On Sat, 18 Jul 2020 at 05:39, dn via Python-list <python-list@python.org> wrote: > > On 18/07/20 3:29 PM, boB Stepp wrote: > > On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 9:48 PM dn via Python-list > > <python-list@python.org> wrote: > >> > >> On 18/07/20 1:53 PM, Castillo, Herbert S wrote: > >>> I downloaded python not to long ago, and today when I opened Python on > >>> Windows it gave me a modify setup prompt. I have tried to click on modify > >>> , repair and even uninstalled and installed it back, but when I try to > >>> open Python up again, I keep on getting the same modify setup prompt. I > >>> am not sure of what to do? Thank you in advance. > >> > >> > >> Regret that this mailing list does not support graphics attachments. > >> > >> Which part of https://docs.python.org/dev/using/windows.html failed? > > > > Just for grins I just now glanced at the link dn provided. Yes, this > > is a very thorough, very accurate, very *technical* help resource. > > But if I were a person who had never seen a shell, cmd.exe or > > Powershell window, never programmed before, had no clue about how to > > truly use my OS, etc., I don't think I would understand a bit of this > > "help" document, and, at best, would find it very intimidating. If > > this community does wish to cater to those who are totally new to the > > world of programming and learning how to really use their PC at any > > depth, then I think a different approach or set of documents is > > needed. And an easier way for those playing with the idea of learning > > programming and Python to connect with such documentation. > > [snip] > > There is also THE Python Tutorial - the opening action is two?three > pages 'in'. Is that suitably less-technical and more usable to a 'beginner'? > https://docs.python.org/3/tutorial/index.html
I would say that the official tutorial is not targeted at the total novice. I think it used to be described as the tutorial for people with experience of programming in other languages but I might be misremembering. The main python.org page links to a "beginners guide" well actually there are two beginners guides... https://www.python.org/ Under "get started" there is a link to this beginners guide: https://www.python.org/about/gettingstarted/ You can also hover over documentation and choose beginners guide to get this one: https://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide The former starts by asking whether you are new to programming and if so suggests this page: https://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide/NonProgrammers It also has an "installing" section which links to here: https://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide/Download All of these have lots of information and many links to other pages. I'm not sure how you'd find the page dn linked to which is at least more direct about how to install: https://docs.python.org/dev/using/windows.html Certainly I don't see it if I go straight to the download pages: https://www.python.org/downloads/ https://www.python.org/downloads/windows/ I think if I was new to programming or installing software in general I would find all of this quite bewildering. My experience of teaching total novice programmers is that you really can't shirk the fundamental question: how should I install this thing and start using it *before* I have any idea what I'm doing? Novices don't need to be told that there are 100 ways to do it: they need to be told exactly how to do it in a way that will work for them. If I was writing the tutorial but aiming at total novices I would probably begin by suggesting to use an online shell: https://www.python.org/shell/ There could be a short guide there that explains very clearly how to do simple commands in that online shell. At that point you are ready to test the examples from page 3 of the official tutorial but I think it is still not pitched at novices: https://docs.python.org/3/tutorial/introduction.html Then after a few examples and some familiarity it could be time to suggest installing locally. That should be with a no nonsense explanation that makes no reference to terminals, PATH, etc because those are just intimidating distractions to a novice at that point in time. The sympy docs have a lot of room for improvement but one of the things that is very useful for beginners there is the "Run code block in sympy live" button which means that you can follow the tutorial/docs and try things out before having anything installed locally: https://docs.sympy.org/latest/tutorial/intro.html#introduction -- Oscar -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list