That new chart is for a single block, but we would want the M100 or M110
which is 12 of those S30 blocks connected together (580 AH @ 20 hr
rate). I haven't tried them, but I penciled out the ROI and at 3000
cycles they stand up well against other lead acid batteries. 40 v is
low, but I believe most inverters can be set to LVD at 40.
Magnum for instance can go as low as 36 v on a 48 v nom. setup.
I agree with Dan that the minimum temp is a problem for many remote
applications.
R.Ray Walters
CTO, Solarray, Inc
Nabcep Certified PV Installer,
Licensed Master Electrician
Solar Design Engineer
303 505-8760
On 1/29/2016 11:52 AM, Dan Fink wrote:
I second Larry's concerns about Aquion's SOC/voltage curves and
tripping LVD at only 40% DOD with standard PV equipment, tied in with
not being able to handle high discharge C-rates and surge loads. I did
some math on running a typical off-grid home with a well pump on
Aquions, and it wasn't pretty, but I may not have done the math right.
Very interested to hear personal experience on off-grid homes with
these batteries.
I was starting to envision applications for remote MET tower,
repeater tower etc applications with low discharge C-rates and high
charging C-rates, and then saw Aquions lowest operation temperature of
-5C, 23 F. That's considered a "heat wave" during certain times of
year in many areas, including here in sunny Colorado. In these
applications the batteries are NOT in a heated room, instead an
outdoor enclosure at the base of a tower.
AGMs are serving us here just fine on these sorts of esoteric
installations, and they have no problem with -29C and lower when kept
at high SOC. And, cheap, easy to replace, and giving us many years of
life. The ROI math on the Aquions compared to AGM is not adding up for
me on these applications.
My only experience with Aquion was their class at the NABCEP
conference last year.
Any ground truth experience and stories on Aquions and other similar
technologies appreciated here also.
Best regards;
Dan Fink
Adjunct Professor, Ecotech Institute
IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
~ PV Installation Professional
~ Small Wind Installer
Executive Director, Buckville Energy
NABCEP Accredited Continuing Education Providers™
970.672.4342 <tel:970.672.4342>
On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 7:55 AM, Starlight Solar Power Systems
<la...@starlightsolar.com <mailto:la...@starlightsolar.com>> wrote:
I too am interested in anyone that has installed these. I had some
concerns back on Nov 10, 2014. Here is a copy/past from that
conversation:
Something does not add up to me. The cell has a voltage discharge
curve way outside that of RE equipment, 1.75 Vpc down to 0.5Vpc. I
can't see how this technology could be scaled to RE applications
without wasting much of the capacity. From what I see, only about
40% could be used before LVD.
And this:
The Aquion battery claims their 2.4kWh, 48 volt stack operates
from 59 to 30 volts. Many inverters have a LBCO of 1.75 Vpc (42
volts). Depending on voltage sag, that means about half of the
capacity of the Aquion battery can't be used. Even if the outback
can operate down to 1.5 Vpc, you are still not able to use the
full capacity of the battery unless your load is less than 800 Watts.
I have reviewed their technical presentation and it looks to me
like the capacity simply can't be used in the off grid
environment. If you can't use it, why do they rate it at 2.4kWh?
BTW, the Voltage vs.Energy chart on the spec sheet does not match
the first chart I posted.
On Jan 29, 2016, at 7:30 AM, Chris Schaefer
<ch...@solarandwindfx.com <mailto:ch...@solarandwindfx.com>> wrote:
To All,
Great insight on the lithium movement. I do am looking for anyone
dealing with the new Aquion batteries. I’ve got a couple of
potential clients that have inquired about them. Saw them at a
NABCEP training session last spring and while the idea is moving I
wasn’t impressed. Perhaps it’s time to start a new thread, “Aquion
batteries”.
Thanks,
Christopher
*From:*RE-wrenches
[mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On Behalf Of
*d...@energysolarnow.com <mailto:d...@energysolarnow.com>
*Sent:* Friday, 29 January, 2016 00:49
*To:* Dan Fink
*Cc:* re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
<mailto:re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org>
*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] LiFePO4; WAS Availability of
Powerwall Batteries
Thanks for sharing your experience with these batteries, Dan.
I have similar SOC issues with an off-grid customer who has the
Aquion Hybrid Ion batteries.
It has difficulty reaching full charge from solar, requiring the
genny to kick on each morning even in the summer.
This is even worse in cold winter weather.
Your explanation of the change in Peukert's exponent above 80% SOC
with NiFe batteries sounds like what is happening here as well.
Do you have any experience with Aquion batteries that you can share?
Thanks
Don Barch
Energy Solar
d...@energysolarnow.com <mailto:d...@energysolarnow.com>
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