I was dumped from your e-mail list. Please resubscribe me. Thanks. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> S-Trains list sponsor: http://www.americanflyertrains.com > All the Flyer you desire...books and accessories too! > > To UNSUBSCRIBE from this list send a note to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > There are 17 messages in this issue. > > Topics in this digest: > > 1. RE: club insurance > From: "Doug Peck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 2. Re: Digest Number 1714 > From: Nick and Becky Colleran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 3. Re: Digest Number 1714 > From: Nick and Becky Colleran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 4. Re: club insurance > From: "David Dewey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 5. Re: Digest Number 1714 > From: "David <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 6. bolsters > From: "Thomas Stoltz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 7. Converting with SHS trucks.... > From: "Rick Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 8. Website > From: "Gregg Mummert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 9. 612 station w/crane > From: Don Abrams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 10. Mail Post & Track Trip built from Erector parts > From: "Tim Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 11. Any U.P. Passenger expertise? > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 12. Re: Club Insurance > From: "John Gibson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 13. Re: 612 station w/crane > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 14. Reminder - Sunday Chat > From: S-Trains > 15. Re: Re: Club Insurance > From: "robert allen conner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 16. Chris & Beth Burger - "S" Ambassadors Par Excellence > From: "Randall L. Griggs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > 17. (no subject) > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 10:00:52 -0500 > From: "Doug Peck" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: RE: club insurance > > STEVE--- > I think most clubs come around to this issue, once they start displaying and > operating a layout at public shows. Our club----the Bristol S-Gaugers---- > operated for years without insurance, but we were forced into it when we > began sponsoring our own public show. The school facility that we used > required us to carry a $1 million policy. We ended up purcasing a policy > which covered us at up to four public locations (shows) per year. We have > since changed to a different policy which places no limit on how many times > we display and operate. I THINK our cost for this policy is around $1000 per > year. > I found Don's response very interesting, becauase we have had "discussions" > (read that, "squabbles") at club meetings, even within the past year, about > the need for us to maintain this policy now that we no longer sponsor our > own show. Not to everyone's satisfaction, but we ultimately voted to > maintain it, just because of the "far-fetched" examples which Steve notes. > Arguments were made at our meetings that because the club is incorporated, > members won't get sued....only the club (which has few assets). Others > argued (supported by a legal opinion) that incorporation does not prevent > lawsuits to members. It may protect the members from ultimately being held > financially liable, BUT all can still get sued, and it will cost you $$$$ to > defend yourself in court. With a proper liability policy for the club, the > insurance company will cover the cost of that defense....not the > individuals! That's an important consideration. > In my mind, and most of our membership agreed, it is a well-spent $1000 per > year. > The issue of incorporation is a related one. We hired a lawyer to do all our > paperwork related to club incorporation. I don't recall the cost, but it > wasn't huge, and it was a one-time cost. > > Good luck with your own deliberations! > > Doug Peck > Port Lines Hobby Supply > 6 Storeybrooke Drive > Newburyport, MA 01950-3408 > Shop Hours - Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays: 2-5 PM (EST), and 7-9 PM. > Saturdays: 2-5 PM. > 978-465-8798 > 1-888-708-0782 (Toll-free; Orders only, please.) > Website: www.portlines.com > E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > VISA--MASTERCARD--DISCOVER--AMEX--PAYPAL Accepted. > > ***********ORIGINAL MESSAGES************* > <<< Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 13:22:02 -0500 > From: Steve Blancard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Club insurance ? > > Guys, > > My club, the Washington & Old Dominion division of the Atlantic Coast S > Gaugers has recently been discussing the need for club liability > insurance. This would be to protect us against lawsuits in case someone > were to be injured by our modular layout set up at a show. For example, > if while demonstrating the rocket launcher car, a kid gets hit in the > eye by the rocket. Or if while kids were to be shocked by a shorted > operating button, or if a kid were to fall off a step the club built to > facilitate