Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
On 19 nov, 23:41, jacmoe jac...@mail.dk wrote: To me, a 'larger project' is simply a project with a lot of code. :P By that measure, a lot of truly awfully code constitute large projects. [1] It has less to do with how many users it has/gets. I disagree. You don't hit scalability, caching, concurrent, bottleneck problems on a 'big' app which never has more than a few active users at a time. I think this: http://micropipes.com/blog/2008/04/23/caching-is-easy-expiration-is-hard/ is a perfect example of a problem that simply doesn't exist until you have a bigger app. Large project for me means at least being big enough to truely require numerous dedicated servers (and e.g. a cdn). in traffic, that depends on what the app does. if it's very interactive that could be only a few 10K users. AD [1] http://twitter.com/jperras/status/5846555120 live it -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Well, I don't think, that cakePHP will die just because AMO will leave it. Unfortunatelly they are the bigger project using cake, but they haven't migrated to 1.2 and I think a lot of difficulties they are experiencing is just because of it. AMO development team are not involved with cakePHP development, so I'm not worried about. Iam the lead programmer where I work, and have some projects in cake, one of them is used as a plataform for the other projects. All of my programmers are developing fast and organized. Some of them are treinees, and I was impressed how fast they learned the framework, and only cakePHP can be learned so fast in PHP I think. That's why I'm not worried about AMO, and I'm looking forward for a great future in cakePHP. Thiago Elias Rezende Silva Pablo Picassohttp://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/p/pablo_picasso.html - Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. 2009/11/20 AD7six andydawso...@gmail.com On 19 nov, 23:41, jacmoe jac...@mail.dk wrote: To me, a 'larger project' is simply a project with a lot of code. :P By that measure, a lot of truly awfully code constitute large projects. [1] It has less to do with how many users it has/gets. I disagree. You don't hit scalability, caching, concurrent, bottleneck problems on a 'big' app which never has more than a few active users at a time. I think this: http://micropipes.com/blog/2008/04/23/caching-is-easy-expiration-is-hard/ is a perfect example of a problem that simply doesn't exist until you have a bigger app. Large project for me means at least being big enough to truely require numerous dedicated servers (and e.g. a cdn). in traffic, that depends on what the app does. if it's very interactive that could be only a few 10K users. AD [1] http://twitter.com/jperras/status/5846555120 live it -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comcake-php%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
On Nov 20, 11:33 am, AD7six andydawso...@gmail.com wrote: On 19 nov, 23:41, jacmoe jac...@mail.dk wrote: To me, a 'larger project' is simply a project with a lot of code. :P By that measure, a lot of truly awfully code constitute large projects. [1] I answered in the context of CakePHP. Sure you can write a large application using spaghetti code, but a great framework like CakePHP really helps you build that larger app, due to its MVC architecture. The larger the project, the bigger the benefit. :) I program in C++ mostly, and almost always use object-oriented programming and MVC for more involved projects. It has a slight overhead, but it makes it much more manageable. And your project is a lot easier to refactor / keep alive. It has less to do with how many users it has/gets. I disagree. You don't hit scalability, caching, concurrent, bottleneck problems on a 'big' app which never has more than a few active users at a time. I think you misunderstand what I'm saying: Scalability is a different matter. Sure, a framework built with scalability in mind helps a lot. And, yes: larger apps tends to use more resources. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
What do people consider a 'larger' project?, the addons site of mozilla obviously is one. But what kind of trafic/size does a project need to be considered to be large? I know the answer will be different for each person, but just wondered what most ppl are thinking. On 19 nov, 00:33, kiang kia...@gmail.com wrote: About mambo 5:http://mambo-code.org/gf/project/mambo/scmsvn/?action=browsepath=/ma... I think it will take a long time to release. --- kiang On 11月19日, 上午4時59分, Marcelo Andrade mfandr...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:22 AM, keymaster ad...@optionosophy.com wrote: (..) A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. What's the status for Mambo 5 CMS? -- MARCELO DE F. ANDRADE Belem, PA, Amazonia, Brazil Linux User #221105 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
To me, a 'larger project' is simply a project with a lot of code. :P It has less to do with how many users it has/gets. You can have a really simple application with millions of users. On Nov 19, 8:47 pm, Crazy crazy...@gmail.com wrote: What do people consider a 'larger' project?, the addons site of mozilla obviously is one. But what kind of trafic/size does a project need to be considered to be large? I know the answer will be different for each person, but just wondered what most ppl are thinking. On 19 nov, 00:33, kiang kia...@gmail.com wrote: About mambo 5:http://mambo-code.org/gf/project/mambo/scmsvn/?action=browsepath=/ma... I think it will take a long time to release. --- kiang On 11月19日, 上午4時59分, Marcelo Andrade mfandr...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:22 AM, keymaster ad...@optionosophy.com wrote: (..) A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. What's the status for Mambo 5 CMS? -- MARCELO DE F. ANDRADE Belem, PA, Amazonia, Brazil Linux User #221105 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
