Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
It's an MIT license: https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-stable.git/tree/firmware/WHENCE#n758 pgpDw4IryVaNg.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 06:57:43PM +0100, gaffa wrote: > It's an MIT license: > > https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-stable.git/tree/firmware/WHENCE#n758 That's a fine license as far as the DFSG is concerned, but as long as they don't provide source, it's still not free software. Thanks, Bas -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJWnoq/AAoJEJzRfVgHwHE6gTgP/jDl77EqRRPczNxTuMI9CJnF 14+aHHq3qVnjaBtKtjgPDL/7NIc6o4jQCjFJZ4q9zhkoHmE07JUdyN8a5B5tkGL2 xM/Ri4UAReYaTTOsN71zNxp3q5vzSp9KFySs3fiFHKL1ANjg93qfG6Z4XRIyjEjk 4dGnn8ZMsRSKFZyLRIPMB75wGGcDzwwOtCC+PX5GQtlbqnCpaG5ODDeQwga6beu2 8AYKIHGP0VNd2u6oV/eLU+8j2fBzWpXY9Ns2SBNTH3i+SGTf9phr/8ZnyMGFkJaM Nkj3KP/aoXPtG9IiodDW7M78VWtl3ctYi82w/6tDIL7fGHiA5xi2Mn29AcgP8O7f MSr9AOSn4cBbHXnusyuQCGk9AlDxVEa9BB/1jjXwhQxhrtKUSvtKlok+GZoCwTh2 bY6g0iJOxR0KsOV50BU04LAoq6jrI1aLPysaygEg/WE36x4FTl0Gf09jmH8xrl9y uAP2DjaIdlDLd3GUXc281ISi7T8MsojB5DJ9aOG1WDgN2JxDD2TltIaNDb5EoebL 2ejMROdAwG1QhCYCXzPpU5OV7J0VdXXsE/OUUV6yefUYkF2irK/cZQmqtd5wH4H/ qShClr4iiTRcPDhdrRtXyB471cadgTc1KHp5tMrdWJMydy/V2O3XwuXPRrEcEf4Z MbDHHsf4aZ7gTh0fWmyA =ZbHh -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
Bas Wijnenwrites: > On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 06:57:43PM +0100, gaffa wrote: > > It's an MIT license: > > > That's a fine license as far as the DFSG is concerned, but as long as > they don't provide source, it's still not free software. Indeed, as far as the DFSG is concerned, it needs to be applied to *specific works* with their license conditions, not license texts in isolation. This case is a clear demonstration of why asking “does this license make the work DFSG-free?” is no use absent the context of a specific work. -- \“Every sentence I utter must be understood not as an | `\ affirmation, but as a question.” —Niels Bohr | _o__) | Ben Finney
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
On Jan 16, 2016 1:30 AM, "gaffa"wrote: > > The firmware has a free license if you are to believe the WENCE file in the > kernel. > Ummm, just a guess but I think that would be talking about transferring ownership and not on reverse engineering (for instance).
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
On Fri, 2016-01-15 at 04:57 -0500, shawn wilson wrote: > > On Jan 14, 2016 5:11 PM, "Zlatan Todoric"wrote: > > > > So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we > > > can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. > > > > > > > You do realize that AMD graphics need proprietary firmware to have > > proper 3D acceleration without which you probably couldn't run any game > > at all - so goodbye Libre graphics. > > > Besides that, AMD's fglrx require X to be running in order to run while nVidia > does not (kinda sucks if you have a bunch of 8 card nodes using the cards for > scientific applications). Also, in this setting, there were a lot more issues > with AMD than nVidia (soft crashes, hard crashes, cards going offline until > reboot). > I'm not a big gamer, so maybe there are less issues with AMD in this setting. > And I'd be thrilled if either fglrx or nv were OSS (would weigh heavily on > purchasing decisions). However, because AMD really pissed me off here, I had > to say something here. Well, I don't think the issue is about the non-free driver fglrx, but the open source radeon drivers. fglrx is as bad as the nVidia non-free ones. BTW: nv is OSS (Open Source Software), however with limited performance due to lacking open documentation of the nVidia graphics hardware. The closed firmware issue is another story...
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
>> So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we >> can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. > You do realize that AMD graphics need proprietary firmware to have > proper 3D acceleration without which you probably couldn't run any game > at all - so goodbye Libre graphics. That's still much better than the situation with Nvidia. But your point is well taken: we should put most pressure on Nvidia while keeping the pressure on AMD. Stefan
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
The firmware has a free license if you are to believe the WENCE file in the kernel.
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
On Jan 14, 2016 5:11 PM, "Zlatan Todoric"wrote: > > > > On 01/14/2016 09:11 PM, Alberto Salvia Novella wrote: > > Nearly all compact Linux computers feasible for gaming are sold > > exclusively using NVIDIA graphics, and that company is hostile to libre > > software. > > > > So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we > > can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. > > > > You do realize that AMD graphics need proprietary firmware to have > proper 3D acceleration without which you probably couldn't run any game > at all - so goodbye Libre graphics. > Besides that, AMD's fglrx require X to be running in order to run while nVidia does not (kinda sucks if you have a bunch of 8 card nodes using the cards for scientific applications). Also, in this setting, there were a lot more issues with AMD than nVidia (soft crashes, hard crashes, cards going offline until reboot). I'm not a big gamer, so maybe there are less issues with AMD in this setting. And I'd be thrilled if either fglrx or nv were OSS (would weigh heavily on purchasing decisions). However, because AMD really pissed me off here, I had to say something here. > > Because of that I have started campaigning for it: > > http://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/11/458606248621316073/ > >
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
On Thu, Jan 14, 2016 at 4:10 PM, Zlatan Todoricwrote: > > > On 01/14/2016 09:11 PM, Alberto Salvia Novella wrote: > > Nearly all compact Linux computers feasible for gaming are sold > > exclusively using NVIDIA graphics, and that company is hostile to libre > > software. > > > > So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we > > can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. > > > > You do realize that AMD graphics need proprietary firmware to have > proper 3D acceleration without which you probably couldn't run any game > at all - so goodbye Libre graphics. > > > Because of that I have started campaigning for it: > > http://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/11/458606248621316073/ > > > > > Uh, excuse me... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPUOpen http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/12/amd-embraces-open-source-to-take-on-nvidias-gameworks/ http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-gpuopen-open-source-development,30750.html It's time we started promoting AMD rather than Nvidia for Linux graphics. -- Michael "TheZorch" Haney https://sites.google.com/site/thezorch/ "You will not have our hatred, we choose love over fear! Our prayer: we refuse to become a monster to defeat a monster." --Bono Free Your PC, Open Your Mind www.ubuntu.com
Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
Nearly all compact Linux computers feasible for gaming are sold exclusively using NVIDIA graphics, and that company is hostile to libre software. So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. Because of that I have started campaigning for it: http://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/11/458606248621316073/ smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
Re: Libre graphics could become the standard if we push right now
On 01/14/2016 09:11 PM, Alberto Salvia Novella wrote: > Nearly all compact Linux computers feasible for gaming are sold > exclusively using NVIDIA graphics, and that company is hostile to libre > software. > > So I think it is very important that we support AMD right now on what we > can, and ask manufacturers to include AMD graphics in those products. > You do realize that AMD graphics need proprietary firmware to have proper 3D acceleration without which you probably couldn't run any game at all - so goodbye Libre graphics. > Because of that I have started campaigning for it: > http://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/11/458606248621316073/ > > >