I believe that once someone produces a piece of software that is the best in the world, they are more than entitled to earn what the average american programmer earns even if they were born in Russia. My $30/hr. guys are underpaid.
Namesys will eventually produce a windows driver, once we deal with a whole bunch of other tasks before us (like getting into the kernel). We will charge money for that driver. Thanks for your enthusiasm for that driver. Hans Leif W wrote: >> Subject: Re: ReiserFS IFSD for Windows >> From: Hans Reiser <reiser () namesys ! com> >> Date: 2005-05-13 18:14:32 >> Message-ID: 4284EE88.2020309 () namesys ! com >> >>> Mark Piper wrote: >>> >>> This summer, I will be starting a 3.5-month project to create an >>> Installable File System Driver (IFSD) to read ReiserFS under Microsoft >>> Windows, similar to ext2fsd. (The project is a practicum to complete >>> my degree in software engineering from Carnegie Mellon.) >> >> >> I would prefer that you not do it. Namesys believes that people who use >> proprietary operating systems should pay to use reiserfs. > > > I've recently wondered about such functionality, if it existed or if > there were plans to develop. I would be very interested to make use > of that software. Now I see the response and have some strong rebuttals. > > Hans, you say that proprietary users should pay to use ReiserFS. But > I wonder what you mean or if you're sincere. There is no evidence of > any way to "buy" such software on the Namesys website. So in what > manner do people normally "pay" for this functionality? You want > people to pay $25 to ask if it exists, and then what? Tell it's for > sale and charge them again? As far as any of the world knows, an IFSD > does not exist, so you could be telling people that the Namesys team > will write it from scratch at $5k/mo. Then what of subsequent > requests? Resell the code? Or do you erase it and rewrite from > scratch upon the next request? :p If you have code and it's for sale, > then you really need to attend a class on basic business and > marketing. Or at the very least put up an itemized price list and > description on a web page, with a means of contact. Hopefully it'd be > as simple to use as some shopping cart solution. :p > > I've talked to some actual Russians (where the website states Namesys > custom/contract coders are located), and they survive on much less > than $500/month, perhaps $300/month. So where do you get off charging > ten times that? Only about 1 month's worth of work to survive a > year. I only wish I could find a job that paid so well. Even in the > US, I wish I could find a job to pay $5k/month. Most here manage to > survive on less than half of that. There is great competition for > such well paying jobs. > > But anyways, I digress. So I wonder, perhaps you mean that > proprietary users must "pay" in a metaphorical sense. Pay for their > decision to use proprietary software. The cost is interoperability. > So, you eschew the tenets of proprietary software by adopting the same > closed source mentality to prevent interoperability. Interesting > contradiction in your flawed logic. I suppose you believe anyone who > ever paid for anything that you don't have should pay you money, just > because you hold a grudge about the use of money in society which from > time to time excludes some people from some items, experiences, > benefits, and so on. > > In laymen's terms (and analogy), you don't want to share your ball > with anyone else who bought a ball so you'll act like a child and go > take it home and pout over it and tell yourself what a great ball > player you are, in the imaginary games you'd play in your head while > everyone else is out in the real world getting dirty and interacting > with each other. > > And what do you know of my attitudes from proprietary or free > software, or my economic or educational background? I grew up very > poor, with no guidance in computers. I didn't discover my computer > interest until college, which I had entered early and for free, due > solely to early merits of my scholastic performance. My interest in > computers took over, but I didn't have money to finish my education, > let alone build a computer. So I worked and saved, bought some text > books, studied on my own with no computer, and finally built my own. > What I've learned of source code, what use I've made of hardware over > the years has largely if not solely been inspired and influenced by > free software projects such as ReiserFS. Whenever I have worked on > any job involving software, I have requested that if it would be > generally useful, that it be released under a free license (I prefer > GNU's GPL or in some cases LGPL). I've donated what meager amounts of > money I can to some projects here and there. > > It's not always by my choice that I end up in Windows, but when I