[CTRL] Will you become blind if you read alternative views?
Title: Message -Caveat Lector- One of the ways you can see if you are a victim of New Age manipulation is look to see if you are backing off from a discussion because your opponent is overly emotional. As a liberal, see if you can read this piece and respond to it on a logical level. As a side note, here in Chicago the Leather people were joining together for a happening. A columnist from a major newspaper wrote about accepting the Leather group without ever describing what Leather was all about. How can people come to their own conclusions about what they will or not accept in their community if they are not allowed to see what it is they are being asked to accept? To my mind if you want to accept the homosexual agenda, you need to be informed about the size of that community and what is happening there. It's not a matter of right vs left on this topic. It's a matter of being fully informed, which is not what is happening nowl www.gendercentral.com 6/22/2003Reply to Jonah Goldberg’s “Gays Gain Victory”By Rabbi David Eidensohn The Washington Times, in a June 20, 2003 commentary, presents Jonah Goldberg’s “Time to Face Facts: Gays Gain Victory.” Mr. Goldberg describes the great gains of gays, and concludes they have won the cultural battle with biblical and family people. He concludes, “The challenge for social conservatives, it seems to me, is to make the best of what they consider a bad situation. But that would require making some painful capitulations – intellectual, moral, philosophical and financial.” Assuming the gays have won, something we can debate, what “intellectual, moral, philosophical and financial capitulations” do I have to make? When Hitler and Stalin won, did I intellectually, morally, philosophically and financially capitulate? Winning may impress Darwin and Haeckel, but it should not impress moral people. If the gays are wrong morally and they are winning, we must redouble our efforts to defeat them, not join them. Mr. Goldberg begins and concludes his column by saying nobody, even the gays, admits or faces up to the gay victory. Thus, Mr. Goldberg declares gays have won even when they do not claim this. This is very strange, if it were true. Why, if the gays won, are they silent about it? Do they know something Mr. Goldberg does not? Mr. Goldberg lists many achievements of gays in the movies and general culture. He shows how the Justice Department headed by someone who is Religious Right could not stop a gay program on government property. True, these are gains. The gays are no longer in the closet. This is true. However, the second phase of the battle is now beginning. The gays want biblical and family people, those who denigrate homosexuality, to be in the closet. One prominent therapist declared to the New York Times his wish for those who oppose the gay lobby to be quarantined and dismissed from employ.There is a ferocious battle going on over the issue of conversion therapy. May a therapist treat a homosexual if both the homosexual and the therapist feel this is the best thing for the homosexual? The gays say that no homosexual should never change, as this is “internalized homophobia.” The gays also contend that no conversion therapy works, a position actually spoken by Clinton’s Surgeon General. The Surgeon General’s remarks came months after Dr. Joseph Spitzer of Columbia presented a study that conversion therapy does work. This is war, and the gays have not won it. The gays hold on mental therapists of the American Psychological and Psychiatric Association is loosening. Dr. Epstein, editor of the official magazine of the American Psychological Association’s, allowed advertisements in the magazine from NARTH. NARTH is a group of conservative therapists who believe in conversion therapy for homosexuals. The gay lobby threatened Dr. Epstein. This time, however, the threats didn’t work, but backfired. A past president of a major therapists organization that backed the gay line said in a speech: “Our organization has become so g-damned politically correct it stifles research.” Dr. Joseph Spitzer, once the major friend of the gays in the American Psychiatric Association, has now done battle with the gays by declaring that homosexuals can become heterosexuals. There are ferocious wars going on in the American Psychiatric Association over gay demands not to consider pedophilia, gender-identity disorder, and sexual sadism diseases. Imagine, a man cannot control his impulses to molest children. He comes to a therapist who tells him, “What you are doing is not sick, so I won’t treat you.” The gays may lose this fight. They are surely not winning it. A major goal of gays, one far removed from them, is to declare gay unions as marriage. Congress has passed a law stating that marriage is only one man and one woman
[CTRL] priest suit allowed, child drug guinea pigs, sex predator arrested again