A lot of their reasoning is solid but part of it sound like classic 1.1 issues. They note some of it in their google spreadsheet. Reading partly between the lines it sounds like they don't like Simpletest, the cake shell and php4 limitations (=ORM with array- data). With that one has to understand that they compare Cake's roadmap with other frameworks and feel that they will be better served by a framework with, for example, object-based ORM today and not at some point in the future. @jburns, @Okto I have been building stuff with CakePHP for almost 4 years (on and off) and I can still recognize the worry you guys express. Will Cake survive?, Is everyone abandoning the sinking ship? and thoughts like that can easily crop up when you hear things like this. Back in 2006 the question was wether a rails ripoff could survive at all... Cake is still here among numerous competitors more or less inspired by Rails. Just remember... The Mozilla team are not (afaik) the driving force behind CakePHP. They have been big users and probably quite big contributors. They have provided a real-world showcase and test-case for big deployments that have probably helped find optimization bottlenecks and things like that. Also, in relation to the whole li3 thing, the last time CakePHP had a big crisis (core members disagreeing in public in early 2008 I believe) it ended up kickstarting the final push towards 1.2 stable. Mark really started to make himself known as THE driving force behind a lot of the work and improvements and bug fixes sped up. CakePHP is like any open project... some people leave as others join and the fate of the framework is up to you guys, me and anyone who cares to make any contributions they can to it. You can and certainly should consider other frameworks, that is just good sense. But you hopefully chose Cake for a reason and I hope that reason was not that Mozilla used it :) Also, a lot of what you learn now will translate quite well to other frameworks. /Martin On Nov 18, 5:07 am, Okto Silaban o...@silaban.net wrote: Maybe some of you haven't heard about this.. Just FYI, AMO (addons.mozilla.org) now still using cakephp 1.1. But they've planned to migrate to Django. Link :http://micropipes.com/blog/2009/11/17/amo-development-changes-in-2010/ labanux,http://okto.silaban.net -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Really good response - thank you. I like Cake and see myself using it for the long haul. I am aware that you only get out what you put in. I want to contribute but - like a lot of other people (I guess) I am still in the naive wide-eyed looking up to the experts stage, so am taking more than I can give. Honestly I didn't even know (care?) that Mozilla used it. I just don't want to adopt something that becomes far inferior to other frameworks due to starvation or a lack or attention. If that is not the case, then great. It makes you think, a bit, when a large corporation like Mozilla take a strategic decision to move away from what you have adopted. I don't want to regret my choice. It's a good choice now, I want it to stay that way. Don't let me be the guy wandering the streets in flares and long sideburns thinking I am still cool! On Nov 18, 8:09 am, Martin Westin martin.westin...@gmail.com wrote: A lot of their reasoning is solid but part of it sound like classic 1.1 issues. They note some of it in their google spreadsheet. Reading partly between the lines it sounds like they don't like Simpletest, the cake shell and php4 limitations (=ORM with array- data). With that one has to understand that they compare Cake's roadmap with other frameworks and feel that they will be better served by a framework with, for example, object-based ORM today and not at some point in the future. @jburns, @Okto I have been building stuff with CakePHP for almost 4 years (on and off) and I can still recognize the worry you guys express. Will Cake survive?, Is everyone abandoning the sinking ship? and thoughts like that can easily crop up when you hear things like this. Back in 2006 the question was wether a rails ripoff could survive at all... Cake is still here among numerous competitors more or less inspired by Rails. Just remember... The Mozilla team are not (afaik) the driving force behind CakePHP. They have been big users and probably quite big contributors. They have provided a real-world showcase and test-case for big deployments that have probably helped find optimization bottlenecks and things like that. Also, in relation to the whole li3 thing, the last time CakePHP had a big crisis (core members disagreeing in public in early 2008 I believe) it ended up kickstarting the final push towards 1.2 stable. Mark really started to make himself known as THE driving force behind a lot of the work and improvements and bug fixes sped up. CakePHP is like any open project... some people leave as others join and the fate of the framework is up to you guys, me and anyone who cares to make any contributions they can to it. You can and certainly should consider other frameworks, that is just good sense. But you hopefully chose Cake for a reason and I hope that reason was not that Mozilla used it :) Also, a lot of what you learn now will translate quite well to other frameworks. /Martin On Nov 18, 5:07 am, Okto Silaban o...