viewing. These examples may seem far-fetched, but in this > lawsuite crazy society, it is unfortunately a valid concern. > > Our club has been discussing whether we should incorporate as a > non-profit club in order to obtain liability insurance. None of us > wants to loose everything because of a minor accident and an aggressive > lawyer. > > I would appreciate hearing how other clubs handle this issue. > > Steve Blancard > ****************************************************************** > From: Don Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Club insurance ? > > Dear Steve, > Once this subject is brought up., it is best to disband the club. > Now that you are all aware of the legal liabilities to each individual > who is associated with your club you will have to purchase liability > insurance. When you discover how much this will cost (if you find a > company willing to write a policy) to protect each and every member from > possible law suits, and then try to collect the premiums from your > members you will realize what a huge problem you now have on your hands. > We lost a member several years (or was it a decade ago) over this very > subject. He had an article about a mid west modular club that was sued > by a train show spectator that somehow was injured during the show. > Actually, the club did not get sued, but each member did. I am not > sure of the outcome, but we ended up losing a member. I hope I may be > wrong about the insurance, and let me know if you foresee a different > outcome. > Don > >>> > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 09:58:11 -0500 > From: Nick and Becky Colleran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Digest Number 1714 > > Don is right. On top of that, having insurance may invite a lawsuit! > Having gone around for years on this issue both on the board and > as president of a national organization I would suggest limiting > liability by lowering the table to child viewing height without the > need for risers and keeping high voltages away from the perimeter > of the layout. Any member worried about personal liability should > get his own policy. Time spent discussing the issues of liability and > non-profit incorporation will destroy a club. > > Nick Colleran > > At 01:26 PM 1/12/2003 +0000, you wrote: > >________________________________________________________________________ > > > >Message: 11 > > Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 15:22:00 -0500 > > From: Don Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Subject: Re: Club insurance ? > > > >Dear Steve, > > Once this subject is brought up., it is best to disband the club. > > Now that you are all aware of the legal liabilities to each individual > >who is associated with your club you will have to purchase liability > >insurance. When you discover how much this will cost (if you find a > >company willing to write a policy) to protect each and every member from > >possible law suits, and then try to collect the premiums from your > >members you will realize what a huge problem you now have on your hands. > > We lost a member several years (or was it a decade ago) over this very > >subject. He had an article about a mid west modular club that was sued > >by a train show spectator that somehow was injured during the show. > > Actually, the club did not get sued, but each member did. I am not > >sure of the outcome, but we ended up losing a member. I hope I may be > >wrong about the insurance, and let me know if you foresee a different > >outcome. > >Don > > > >Steve Blancard wrote: > > > > >Guys, > > > > > >My club, the Washington & Old Dominion division of the Atlantic Coast S > > >Gaugers has recently been discussing the need for club liability > > >insurance. This would be to protect us against lawsuits in case someone > > >were to be injured by our modular layout set up at a show. For example, > > >if while demonstrating the rocket launcher car, a kid gets hit in the > > >eye by the rocket. Or if while kids were to be shocked by a shorted > > >operating button, or if a kid were to fall off a step the club built to > > >facilitate viewing. These examples may seem far-fetched, but in this > > >lawsuite crazy society, it is unfortunately a valid concern. > > > > > >Our club has been discussing whether we should incorporate as a > > >non-profit club in order to obtain liability insurance. None of us > > >wants to loose everything because of a minor accident and an aggressive > > >lawyer. > > > > > >I would appreciate hearing how other clubs handle this issue. > > > > > >Steve Blancard > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 09:46:03 -0500 > From: Nick and Becky Colleran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Digest Number 1714 > > If you are talking about Lionel S Gauge, their 2 car passenger set > was at Chesterfield Hobbies in Midlothian, VA as of yesterday 1/11. > They have a web site with contact info. > > At 01:26 PM 1/12/2003 +0000, you wrote: > >Message: 2 > > Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 16:33:41 -0000 > > From: "jackotrains <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Subject: NYC Two Car Add-On