-Caveat Lector- scroll for news articles Priest abuse suit is allowed by David Crumm and Patricia Montemurri Knight Ridder Newspapers 6/19/03 (KRT) - In a ruling that could open the floodgates to lawsuits by countless people alleging sexual abuse by Catholic priests, a Wayne County, Mich., judge accepted Thursday an innovative legal argument allowing a decades-old claim to get around Michigan's statute of limitation." http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/news/6127438.htm Search for children in care home who became guinea pigs for drug Industry Ian Johnston And Nicola Byrne [EMAIL PROTECTED] "The young residents of the children's home were herded into the assembly hall and told they were getting an injection. They were given no explanation, only sweets to take their minds off the fear. The Irish children - orphaned or illegitimate - were among hundreds used as guinea pigs in trials of new vaccinations by drug firm Wellcome, now a part of international conglomerate GlaxoSmithKline. Many of those unwillingly experimented upon believe their long-term health was damaged as a result of the researchSo far three drug trials involving 211 children have been positively identified by the Laffoy Commission, but it is thought more tests could have been carried out. Some 2,000 former pupils of the so-called `industrial schools' have come forward to say they fear they may have been experimented upon. The tests, carried out between 1960 and 1973, involved vaccines for conditions such as rubella, whooping cough, diphtheria, tetanus and polio." http://www.news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=684512003 from mparent Man Whose Case Led to High Court Ruling on Confinement of Sexual Predators Arrested Again 6/20/03 Kansas City, Mo. (AP) - "A convicted sex offender whose case led to a U.S. Supreme Court ruling setting guidelines on keeping sexual predators locked up after their sentences end has been charged with a rape committed after his release. Michael T. Crane, 41, was arrested Wednesday and charged with attacking a woman in her car...Earlier, he got probation in 1987 for attempted forcible rape and two counts of sex abuse in Missouri. In the 1994 case, he was sentenced to 35 years to life on his convictions for kidnapping, attempted rape and attempted sodomy. But the convictions were overturned on technical grounds by the Kansas Supreme Court in 1996, and the following year Crane pleaded guilty to a reduced charge of aggravated sexual battery. He was sentenced to three to 10 years in prison. As he was approaching release, the state sought to have him kept in confinement, and a jury determined him to be a violent sexual predator. The Kansas Supreme Court overturned that finding, but Crane remained in confinement while the state appealed to the U.S. Supreme Court. Last year, the court ruled in a 7-2 decision that states must prove that convicted sex offenders can't control themselves if they are to be confined after they finish their prison terms." http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGANVRGH6HD.html www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] Media Silent On Clark's 9/11 Comments
-Caveat Lector- http://www.fair.org/press-releases/clark-iraq.html MEDIA ADVISORY: Media Silent on Clark's 9/11 Comments: Gen. says White House pushed Saddam link without evidence June 20, 2003 Sunday morning talk shows like ABC's This Week or Fox News Sunday often make news for days afterward. Since prominent government officials dominate the guest lists of the programs, it is not unusual for the Monday editions of major newspapers to report on interviews done by the Sunday chat shows. But the June 15 edition of NBC's Meet the Press was unusual for the buzz that it didn't generate. Former General Wesley Clark told anchor Tim Russert that Bush administration officials had engaged in a campaign to implicate Saddam Hussein in the September 11 attacks-- starting that very day. Clark said that he'd been called on September 11 and urged to link Baghdad to the terror attacks, but declined to do so because of a lack of evidence. Here is a transcript of the exchange: CLARK: "There was a concerted effort during the fall of 2001, starting immediately after 9/11, to pin 9/11 and the terrorism problem on Saddam Hussein." RUSSERT: "By who? Who did that?" CLARK: "Well, it came from the White House, it came from people around the White House. It came from all over. I got a call on 9/11. I was on CNN, and I got a call at my home saying, 'You got to say this is connected. This is state-sponsored terrorism. This has to be connected to Saddam Hussein.' I said, 'But--I'm willing to say it, but what's your evidence?' And I never got any evidence." Clark's assertion corroborates a little-noted CBS Evening News story that aired on September 4, 2002. As correspondent David Martin reported: "Barely five hours after American Airlines Flight 77 plowed into the Pentagon, the secretary of defense was telling his aides to start thinking about striking Iraq, even though there was no evidence linking Saddam Hussein to the attacks." According to CBS, a Pentagon aide's notes from that day quote Rumsfeld asking for the "best info fast" to "judge whether good enough to hit SH at the same time, not only UBL." (The initials SH and UBL stand for Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden.) The notes then quote Rumsfeld as demanding, ominously, that the administration's response "go massive...sweep it all up, things related and not." Despite its implications, Martin's report was greeted largely with silence when it aired. Now, nine months later, media are covering damaging revelations about the Bush administration's intelligence on Iraq, yet still seem strangely reluctant to pursue stories suggesting that the flawed intelligence-- and therefore the war-- may have been a result of deliberate deception, rather than incompetence. The public deserves a fuller accounting of this story. www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
[CTRL] More Disinfo ....