do, > I like to have access to at least some similar functionality. > > Apache. > Perl. > PHP. > MySQL. > Gaim. > GIMP. > GTK+. > wxWidgets. > Python. > MinGW/MSYS (collections of GNU tools). > Mozilla. > > The list goes on... > > Imagine where any of these software packages would be if they had not > opted for interoperability and compatibility. They have inspired me > to think of interoperability. If I need to work to live, then I need > to work when I can, and as such I may not be in a position to dictate > to the company or the industry that Linux or FreeBSD must be used. Or > else what? Or else I am requested to resign or fired outright, or > merely I am just never hired, and I starve and die in the street. The > end? I'd like it not to be. So I must survive another day. I do > favor those companies that predominantly use Linux or FreeBSD, and in > the past I have taken a serious pay cut to work at such a company (I > made $14k in a YEAR, no health or dental, no 401k). Simply because in > comparison to the myriad inexplicable and truly idiotic Windows errors > that can't be fixed or worked around, FreeBSD and Linux are a sheer > pleasure to work with. Blissful by comparison. I'd rather make less > money and enjoy what I do, and the tools I work with are an important > factor. As such, portable programs make my life easier no matter > where I happen to be at any given moment. > > In either work or in personal environment, I find it helpful to have > two or more systems, each with different OSes and versions, especially > if doing cross-platform development or testing for free software > projects or not. All in the interest of interoperability. But I may > not always have the resources available to run multiple machines, > hence the need for a dual, tri, quad, or N-boot computer. It is in > this case when interoperability is a key factor for filesystems. And > it grieves me that Namesys has in it's folly taken such a narrow > minded view of the software world in this modern day. I start to > wonder if that prejudiced mentality permeates other aspects of life, > such as race, religion, politics, language, cultures and geographical > locations. I certainly hope not. > > The first software company I worked for was doing a lot of web based > stuff. That is what really grounded my appreciation for software that > can talk to each other. So, while my co-workers were concerned only > with IE4 or IE5, I was also interested in Netscape and Mozilla being > able to view a page, and even Lynx at least able to view the > information. When I was at home with a Linux-only system, I also > became much more aware of the effects of being summarily excluded by > website makers who were only interested in proprietary code and felt > no need to provide Mozilla support. It forces you to have a much more > open mind and discipline towards software design. > > Alone, I am neither the quickest, most learned nor most skilled > programmer. Also, I am not "made of money", as they say, so can not > underwrite the full costs of development of software such as a Windows > IFSD. Yet, here you have someone in society, who is possessed of > enough skill and money to be in a position to write such software, who > is freely offering to undertake the project, who has a vital stake in > it's completion and therefore likely committed to follow through, with > the benefit to them being a degree and a good career builder, and the > benefit to everyone else being interoperability. This is what I > always found to be in the spirit of free software. You made free > software such that others could learn from and extend it, to make life > better for everyone else. Yet you shoot it down. The payoff to you > would be people buying the software. That in itself indicates a > conflict of interest. > > The motives I question. The logic I question. The ethics I question. > > > Leif > > >> I can suggest quite a few other tasks that would make a more impressive >> practicum (copy on write links, various other new and needed plugins). >> >>> >>> I have three questions: >>> >>> * Is anyone out there interested in using the tool as it is developed? >>> >>> * Is anyone out there interested in mentoring the development of the >>> tool? (This basically consists of answering specific technical >>> questions when they arise.) >>> >>> * Other than compliance to the GPL, are there any other licensing >>> factors I should be aware of? >>> >>> For anyone interested, my initial plan is to port the read-only >>> ReiserFS 3 code from the GRUB bootloader, and turn it into an IFSD >>> using the same techniques as in ext2fsd -- although I'd love to hear >>> other ideas, and opinions of whether the project might be feasible >>> with ReiserFS 4. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Mark Piper >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > > >
