On 21.06.2024 22:54, Peter Xu wrote:
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 07:40:01PM +0200, Maciej S. Szmigiero wrote:
On 21.06.2024 17:56, Peter Xu wrote:
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024 at 05:31:54PM +0200, Maciej S. Szmigiero wrote:
On 21.06.2024 17:04, Fabiano Rosas wrote:
"Maciej S. Szmigiero" <m...@maciej.szmigiero.name> writes:
Hi Fabiano,
On 20.06.2024 23:21, Fabiano Rosas wrote:
Hi folks,
First of all, apologies for the roughness of the series. I'm off for
the next couple of weeks and wanted to put something together early
for your consideration.
This series is a refactoring (based on an earlier, off-list
attempt[0]), aimed to remove the usage of the MultiFDPages_t type in
the multifd core. If we're going to add support for more data types to
multifd, we first need to clean that up.
This time around this work was prompted by Maciej's series[1]. I see
you're having to add a bunch of is_device_state checks to work around
the rigidity of the code.
Aside from the VFIO work, there is also the intent (coming back from
Juan's ideas) to make multifd the default code path for migration,
which will have to include the vmstate migration and anything else we
put on the stream via QEMUFile.
I have long since been bothered by having 'pages' sprinkled all over
the code, so I might be coming at this with a bit of a narrow focus,
but I believe in order to support more types of payloads in multifd,
we need to first allow the scheduling at multifd_send_pages() to be
independent of MultiFDPages_t. So here it is. Let me know what you
think.
Thanks for the patch set, I quickly glanced at these patches and they
definitely make sense to me.
(..)
(as I said, I'll be off for a couple of weeks, so feel free to
incorporate any of this code if it's useful. Or to ignore it
completely).
I guess you are targeting QEMU 9.2 rather than 9.1 since 9.1 has
feature freeze in about a month, correct?
For general code improvements like this I'm not thinking about QEMU
releases at all. But this series is not super complex, so I could
imagine we merging it in time for 9.1 if we reach an agreement.
Are you thinking your series might miss the target? Or have concerns
over the stability of the refactoring? We can within reason merge code
based on the current framework and improve things on top, we already did
something similar when merging zero-page support. I don't have an issue
with that.
The reason that I asked whether you are targeting 9.1 is because my
patch set is definitely targeting that release.
At the same time my patch set will need to be rebased/refactored on top
of this patch set if it is supposed to be merged for 9.1 too.
If this patch set gets merged quickly that's not really a problem.
On the other hand, if another iteration(s) is/are needed AND you are
not available in the coming weeks to work on them then there's a
question whether we will make the required deadline.
I think it's a bit rush to merge the vfio series in this release. I'm not
sure it has enough time to be properly reviewed, reposted, retested, etc.
I've already started looking at it, and so far I think I have doubt not
only on agreement with Fabiano on the device_state thing which I prefer to
avoid, but also I'm thinking of any possible way to at least make the
worker threads generic too: a direct impact could be vDPA in the near
future if anyone cared, while I don't want modules to create threads
randomly during migration.
Meanwhile I'm also thinking whether that "the thread needs to dump all
data, and during iteration we can't do that" is the good reason to not
support that during iterations.
I didn't yet reply because I don't think I think all things through, but
I'll get there.
So I'm not saying that the design is problematic, but IMHO it's just not
mature enough to assume it will land in 9.1, considering it's still a large
one, and the first non-rfc version just posted two days ago.
The RFC version was posted more than 2 months ago.
It has received some review comments from multiple people,
all of which were addressed in this patch set version.
I thought it was mostly me who reviewed it, am I right? Or do you have
other thread that has such discussion happening, and the design review has
properly done and reached an agreement?
Daniel P. Berrangé also submitted a few comments: [1], [2], [3], [4], [5].
In fact, it is him who first suggested not having a new channel header
wire format or dedicated device state channels.
In addition to that, Avihai was also following our discussions: [6] and
he also looked privately at an early (but functioning) draft of these
patches well before the RFC was even publicly posted.
IMHO that is also not how RFC works.
It doesn't work like "if RFC didn't got NACKed, a maintainer should merge
v1 when someone posts it". Instead RFC should only mean these at least to
me: "(1) please review this from high level, things can drastically change;
(2) please don't merge this, because it is not for merging but for getting
comments."