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 6/22/03 10:31:26 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Kate Dixon writes: About 2 or 3 weeks before he died, Quig was banned by Kris Milligan, moderator, of the CIA-Drugs list (a list originated by Michael Ruppert who now has no time for it) because Quig and Duncan Rhoades, publisher of Nexus magazine were flaming each other about "junk" science. Quig didn't believe in matters such as chemtrails, and was a skeptic regarding various scientific matters. Quig ironically believed in nuclear power plants as a good energy source. When Quiq was banned he then posted significantly on Yahoo's Bush Coup list, which list is dominated almost exclusively by Stew Webb. When Quig was banned by Milligan, (who is now a publisher of conspiracy type books in an outfit known as Daisy? which recently published Sherman Skolnick), Webb then began to flood the CIA drugs list with his postings, which were mostly about an alleged June 21, 2003, Satan festival in Colorado, in which people affiliated with Bush were to kill someone. Joining Webb in this was Barbara Hartwell, who says she was a CIA-mind controlled type involved with high level intelligence types. Hartwell and Webb attacked Ted Gunderson and his clique in the past few weeks. Jackie McGauley one of the mothers who sought prosecutions in the L.A. McMartin pre-school child abuse case (a case also allegedly involved in Satanism, a theory Ted Gunderson heavily promoted) also began posting on CIA-Drugs, with an anti-Gunderson message in the past three weeks since Quig was banned. Today I received an forwarded email from Stew Webb which memorializes his friend Quig and promises an investigation of the circumstances of his death. well, now, where to begin? Terrible reportage. 1. Quiq wasn't banned he was put on restriction, most of his posts were passed on. It wasn't two or three weeks ago it was on April 11, 2003. He was back on in about ten days or so. Here is the notice: 4/11/2003 8:36 am Well, Oh boy, the hammer of the moderator comes down. Brian Quig "Val Smith" "the hatefulnerd" Duncan Roads Have all been put on restrictive post. All of theor posts for a period of time will have to be seen by me before they may proceed to the list. As to who is right or wrong, I dunna know or care. restrictions will be lifted with decent postings. Om K = 2. Mike Ruppert didn't start the cia-drugs list. I did after an earlier one on the subject had expired. Dan Hopsicker created a list after mine and then later the lists merged. 3. Yes, I am a publisher. The compan's name is TrineDay. I am not Sherman Skolnick's publisher, not that I wouldn't. 4. Webb didn't begin too "flood" the board untill about week or so ago. As is his norm, when the soltices come around he tends to post alot about sacrifice and such. There was NO realtionship between Brian's restriction. There has much back and forth between various groups of poster each accusing the other of all sorts of things. Different posters wish me to "ban" each other and when I do not I get accused of all sorts of things. And when I do I get accused of all sorts of things. = 5. Brian's death is being used shamelessly. MHO Om K ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om 2">
[CTRL] {attack} JANUARY is WHITE HISTORY MONTH... (fwd)
-Caveat Lector-
"I pledge Allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to
the REPUBLIC for which it stands, one Nation under God,indivisible,with
liberty and justice for all."
visit my web site at
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html
-- Forwarded message --
Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 15:38:29 EDT
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: undisclosed-recipients: ;
Subject: {attack} JANUARY is WHITE HISTORY MONTH...