@silaban.net wrote: Maybe some of you haven't heard about this.. Just FYI, AMO (addons.mozilla.org) now still using cakephp 1.1. But they've planned to migrate to Django. Link :http://micropipes.com/blog/2009/11/17/amo-development-changes-in-2010/ labanux,http://okto.silaban.net -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Hey all, Hearing Mozilla's announcement about their intent to move away from CakePHP as the framework for their AMO (addons.mozilla.org) site was unfortunate. For a couple of years now, Mozilla's AMO site has been one of the largest publicly known deployments of CakePHP. I'd like to respond to this announcement both as a core developer (currently co-leading the 2.0 development) as well as an open source software user, and long time CakePHP user. With regard to people having concerns about projects moving away from CakePHP and this having an impact on the frameworks future or suitability for development of private and commercial projects, I don't feel this is an issue. The development undertaken by the volunteers that comprise the CakePHP core development team is unaffected by this move by Mozilla. While mozilla used CakePHP to operate addons.mozilla.org, they were not involved in contributing to the core of CakePHP either through code contributions or financial donations. So at this stage, the only loss to CakePHP as a project is a link on the home page we'll need to remove once they make a change. Our roadmap is set out, and we have a clear plan for the future. We intend to take CakePHP to greater heights, providing as easy an upgrade path as is possible without compromising advancement. We've got two teams working on two major branches, being 1.3 and 2.0 at the moment. Both teams are working closely together to ensure that the 1.3 to 2.0 move is as easy as possible. The motivation in the development team at the moment is high, and we're all excited about what has already been accomplished in the 1.3 branch (http://code.cakephp.org/wiki/1.3/new-features and http://code.cakephp.org/wiki/1.3/migration-guide), as well as the possibilities we've opened up for speed and optimisation through PHP5 only code in CakePHP 2.0. This post is getting long enough already... One last thing I will say is that I feel that Mozilla's concerns, in my opinion, are for the most part resolved in 1.2 and further improvements are made throughout the core in 1.3. They'd certainly benefit from an upgrade to one of the more recent versions. However, it appears as though a decision has been made, and we wish the Mozilla AMO team all the best as they migrate to django. Cheers, Graham Weldon e. gra...@grahamweldon.com w. http://grahamweldon.com On 18/11/2009, at 7:25 PM, jburns wrote: Really good response - thank you. I like Cake and see myself using it for the long haul. I am aware that you only get out what you put in. I want to contribute but - like a lot of other people (I guess) I am still in the naive wide-eyed looking up to the experts stage, so am taking more than I can give. Honestly I didn't even know (care?) that Mozilla used it. I just don't want to adopt something that becomes far inferior to other frameworks due to starvation or a lack or attention. If that is not the case, then great. It makes you think, a bit, when a large corporation like Mozilla take a strategic decision to move away from what you have adopted. I don't want to regret my choice. It's a good choice now, I want it to stay that way. Don't let me be the guy wandering the streets in flares and long sideburns thinking I am still cool! On Nov 18, 8:09 am, Martin Westin martin.westin...@gmail.com wrote: A lot of their reasoning is solid but part of it sound like classic 1.1 issues. They note some of it in their google spreadsheet. Reading partly between the lines it sounds like they don't like Simpletest, the cake shell and php4 limitations (=ORM with array- data). With that one has to understand that they compare Cake's roadmap with other frameworks and feel that they will be better served by a framework with, for example, object-based ORM today and not at some point in the future. @jburns, @Okto I have been building stuff with CakePHP for almost 4 years (on and off) and I can still recognize the worry you guys express. Will Cake survive?, Is everyone abandoning the sinking ship? and thoughts like that can easily crop up when you hear things like this. Back in 2006 the question was wether a rails ripoff could survive at all... Cake is still here among numerous competitors more or less inspired by Rails. Just remember... The Mozilla team are not (afaik) the driving force behind CakePHP. They have been big users and probably quite big contributors. They have provided a real-world showcase and test-case for big deployments that have probably helped find optimization bottlenecks and things like that. Also, in relation to the whole li3 thing, the last time CakePHP had a big crisis (core members disagreeing in public in early 2008 I believe) it ended up kickstarting the final push towards 1.2 stable. Mark really started to make himself known as THE driving force behind a lot of the work and improvements and bug fixes sped up. CakePHP is like any open project... some people
