZyx7w%40mail.gmail.com.