IF YOU'RE RECEIVING TOO MUCH MAIL,
Send email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
YOU CAN ALSO READ IT ON THE WEB.
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Rich Martin
Moderator
\/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/ \/
Actually, this is something I've wanted to pursue for a long time...after
all, what's good for the goose is good for the gander, right? Why is is
automatically assumed to be "racism" to suggest something like this?
Click on the link at the bottom for more info.
===
WHITE HISTORY MONTH CAMPAIGN
**
JANUARY is WHITE HISTORY MONTH
HELP SPREAD THE WORD
**
Supporters of The above proposition are invited to http://capwiz.com/yo-demo/home/";>contact their LOCAL, STATE
and FEDERAL representatives and ask them to sponsor the appropriate
legislation.
The Objective is to have as many people as possible http://capwiz.com/yo-demo/home/";>contact as many
politicians as possible all over THE UNITED STATES, so the issue can not be ignored or
white washed.
It's a matter of political principle, The Blacks have a History Month, The
Hispanics have a Heritage Month and The Asians have an Awareness month. All
things being equal and legal, we should have a History month of our own.
Thank you for your support
Don Hood
http://www.webspawner.com/users/whitehistorymonth";>White History month
Campaign.
~
In Liberty,
Martin H. Smith, Jr.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Spreading the Truth to
Help Inform America!!
DEATH TO THE NEW WORLD ORDER!!
WHY ARE THE BORDERS STILL WIDE OPEN??
NEVER, NEVER, NEVER GIVE UP YOUR FIREARMS!
"If a politician isn't perfectly comfortable with the idea of his average
constituent, any man, woman, or responsible child, walking into a hardware store
and paying cash -- for any rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything --
without producing ID or signing one scrap of paper, he isn't your friend no
matter what he tells you."---L. Neil Smith
"Those who control the past, control the future; and those who control the
present, control the past." -- George Orwell
"If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it
expects what never was and never will be." --Thomas Jefferson
"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary security
deserve neither liberty nor security." --Benjamin Franklin, 1759
"If you make peaceful change impossible. you make violent revolution
inevitable."
--President John F
Kennedy
*
GET THE U.S. OUT OF THE U.N.--AND, GET THE U.N. OUT OF THE U.S.!!!
**
***
DID YOU KNOW?
VACCINES ARE ACTUALLY CAUSING THE EPIDEMIC
OF AUTOIMMUNE DISEASES AND CANCER IN THE WORLD TODAY!
http://www.drcarley.com/";>http://www.drcarley.com/
Did The Occupation Government Have Prior Knowledge Of 9/11?
Did They Let It Happen To Create An Excuse To Institute Police State
Policies?
Did They Orchestrate It?
Check out: www.infowars.com and learn the Truth!!
THERE'S A WAR ON FOR YOUR MIND!
Are you tired of complaining about the problem
and want to DO something about it? Join Us!
http://www.conspiracy1.com/";>http://www.conspiracy1.com/
You are welcome to join rich's Rants
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==
CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directi
[CTRL] Slavery, Everyone?