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Cake 1.1 underpinned addons.mozilla.org for years. Cake 1.2 is much more powerful than 1.1, and cake 1.3/2.0 is even more so. In php land, CakePHP is by far the most enterprise ready framework. The cakephp community is by far the largest. I'm sure large apps have left the other frameworks too, for what they perceived to be a better framework at the time. It's all a preference thing. The world is fluid. People move around. There is no one best solution for all apps, and all time and all circumstances. A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. Who wants to bet? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Django ? That's not PHP, is it ? :) I like CakePHP because it's PHP, and - as Keymaster said - it's the most enterprise ready framework. (I am not counting Zen Framework here, because it's a collection of components, rather than a coherent framework). Why should CakePHP die? It can't. :) On Nov 18, 3:22 pm, keymaster ad...@optionosophy.com wrote: Cake 1.1 underpinned addons.mozilla.org for years. Cake 1.2 is much more powerful than 1.1, and cake 1.3/2.0 is even more so. In php land, CakePHP is by far the most enterprise ready framework. The cakephp community is by far the largest. I'm sure large apps have left the other frameworks too, for what they perceived to be a better framework at the time. It's all a preference thing. The world is fluid. People move around. There is no one best solution for all apps, and all time and all circumstances. A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. Who wants to bet? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=en.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:22 AM, keymaster ad...@optionosophy.com wrote: (..) A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. What's the status for Mambo 5 CMS? -- MARCELO DE F. ANDRADE Belem, PA, Amazonia, Brazil Linux User #221105 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=en.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 5:46 PM, jacmoe jac...@mail.dk wrote: Django ? That's not PHP, is it ? :) I like CakePHP because it's PHP, and - as Keymaster said - it's the most enterprise ready framework. (I am not counting Zen Framework here, because it's a collection of components, rather than a coherent framework). Why should CakePHP die? It can't. :) jacmoe, I agree entirely with you in all things you said! :-) -- MARCELO DE F. ANDRADE Belem, PA, Amazonia, Brazil Linux User #221105 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=en.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
About mambo 5: http://mambo-code.org/gf/project/mambo/scmsvn/?action=browsepath=/mambo/branches/5.0/ I think it will take a long time to release. --- kiang On 11月19日, 上午4時59分, Marcelo Andrade mfandr...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 11:22 AM, keymaster ad...@optionosophy.com wrote: (..) A new flagship app for cakePHP will soon appear (no doubt leaving some other framework for us) to replace addons.mozilla.org as cakePHP's claim to fame. What's the status for Mambo 5 CMS? -- MARCELO DE F. ANDRADE Belem, PA, Amazonia, Brazil Linux User #221105 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Maybe some of you haven't heard about this.. Just FYI, AMO (addons.mozilla.org) now still using cakephp 1.1. But they've planned to migrate to Django. Link : http://micropipes.com/blog/2009/11/17/amo-development-changes-in-2010/ labanux, http://okto.silaban.net -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
Am I the only one who feels as if they have just joined a party that everyone else is leaving? I've invested a lot of learning time adopting CakePHP for a pretty big project. It's not been easy and the project is too pregnant to change now. I hoped this would be a growing and dynamic development area, but right now I am not so sure. On Nov 18, 4:07 am, Okto Silaban o...@silaban.net wrote: Maybe some of you haven't heard about this.. Just FYI, AMO (addons.mozilla.org) now still using cakephp 1.1. But they've planned to migrate to Django. Link :http://micropipes.com/blog/2009/11/17/amo-development-changes-in-2010/ labanux,http://okto.silaban.net -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
I'm with you.. :( We're about to launch our web now.. But everyday I'm becoming more curious about the future of CakePHP.. labanux, http://okto.silaban.net On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 1:17 PM, jburns jeremybu...@me.com wrote: Am I the only one who feels as if they have just joined a party that everyone else is leaving? I've invested a lot of learning time adopting CakePHP for a pretty big project. It's not been easy and the project is too pregnant to change now. I hoped this would be a growing and dynamic development area, but right now I am not so sure. On Nov 18, 4:07 am, Okto Silaban o...@silaban.net wrote: Maybe some of you haven't heard about this.. Just FYI, AMO (addons.mozilla.org) now still using cakephp 1.1. But they've planned to migrate to Django. Link :http://micropipes.com/blog/2009/11/17/amo-development-changes-in-2010/ labanux,http://okto.silaban.net -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
Re: addons.mozilla.org soon will leave CakePHP..
I use Cake alot in more or less big projects and personally I don't see a problem with the future of CakePHP. The only thing that will happen in case the Cake development is stopped is that there will be no new releases / features. Well that's a pitty, but if you can live with the current release there is actually no need for new features otherwise your decision to use Cake was the wrong one. :-) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups CakePHP group. To post to this group, send email to cake-...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to cake-php+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php?hl=.
