On Fri, Nov 15, 2019, at 13:41, Dennis Lee Bieber wrote:
>       C# documents those as something visible to the user at the language
> level...
> https://www.infoworld.com/article/3043992/a-deep-dive-value-and-reference-types-in-net.html
> """
> Types in Microsoft .Net can be either value type or reference type.
> """

I was strictly talking about how reference types work (which are just like 
python or Java objects), and how that is completely distinct from the "ref" of 
call-by-reference arguments which are also supported, and that both features 
coexist just fine in the same language. The existence of value types wasn't 
really relevant to my point.

I'm not sure if you were left with the impression that you can't have a "ref" 
argument that points to a variable of reference type (and which does *not* 
point directly to the object), but that is false.

>       Similar to Java.

Well, Java doesn't have user-defined value types, but again, value types are 
beside the point.
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