-Caveat Lector- ~~for educational purposes only~~ [Title 17 U.S.C. section 107] Slavery, Everyone? by Paul Hein Someone in Congress has introduced a particularly silly bit of legislation: the National Slave Memorial Act, which would serve to erect a National Slave Memorial on the Mall in Washington, DC. It's blackmail, literally. No congressman with more than a handful of black voters in his district would dare vote against it; and once established, it will be taken as some sort of proof that blacks are entitled to slavery reparations. Why, the government itself has recognized the horrors of slavery by building this National Slave Memorial! Pay up! But in a way, the Memorial might be a good idea. Slavery is something which should be kept in mind. Excepting marriage, there is no more enduring, universal, or accepted social institution on earth than slavery. The Memorial could (but won't) remind us of that. The reason it won't is that it will deal solely with American black slavery of the type that became extinct about the time of the so-called Civil War. Black's Law Dictionary defines "slave" thusly: "a person who is wholly subject to the will of another; one who has no freedom of action but whose person and services are wholly under the control of another." Webster has a similar definition, adding the concept of ownership. While the ownership of one person by another is odious, to be sure, it was perhaps not what made black slavery so offensive. Rather, it was that idea of total domination of one person by another, "owned" or not. Since childhood, we have associated this arrangement with the slavery of the plantation, the cruel overseer, the smug and pitiless owner, the whips and chains, the noble oppressed savage. OK, but awfully parochial! What about a soldier? People actually enlist in the army, you know, and what do they get? Total domination by another. The soldier does what he is told, when he's told. He eats where and when and what he's expected to eat, wears what he's assigned to wear, and does what he's told to do. If he attempts to leave without permission, he'll be shot, and if he escapes, he'll be hunted down and put in prison for the offense. Jail is pretty much the same, lacking only the cachet of patriotism. The prisoners are totally dominated by others. So if we accept the definitions of slavery provided by the dictionary, these people are slaves also, and our country is full of them especially in prisons. But what of the rest of us? Well, let's see. My friend, who is actually unashamed to refer to himself as a "liberal," would think me insane if I called him a slave. He drives to his company every morning in a car licensed by the state. He attaches the state's ID plates to the car, even though it runs fine without them, and he gains no perceptible or immediate benefit from attaching them. He pays for these devices yearly, and wouldn't dream of operating "his" automobile without them. OK, but otherwise, he's free as a bird. Well, a bird that needs another license to fly. Having bought and licensed the car, he then licenses himself, and again pays for the license, or official permission, to drive it. (At or below the speed limit, of course!) OK, OK, but he could avoid this by taking the bus, and being really free! Except that when he gets to his office, he considers job applications, mindful of federal guidelines regarding hiring, which he dare not ignore. He's very careful not to fire any employee in violation of the rules about such things. He periodically checks the plant to be sure it bears the proper notices of federal labor laws, equal employment opportunities, and safety notices required by an agency far away, in Washington. He hands over a large portion of his compensation to Washington as well, without question. The very assumption of servitude is unquestioned. At home, he may be unable to barbecue when he desires, to avoid worsening the deadly menace of pollution. If it's an even-numbered day, he is permitted to water his lawn for two hours. Before retiring he may watch a few hours of TV on state-licensed stations, or do some broadcasting of his own as a ham operator duly licensed, of course, and in accord with all the regulations pertaining thereto. On the weekend, he may cut his own lawn, being careful to transport the gasoline for the mower in an approved container, and maintaining the various safety devices built into his machine pursuant to federal mandates. Or he may hire someone to cut it for him, being careful to obey the laws about withholding and social security. If he ignores his lawn, the city may fine him for allowing the grass to exceed the permitted height. Should I suggest to my friend that he appears to be dominated by strangers, and is, by definition, a slave, he would become impatient with me. "Nonsense. The various laws and regulations about which you complain are clearly for the good of society, and serve a useful purpose." Well, perhaps, but not so obviousl
[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] R.I.P.Brian Qug
