No. "Wonder Woman" cannot be every bit as thrilling and entertaining
as "Batman Begins." The Wonder Woman movie will underperform at the
box office for the same reason that the Wonder Woman comic book
underperforms at newsstand. Quiet as it is keep, superheros are
homoerotic entertainment (basically good looking guys prancing about
in their underwear). No girls allowed.
Interestingly, Catwoman, the most successful of the girl flicks is
also the one that seems to understand the dynamic. With the bitch
fight between Halle Berry and Sharon Stone, it is the L-Word to the
Queer as Folks world of superhero movies.
~rave!
--- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Because, done right, "Wonder Woman" can be every bit as thrilling
and entertaining as "Batman Begins". You said it yourself, Consuela-
the filmmaker has to take the material *seriously* from Moment One.
And welcome to the dance, if you're new here!
>
> conseula francis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: But why would
we want to see female superhero movies? Consider "Batman Begins":
there was all this anticipation that the filmmakers were going to
reboot the franchise, tell us a Batman story we hadn't seen before,
give us an actor known for committing to his craft, all with kickass
effects. Of course I want to see that.
>
> Now consider "Catwoman"--the biggest selling point, the thing they
focused on in their advertising, is how hot Halle Berry looks in the
outfit (and a ridiculous outfit at that). That's not worth my time.
>
> Filmmakers don't take female superhero movies seriously. Why should we?
>
> conseula
>
> ravenadal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Female Superhero movies suffer the same fate as black science fiction
> movies (white people don't want to see them and BLACK people don't
> want to see them): men don't want to see them and WOMEN don't want to
> see them.
>
> "Catwoman" is still the top-grossing female superhero movie ($82
> million) and nobody considers that a success.
>
> Elektra: $56 million
>
> Aeon Flux: $52 million
>
> Ultraviolet: $31 million
>
> Female superhero movies - ain't no money in them.
>
> ~(no)rave!
>
> --- In scifinoir2@yahoogroups.com, "Tracey de Morsella (formerly
> Tracey L. Minor)" <tdlists@> wrote:
> >
> > Action Or Angst? What Do We Want In Our Superheroes?
> > COMMENTARY: Can 'Wonder Woman' succeed purely as action hero?
> >
> > By ROBIN BROWNFIELD
> > Source: SyFy Portal
> > Feb-04-2007
> >
> > When Joss Whedon announced almost two years after signing on to
> write
> > and direct a "Wonder Woman" movie that he was no longer attached to
> the
> > project, the air of shock around the Internet was almost palpable.
> >
> > Around the same time, David S. Goyer, who wrote the story and co-
> wrote
> > the screenplay for "Batman Begins," was told his vision for the
> movie
> > "The Flash" was not what Warner Bros. producers wanted, and the
> movie
> > has been shelved for now.
> >
> > The story behind the "Wonder Woman" movie, it seems, is that Warner
> > Bros. has purchased a speculative script from newcomers Matthew
> Jennison
> > and Brent Strickland, and is ready to bring them on board to
> replace Whedon.
> >
> > All this leads to the question, "What do people want out of a
> superhero
> > movie? An escapist action romp or fully fleshed-out characters
> facing
> > the most painful decisions of their lives?"
> >
> > While it is uncertain what Whedon has done with "Wonder Woman," it
> seems
> > Joel Silver and company want an action-oriented story set against
> the
> > backdrop of World War II -- the time period when Wonder Woman
> comics
> > debuted. Whedon's vision places Princess Diana in the present day.
> Based
> > on his previous works ("Buffy the Vampire
> Slayer," "Angel," "Firefly,"
> > "Serenity"), one can safely assume that his Wonder Woman would be a
> > fully fleshed out character, complete with goddess-like strength,
> and
> > human foibles. She would most likely be surrounded by fully
> developed
> > supporting characters, and the story that unwinds would largely
> grow out
> > from and be advanced by the characters themselves.
> >
> > We could also count on sharp, engaging dialogue where every word is
> > measured and infused with meaning.
> >
> > A synopsis of the Jennison/Strickland script has been posted on the
> > Internet. It is filled with highly charged action, it appears to
> move
> > quickly, and is balanced with sharp contrasts between scenes. It
> looks
> > like it could be exciting, but because there is no dialogue, and
> the
> > focus is strictly on the action in the movie, it makes me fear that
> > there will be little in the way of actual character development.
> There
> > also is no indicator as to whether the two can write dialogue well.
> It's
> > possible that they can, but in the end, what I read is the basis
> for a
> > largely formulaic movie with lots of loud sounds, flashy visuals
> and
> > action. I donât see the groundwork laid for creating characters
> people
> > in the audience can identify with.
> >
> > People need to be able to identify with the characters in a movie.
> They
> > have to be able to feel with the characters and understand why it
> is
> > they do what they do. The X-Men and Spider-Man movies have been the
> best
> > of any in the genre. X-Men movies have been analogous to the
> struggles
> > with racism and homophobia. In both X-Men and Spider-Man, people
> can
> > identify with the characters' perpetually feeling like outsiders.