Set > > > >Does anyone know where I can purchased this add-on set. > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 09:25:38 -0800 > From: "David Dewey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: club insurance > > Good points Don, > While it MAY be true that individual members won't get sued, the > Directors, or officers can be held liable, so it is important to get > "directors insurance" which the club insurer can provide, or many homeowners > policy can have a rider added. > S' > David D. > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 17:30:58 -0000 > From: "David <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Digest Number 1714 > > As long as your incorporated, individual members are protected. This > leaves only the question of Dues to cover insurance, and other > expenses. Isn't it nice how the lawyers and jerks of the world have > things so twisted and messed up?? > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Nick and Becky Colleran > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Don is right. On top of that, having insurance may invite a lawsuit! > > Having gone around for years on this issue both on the board and > > as president of a national organization I would suggest limiting > > liability by lowering the table to child viewing height without the > > need for risers and keeping high voltages away from the perimeter > > of the layout. Any member worried about personal liability should > > get his own policy. Time spent discussing the issues of liability > and > > non-profit incorporation will destroy a club. > > > > Nick Colleran > > > > At 01:26 PM 1/12/2003 +0000, you wrote: > > > >_____________________________________________________________________ > ___ > > > > > >Message: 11 > > > Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 15:22:00 -0500 > > > From: Don Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >Subject: Re: Club insurance ? > > > > > >Dear Steve, > > > Once this subject is brought up., it is best to disband the > club. > > > Now that you are all aware of the legal liabilities to each > individual > > >who is associated with your club you will have to purchase > liability > > >insurance. When you discover how much this will cost (if you find > a > > >company willing to write a policy) to protect each and every > member from > > >possible law suits, and then try to collect the premiums from your > > >members you will realize what a huge problem you now have on your > hands. > > > We lost a member several years (or was it a decade ago) over > this very > > >subject. He had an article about a mid west modular club that was > sued > > >by a train show spectator that somehow was injured during the show. > > > Actually, the club did not get sued, but each member did. I am > not > > >sure of the outcome, but we ended up losing a member. I hope I > may be > > >wrong about the insurance, and let me know if you foresee a > different > > >outcome. > > >Don > > > > > >Steve Blancard wrote: > > > > > > >Guys, > > > > > > > >My club, the Washington & Old Dominion division of the Atlantic > Coast S > > > >Gaugers has recently been discussing the need for club liability > > > >insurance. This would be to protect us against lawsuits in case > someone > > > >were to be injured by our modular layout set up at a show. For > example, > > > >if while demonstrating the rocket launcher car, a kid gets hit > in the > > > >eye by the rocket. Or if while kids were to be shocked by a > shorted > > > >operating button, or if a kid were to fall off a step the club > built to > > > >facilitate viewing. These examples may seem far-fetched, but in > this > > > >lawsuite crazy society, it is unfortunately a valid concern. > > > > > > > >Our club has been discussing whether we should incorporate as a > > > >non-profit club in order to obtain liability insurance. None of > us > > > >wants to loose everything because of a minor accident and an > aggressive > > > >lawyer. > > > > > > > >I would appreciate hearing how other clubs handle this issue. > > > > > > > >Steve Blancard > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 14:14:37 -0500 > From: "Thomas Stoltz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: bolsters > > Train Gang, > > I would like to convert some Flyer freight cars to SHS trucks. I've been told I'll > need some bolsters to do this. I know some use to be available from Downs or Ace, > but I can't find them on the S sites. > > Does anyone know where to find some bolsters? > > Thanks, > > Tom S in Dresden ME > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 12:24:11 -0800 > From: "Rick Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Converting with SHS trucks.... > > ***(((I would like to convert some Flyer freight cars to SHS trucks. I've been told > I'll need some bolsters to do this.)))*** > > Tom, > I put SHS trucks and couplers on a AF 942 Seaboard boxcar,....using just a few small > washers as spacers. Also used small machine screws and "aircraft" (that what ya call > 'em?) locking nuts. Using the existing hole did make for CLOSE coupling however!! > > Rick. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 16:03:49 -0500 > From: "Gregg Mummert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Website > > A couple weeks ago someone posted pictures of their layout and their album > also contained several other pictures - a Duluth & Missabe steam engine, an > auto carrier w/ '60s vintage Lincolns and T Birds, and more. > > I inadvertently deleted the post. Could the owner please re-post or send it > to me directly. > > Thanks > Gregg Mummert > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 16:41:40 -0500 > From: Don Abrams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: 612 station w/crane > > Hi group, > > I was wondering what vintage this station is with a red painted base? > What would the paint scheme be for the crane, walls & trim, ramp and roof? > Does anyone know where I might find a photo of this variation of a 612? > Thanks in advance, > > Don > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 17:00:48 -0500 > From: "Tim Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Mail Post & Track Trip built from Erector parts > > Hi, > > I recently built a little mail post and track pickup out of Erector parts for my > Flyer layout. Here is a link to see it and description: > http://home.att.net/~timboy/Mail.html > > Tim Brown > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 11 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 17:16:52 EST > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Any U.P. Passenger expertise? > > I am modeling U.P. (AM's 80' streamliner/smoothside observation car) and > would like to know what color lights were on the rear end of the U.P. closed > end observation cars (the round type not the square backs)? > > 1. The top larger light.....did it have a white or red lens? > 2. The side marker lights (blister shape)....where they red or white? > 3. Lastly, what was the purpose of these lights especially if some of them > were WHITE? > > P.S. My experience is more with the eastern rrs where the side markers were > always red(in place of the normal end of train warning lights) and the top > light was white(for lighting up the track for viewing at night?). I already > purchased Tomar Industries S scale drumhead light (City of San Francisco) and > it looks GREAT lighted with a grain of wheat bulb! > > Thanks, > > Jack Riely > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 12 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 22:38:37 -0000 > From: "John Gibson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Club Insurance > > For some reason, my reply did not post to the list - I probably > screwed up :-) > > Here it is . . > > Greetings: > > This e-mail may open a can of worms but I think it is an important > topic and relates to growing S. > > You might want to consider these two points: > > 1. The venues where your club shows its layout may require the club > to have insurance -- even though these shows typically have some > sort of blanket coverage. So you may have no choice in the matter. > > 2. The individual comfort level of your members may require the > purchase of general liability insurance. Some people maybe very > concerned about the risk to the public or other club members. > > By the way, my Garden Railway Club and Historical Foundation both > incorporated and one of the reasons why was to get insurance. > > Here is where I get on my soapbox. The purchase of this insurance > is expensive, too expensive -- the biggest part of the club's > operating budget in many cases. What really frosts me is that I > think the risk is very low - I have never heard of any lawsuit or > claims arising out of injuries sustained by a person at a model > railroad show. > > I have a proposal, not sure how feasible it is, but I would like to > see if the NASG can arrange with an insurance carrier for a "group > buy" to provide general liability insurance S clubs at reasonable > rates. > > Just one person's thoughts . . . . > > John Gibson > Rocklin, CA > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 13 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:02:09 EST > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: 612 station w/crane > > That is the pre-war version. > harwood > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 14 > Date: 13 Jan 2003 00:02:11 -0000 > From: S-Trains > Subject: Reminder - Sunday Chat > > We would like to remind you of this upcoming event. > > Sunday Chat > > Date: Sunday, January 12, 2003 > Time: 8:00PM - 9:30PM EST (GMT-05:00) > > This is our weekly chat session. > http://S-Scale.org/forum/ > Note to AOL8 users, try using Internet Explorer as your browser. > 8 PM EST > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 15 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 19:03:56 -0500 > From: "robert allen conner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Re: Club Insurance > > You know the AMA has some kind of insurance that is very low and covers all > kind of accidents and flying sites, etc....an RC plane can do A lot of > damage if not landed properly!!!!!...Bob > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 5:38 PM > Subject: [S-Trains] Re: Club Insurance > > > For some reason, my reply did not post