-Caveat Lector- www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om --- Begin Message --- -Caveat Lector- Brian Quig was an American original. warts and all, he will be missed. I got a phone call from one of his best friends yesterday, an old- tmey prvate investgator in phoenix named paul rademacher who has been recent in contact with brian. brian introduced me to rademacher when i visited him in arizona several years ago, just before he took me on a raucous 2-day tour of arizona's cia air bases. based on what he told me, i have no doubt but that brian quig's death was accidental. without going into specifics, because except under special circumstances,we should speak only good about the dead, brian was evidently not winning his own private battles at the time, but what matters is that whle brian qug WAS fully himself he was a regular thorn in the side of the bad guys for a number of years and for that fact alone i think hs life shold be celebrated. i had a drink n hs honor last night. hell, i had three. daniel hopsicker Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/vseplB/TM";>Click Here! -~-> Please let us stay on topic and be civil. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Home Page- www.cia-drugs.org OM Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om --- End Message ---
[CTRL] Savitri Devi
-Caveat Lector- Thanks to whoever sent the following site information to me. It's a good short piece on Devi for those who are unable to find the time to get the book Hitler's Priestess. Please note how material is presented at this site. If you read carefully, you will notice that you and the authors may not agree about the nature of evil. History is repeating itself in this second attempt to develop the New Age movement which was being tried prior to WWII. The site itself, religionandnature.com, contains a wealth of information on names involved in promoting New Age. >From the piece on Savitri Devi on the website: "But her writings, and the powerful dream of a religio-mystical Aryan Golden Age which they so eloquently convey, are having a powerful impact on the movement, and indeed, beyond the narrow confines of the radical right and into the realms of radical ecology and New Age thought." It's also interesting to note how she was influenced and her thinking inflamed by reports coming out of Palestine in 1929. The sent item: "The website for the "Encyclopedia of Religion and Nature" includes a sample article about Savitri Devi, a Nazi who came to have an important influence on neo-Nazi, radical ecological, and New Age groups. The address is: http://www.religionandnature.com/encyclopedia/samples/Devi_Savitri.htm " I first came across Savitri Devi when her books and tapes were being promoted by Zundel. Then again, the first part, "Son of the Sun," of her book, Lightning and the Sun, is on the short main reading list of the Rosacrucians. Nazis, Devi, New Age, Zundel, Rosacrucians...all part of the same evil which will end up destroying and destroying until the evil burns itself out. www.ctrl.org DECLARATION & DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion & informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/">ctrl To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] The Neocons & Their Lies - The Man Behind The Curtain: Bill Kristol
-Caveat Lector- -Caveat Lector- More sensible than prematurely denying Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction and calling Bush/NeoCons liars as Max Shpak does in the following article would be to ask if Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction are now in the hands of Syria, Iran, and Terrorists BECAUSE of the US invasion of Iraq! After all, Iraq was known to have various wmds in the past and strenuously resisted inspections to destroy them in the past. It looks to me like the Bush Administration is setting-up the peace crowd to look foolish when the truth is revealed or manipulated nearer the election. Clearly, Iran has learned from the experience of Iraq and Korea that weapons of mass destruction, in place and ready to fire, are the only means to prevent a “regime change” attack by the United States. Clearly, the United States must oust these so called rogue regimes BEFORE the nuclear, gas, and germ options are in place ready to go if Israel’s future is to be assured. Thus, it would behoove the US to exaggerate the immediacy of the wmd threat, but the US would have little need to exaggerate the threat itself. The Muslim hard liners really DO HATE Israel and its sponsor the US. The Islamists really do want to destroy Israel and the United States! They really do want and are attempting to obtain weapons of mass destruction toward that end! Should the Islamist fail to obtain workable wmds, Israel and the US will gradually or not so gradually destroy Islam! Peace activists OUGHT to be pointing-out that we are fast approaching the point where the SUN NEVER SETS ON AN AMERICAN DYING FOR THE JUDEO-MASONIC-ZIONIST-ANGLOPHILE Empire! Peace activists ought to start arguing about details manipulated in the mass media and question the “big picture” . . . and propose the alternative: the much discredited ISOLATIONISM of America’s past! Lloyd Miller, a-albioic.com -Original Message- From: Conspiracy Theory Research List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of William Shannon Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2003 3:35 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [CTRL] The Neocons & Their Lies - The Man Behind The Curtain: Bill Kristol http://www.etherzone.com/2003/shpa062003.shtml THE NEOCONS AND THEIR LIES THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN - BILL KRISTOL By: Max Shpak It should come as little surprise that weeks after a war that was sold to the public on the grounds that proponents of the war "knew" that Saddam Hussein had Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD’s), they are nowhere to be found. Because the self-styled Mideast warriors at various neoconservative propaganda rags assured the public that there was indeed hard evidence of these WMD’s existence, common sense implies that they, or at least their