Beyond, it doesn't imply anything for what happens after the RFC series.
That "RFC" marking on v0 was meant to signify it as a draft not suitable
to be merged immediately.
Much like marking a {pull,merge} request a draft on Git{Hub,Lab}.
docs/devel/submitting-a-patch.rst even says that:
"RFC" means "Request For Comments" and is a statement that you don't
intend for your patchset to be applied to master, but would like some
review on it anyway.
I have not received any further comments during these 2 months, so I thought
the overall design is considered okay - if anything, there might be minor
code comments/issues but these can easily be improved/fixed in the 5 weeks
remaining to the soft code freeze for 9.1.
The latest email in that thread (assuming this one is what you're referring
to) is:
https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/f67fcc88-aaf6-43f7-9287-90cbd7495...@nvidia.com/#t
I didn't hear anything from Avihai yet, neither did I think we reached an
complete agreement on the whole design.
So what then is necessary to reach a "complete agreement on the whole design"?
Do you think organizing a brainstorming session somewhere (Zoom, etc.) would
help with that?
Although there is always a risk that such "10,000 foot" design turns out
to have significantly worse performance than this one - how a (sensible)
design will perform in real world testing is rather hard to predict in
advance.
The current design took a while to make sure we don't leave any possible
performance (downtime improvement) by mistake.
If anything, I think that the VM live phase (non-downtime) transfers
functionality should be deferred until 9.2 because:
* It wasn't a part of the RFC so even if implemented today would get much
less testing overall,
IMO it really depends on what was proposed. Anyone who send patches should
definitely test whatever the patchset provides. If that patchset includes
the iteration changes then that needs to be tested by the submitter.
I agree that anything proposed needs to be well tested before being
submitted.
* It's orthogonal to the switchover time device state transfer functionality
introduced by this patch set and could be added on top of that without
changing the wire protocol for switchover time device state transfers,
AFAICT it will affect the wire protocol? If the dest QEMU contains your
patcheset to be the old version of QEMU, then the threads will only be
created at the switchover phase, and it won't be ready to take whatever
data sent from a new QEMU which may allow migrating VFIO iteration data,
who may expect these VFIO data to be passed over via multifd channels
even before the switchover.
It can only be compatible at least when the threads are created before
iteration starts on dest side, and I didn't yet check the packet headers
and other stuffs.
I think that can be a sweet spot where maybe you can land this series
sooner, but it also gets ready for anyone who wants to further extend that
to iteration phase easily. Not sure whether it'll be easily feasible by
just moving the thread creations earlier.
If someone is migrating data to an older QEMU version that does not
contain this patch set the source must have "x-migration-multifd-transfer"
VFIO device property set to false (the default value) for wire format
compatibility.
The same will go for VM live phase data - it will need to have some
additional setting which needs to be disabled for the wire format
to be compatible with older QEMU versions that do not understand the
such data transfer over multifd channels.
On the other hand, as I wrote in the cover letter, there's nothing
stopping a QEMU device driver from requiring different handling
(loading, etc.) of VM live phase data from the post-switchover data.
So loading such VM live phase data will need a new handler anyway.
* It doesn't impact the switchover downtime so in this case 9.1 would
already contain all what's necessary to improve it.
Yes it won't, but IMHO that's not an issue.
Since Fabiano is going on a short break soon, I think I'll be the only one
review it. I'll try my best, but still I can't guarantee it will be able
to land in 9.1, and this is not the only thing I'll need to do next week..
I appreciated a lot you worked out VFIO on top of multifd, because IMHO
that's really the right direction. However even with that, I don't think
the whole design is yet fully settled, not to mention the details. And that
implies it may miss 9.1.
I appreciate your work and review Peter - it would be nice if we could
at least make some progress on this subject for 9.1.
Thanks,
Thanks,
Maciej
[1]: https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/zh-kf72fe9ov6...@redhat.com/
[2]: https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/zh_6w8u3h4fmg...@redhat.com/
[3]: https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/zid4alsre6qub...@redhat.com/
[4]: https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/zijcszvsekao8...@redhat.com/
[5]: https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/zijfu_qrohvvw...@redhat.com/
[6]:
https://lore.kernel.org/qemu-devel/7e855ccb-d5af-490f-94ab-61141fa30...@nvidia.com/