to the list - I probably > > screwed up :-) > > > > Here it is . . > > > > > > > > Greetings: > > > > This e-mail may open a can of worms but I think it is an important > > topic and relates to growing S. > > > > You might want to consider these two points: > > > > 1. The venues where your club shows its layout may require the club > > to have insurance -- even though these shows typically have some > > sort of blanket coverage. So you may have no choice in the matter. > > > > 2. The individual comfort level of your members may require the > > purchase of general liability insurance. Some people maybe very > > concerned about the risk to the public or other club members. > > > > By the way, my Garden Railway Club and Historical Foundation both > > incorporated and one of the reasons why was to get insurance. > > > > Here is where I get on my soapbox. The purchase of this insurance > > is expensive, too expensive -- the biggest part of the club's > > operating budget in many cases. What really frosts me is that I > > think the risk is very low - I have never heard of any lawsuit or > > claims arising out of injuries sustained by a person at a model > > railroad show. > > > > I have a proposal, not sure how feasible it is, but I would like to > > see if the NASG can arrange with an insurance carrier for a "group > > buy" to provide general liability insurance S clubs at reasonable > > rates. > > > > Just one person's thoughts . . . . > > > > John Gibson > > Rocklin, CA > > > > > > > > > > S-Trains list sponsor: http://www.americanflyertrains.com > > All the Flyer you desire...books and accessories too! > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE from this list send a note to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 16 > Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 19:34:17 -0500 > From: "Randall L. Griggs" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Chris & Beth Burger - "S" Ambassadors Par Excellence > > I just returned home from the second day of the Louisville GATS (Great > American Train Show). Flyer and other "S" items available seemed to be > somewhat less than in previous years, nonetheless, there were items to be > purchased if you really had to have them. There were a number of N, HO, O, > and G layouts of various kinds. My favorite was Chris & Beth Burger's > Winter/Christmas "S" layout. Show attendees voted the first day on their > favorite layout, and the votes were later tallied. Chris and Beth reported > their layout came in 2nd of all the layouts present! The "N" modular > layout that took up a large portion of the display area which was made up > of "N" Track modules from clubs from 6 states took 1st place. Chris & > Beth's 2nd finish was very gratifying, however, AND, also helped cover some > of their show expenses. Congratulations, Chris and Beth! > > Chris and Beth both worked very hard during the 2-day show. They talked to > admirers, and answered hundreds of questions. Beth demonstrated her > expertise at making excellent "S" scale trees from discarded artificial > Christmas tree branches. Chris demonstrated how one could "manufacture" > realistic rock formations from hydrocal, thinned acrylic paints, and rubber > rock molds. In spite of their hard work, one could tell by their cheerful > dedication, they were happy to be here spreading the advantages of "S". > > To Chris and Beth, both, I say - CHEERS, WELL DONE! Next year I'd like to > be able to offer some assistance in helping them set up and take down their > layout, as well as help them answer "S" questions. MAYBE!!?? > > Perhaps you might also want to congratulate Chris and Beth at Chris's > "cbtrainnut..." eMail address! Take a look at: > http://www.trainweb.org/cbtrainnut/ It's hard work and dedication like > this that helps keep "S" alive and well! > > Regards, Randy Griggs - Louisville > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 17 > Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 02:01:06 EST > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: (no subject) > > Randy, > Thanks for the kind words! I'm reading this at 12:30 AM. We rolled in the > door at 11:30. Needless to say, Beth helped me unload, and immediately ran > upstairs for the bedroom. The U-Haul dealer we use is 2 streets away. When I > returned to the house she was sound asleep. > You're more than welcome to join us next year at the show or any show for > that matter. It has been a wild ride this weekend. 14,000 people came through > on Saturday and probably 2/3 to 3/4 of that came through on Sunday according > to Moe Gohegan from GATS. > I will also say that anyone on the list is welcome to join if we happen to > show up in your town. Our next shows are in Columbus Ohio and Dayton. After > that, I think we are going to visit Lance down in the Tennessee hills and > Nashville. Might take my guitar with me too. > Thanks again Randy! > > Chris The Trainnut > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ S-Trains list sponsor: http://www.americanflyertrains.com All the Flyer you desire...books and accessories too! To UNSUBSCRIBE from this list send a note to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