sources, knew where they were and would surely be able to find them well over a month after the invasion. The fact that nobody is able to do so now proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that the neocons were then as throughout their shady careers feeding lies to the American public. When it comes to the countless overblown claims made by the neocons to propagandize their war against Iraq, it should come as no surprise that the Emperor has no clothes. The neoconservative litany of lies and distortions over the past few years contains enough material to fill several encyclopedic volumes (perhaps one day such a set of volumes will be published as a "how too" guide for the self-styled Ilya Ehrenburgs of the future). Elsewhere I have discussed some of the past hypocrisy, rhetorical sleights-of-hand, half-truths, and outright lies that have surrounded other neoconservative crusades, from the first Gulf War to Kosovo to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. I have also discussed the fact that the public, and for that matter much of the self-congratulatory "watchdog" media, are utterly numb to the fact that neoconservatives habitually lie. Indeed, the mass media organs and their eager viewers still seem ever ready to swallow the newest batch of swill produced by the Kristols and Frums of the world without the slightest hindsight or concern about their past deceptions. Where the neoconservative program of deceit has taken a new and interesting angle this time around is the way in which they are handling the (minimal) extent of discussion and revelation surrounding their nonexistent "evidence" for Hussein’s WMD’s. Knowing perfectly well that they were the agent provocateurs behind these claims, the neocons have quickly moved to cover their flank by effectively pinning whatever blame there might be on those they swindled. It’s a strategy all shysters use: find a willing dupe and junior partner for your scam, and then when the effort fails, pin all of the blame on unwitting assistant. In his effort to nip any criticism of WMD lies at the bud, William Kristol began his self-exculpatory memo with the claim "We shouldn't deny, those of us who were hawk
[CTRL] More discussion on Fascism and Socialism
Title: Message -Caveat Lector- -Original Message-From: Conspiracy Theory Research List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ZuukieSent: Sunday, June 22, 2003 11:04 AMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: Re: [CTRL] Sharon says assassination policy will continue-Caveat Lector- >Fascism is based on the ideal of National SOCIALISM. The only real >difference between a Nazi and a Communist is that a Nazi believes that >socialism can be achieved in a single nation while a communist believes >that a global socialist state is need to fully implement socialist >tyranny. One of the first things the Nazis did was to murder every socialist they could find. When leftists talk about socialism today they mean DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM, [Internet Wizards] This is simply not true. The Nazis were proud to claim their socialist agenda and were considered as part and parcel of the left by every major trade union, socialist party and the CPSU until 1941. with workers (including managers) having democratic control (one-person-one-vote, not one-dollar-one-vote as in the U.S. today) over the businesses they work in and over the economy and government as a whole. [Internet Wizards] Equal shares regardless of merit, appropriation of other's property, government control of the economy for the public good. Rooting out the greedy to make the world a better place... we've heard it before from Lenin, Engels, Marx, Hitler, Mao, Mussolini, Ho Chi Minh, Castro, Pol Pot... and MILLIONS have been murdered for it. That's what socialism is. That's what you are advocating for. Regardless of their party's name or the original beliefs of some of their members, the actual facts of Nazism and Italian and Japanese Fascism is that they were financed by (some) wealthy businessmen and they served the interests of wealthy businessmen. [Internet Wizards] More nonsense. The Japanese militarists grew out of the Samurai culture of Japan (I thought you leftists LIKED diversity) and wasn't national socialist. The Nazi, Fascist and Communist regimes all have a common ancestry and while they all enjoyed support from some wealthy members of society, they existed to promote and advance the power of the party through which the worker's dreams would be realized. You need to read more history and less propaganda. You haven't offered proof one for your mistaken opinion. All these forms of Fascism specifically murdered everyone who advocated democratic control of businesses and the economy by the people. They even murdered union leaders who simply wanted to organize workers so they could gain some leverage toward better wages and conditions. [Internet Wizards] What are you talking about! The nazis came in on the idea of Volks control of the economy and they siezed control of both labor and capital in the name of the Volk. There was nothing capitalist about the Nazis but there was a lot of socialist ideology in their actions and rhetoric. The Nazis and the USSR where both excellent examples of the fully developed socialist state. The German Fascists (Nazis) got most of their financing from (some) wealthy American businessmen. After WWII, (some) wealthy American businessmen, acting through conservative politicians, carried out assassinations and covert and overt military attacks on dozens of different nations, to murder exactly