> Each
> > has unique qualities that allow them to do amazing things, and yet,
> > people in general and/or in their immediate surroundings, rarely,
> if
> > ever, recognize and appreciate this.
> >
> > Most real people can identify with this scenario. How many of us
> have
> > proven time and time again that we are unique, intelligent and
> superbly
> > talented people whose accomplishments go largely unnoticed by many
> or
> > most of the people around us? It is the same kind of scenario that
> makes
> > "Buffy" so popular. We now see the same happening with characters
> in the
> > TV show "Heroes."
> >
> > It was Peter Parker's angst that drew me to Spider-Man comics as a
> kid.
> > I often skipped over the action parts of the stories just to catch
> what
> > was happening in Peter's world. I still remember Duo Damsel
> heartbroken
> > because she was in love with Superboy, but knew he was destined to
> end
> > up with someone else. Things like that got to me as a child, and
> they
> > still get to me as an adult.
> >
> > Wonder Woman often struggled with being a powerful woman who was
> rarely
> > appreciated for it in a man's world. Angst is what makes these
> heroes
> > accessible to an audience. Going through the human experience even
> if
> > one is not quite human, or is super-human, endears these characters
> to us.
> >
> > While it's possible to have a hero who doesn't feel like an
> outsider or
> > a freak, how that translates into their personality can be
> problematic.
> > If they are always self-sacrificing, righteous and true, they can
> end up
> > being downright boring. Then again, someone who doesn't suffer
> rarely
> > understands the plight of others who are suffering, and usually
> isn't
> > heroic. Someone like that is likely to come off as arrogant and/or
> > self-obsessed, and uses their power for personal gain. I'm not sure
> I
> > want to know people who are drawn to this kind of "hero." I might
> end up
> > being the next person they get all self-righteous and true on.
> >
> > People simply can't identify with an action figure. An action
> figure may
> > present an amusing visual and aural experience, but so does a
> musical
> > mobile hanging over a crib. Both are forgettable once they're out
> of
> > sight. A fully realized human being makes for much longer-lasting
> > "relationship" between the character and the audience than Action
> > Jackson ever can. How many people talk as passionately -- and for
> years
> > on end -- about Lara Croft as they do about Buffy or River Tam?
> >
> > Then there is the issue of the setting for the movies. Wonder Woman
> has
> > gone through many eras. She hasn't always been stuck in WWII, as
> > Superman hasn't always been stuck in the 1930s. In the early 1970s,
> > Wonder Woman had been revamped to fit the times. Steve Trevor was
> > killed, she lost her powers, traded in her bathing suit for a
> > mini-dress, and learned martial arts from some old guy named I-
> ching.
> > While that probably wasnât the best version of Wonder Woman, it
> kept her
> > in the present.
> >
> > Since then, WW has been reinvented several more times, keeping her
> in
> > the present. All the Superman and Batman movies are in the present
> (or
> > future). Why must Wonder Woman be stuck back in WWII?
> >
> > My favorite DC-based movie last year was "V for Vendetta," which
> while
> > it wasn't a superhero movie, was the kind of movie I prefer to
> shell out
> > money to see. I donât make a whole lot, and I have a lot of kids
> to
> > feed, so I can't often waste money on something that is a purely
> > escapist formula movie. Most of the superhero/graphic novel movies -
>
> > regardless of their origins - are lackluster at best. "Daredevil,"
> > "Electra," "Catwoman," "Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow,"
> and "Sin
> > City" were all substitutes for Sominex.
> >
> > Unfortunately, superhero movie producers have grandiose
> expectations,
> > but usually resort to mediocre stories and big special effects or
> > âartfulâ facades to pass their production off as marketable.
> âSuperman
> > Returns,â while somewhat better than previously mentioned movies,
> still
> > suffered the fate of presenting a formulaic plot with some bad
> casting
> > choices (that was NOT Lois Lane), and uneven acting. Hell, Brandon
> Routh
> > barely got to do anything beyond his Christopher Reeve-as-Clark
> Kent
> > impression. While Bryan Singer, Michael Dougherty and Dan Harris
> tried
> > to infuse some humanity and allusions to Supes being Christ-like
> into
> > the story, the actual plot was simply a rehash of old plots with
> Lex
> > Luthor abusing different pieces of real estate.
> >
> > There are passably good comic book hero movies out there
> ("Hellboy," and
> > even "Fantastic Four" to some extent) that take the action formula
> and
> > make it interesting and entertaining. For far too many, though, the
> > formula starts to become rancid after too long. I had been looking
> > forward to something fresh and different in Joss Whedon's "Wonder
> > Woman." I had hoped it would be the one movie about a female
> superhero
> > that wasn't abysmal. I can still hope for this. Jennison and
> Strickland
> > may turn out to be great writers. Still, Iâm not going to put
> much faith
> > in the judgment of movie studio moguls. They have been wrong many
> times
> > before.
> >
> > Robin Brownfield is a staff writer for SyFy Portal, writing out of
> New
> > Jersey. She can be reached at rbrownfield@
> >
>
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> "There is no reason Good can't triumph over Evil, if only angels
will get organized along the lines of the Mafia." -Kurt Vonnegut, "A
Man Without A Country"
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