the same sorts of pro-human political leaders that the Nazis murdered. See the references below. [Internet Wizards] More nonsense. Hitlers biggest western supporters were the great liberal leaders of the day. Hitler did enjoy the backing of some powerful businessmen early in his career. However, once he took power, the Nazi state usurped control of those concerns (Krupp, Farben, et al) throught the Reichsminstry of Economics telling them what to produce, how to produce it, how much to pay their workers, what they could sell, how much they could charge for it, to whom they could sell it, on what terms and how much money they'd be able to retain. That is a command economy, which is the basis of socialism. It is entirely non-capitalist. >This person is of the mistaken assumption that profits are evil. No, it is _excessive_ profits -- those that rob from workers most of the value of the goods and services they produce -- that are evil. [Internet Wizards] What are you talking about? No one "robs the workers", witho
Re: [CTRL] Sharon says assassination policy will continue
Title: Message -Caveat Lector- >Fascism is based on the ideal of National SOCIALISM. The only real >difference between a Nazi and a Communist is that a Nazi believes that >socialism can be achieved in a single nation while a communist believes >that a global socialist state is need to fully implement socialist >tyranny. One of the first things the Nazis did was to murder every socialist they could find. When leftists talk about socialism today they mean DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM, [Internet Wizards] This is simply not true. The Nazis were proud to claim their socialist agenda and were considered as part and parcel of the left by every major trade union, socialist party and the CPSU until 1941. with workers (including managers) having democratic control (one-person-one-vote, not one-dollar-one-vote as in the U.S. today) over the businesses they work in and over the economy and government as a whole. [Internet Wizards] Equal shares regardless of merit, appropriation of other's property, government control of the economy for the public good. Rooting out the greedy to make the world a better place... we've heard it before from Lenin, Engels, Marx, Hitler, Mao, Mussolini, Ho Chi Minh, Castro, Pol Pot... and MILLIONS have been murdered for it. That's what socialism is. That's what you are advocating for. Regardless of their party's name or the original beliefs of some of their members, the actual facts of Nazism and Italian and Japanese Fascism is that they were financed by (some) wealthy businessmen and they served the interests of wealthy businessmen. [Internet Wizards] More nonsense. The Japanese militarists grew out of the Samurai culture of Japan (I thought you leftists LIKED diversity) and wasn't national socialist. The Nazi, Fascist and Communist regimes all have a common ancestry and while they all enjoyed support from some wealthy members of society, they existed to promote and advance the power of the party through which the worker's dreams would be realized. You need to read more history and less propaganda. You haven't offered proof one for your mistaken opinion. All these forms of Fascism specifically murdered everyone who advocated democratic control of businesses and the economy by the people. They even murdered union leaders who simply wanted to organize workers so they could gain some leverage toward better wages and conditions. [Internet Wizards] What are you talking about! The nazis came in on the idea of Volks control of the economy and they siezed control of both labor and capital in the name of the Volk. There was nothing capitalist about the Nazis but there was a lot of socialist ideology in their actions and rhetoric. The Nazis and the USSR where both excellent examples of the fully developed socialist state. The German Fascists (Nazis) got most of their financing from (some) wealthy American businessmen. After WWII, (some) wealthy American businessmen, acting through conservative politicians, carried out assassinations and covert and overt military attacks on dozens of different nations, to murder exactly the same sorts of pro-human political leaders that the Nazis murdered. See the references below. [Internet Wizards] More nonsense. Hitlers biggest western supporters were the great liberal leaders of the day. Hitler did enjoy the backing of some powerful businessmen early in his career. However, once he took power, the Nazi state usurped control of those concerns (Krupp, Farben, et al) throught the Reichsminstry of Economics telling them what to produce, how to produce it, how much to pay their workers, what they could sell, how much they could charge for it, to whom they could sell it, on what terms and how much money they'd be able to retain. That is a command economy, which is the basis of socialism. It is entirely non-capitalist. >This person is of the mistaken assumption that profits are evil. No, it is _excessive_ profits -- those that rob from workers most of the value of the goods and services they produce -- that are evil. [Internet Wizards] What are you talking about? No one "robs the workers", without the capital outlay there is no production. The worker is paid, the owner makes a profit, all benefit. There is no robbery here. And who determines what is excessive? You? the Party? In a capitalist economy the MARKET decides when enough is enough. .> what he ignores is that the much maligned American capitalist economy has created more wealth A great deal of the wealth created by the American capitalist econo
