Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 10/10/2015 07:39 PM, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 07:20:22AM +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote: I know, we are late in the release schedule, but I am considering to switching at least Inventor to motif on fc23, as well - It's unimportant enough to most users, but is important to me ;) I think that in a case of leaf package like that it totally makes sense to switch even this late before release. Removal of a dependency on lesstif seems important enough. Rebuilding Inventor against motif requires switching mesa-libGLw and Inventor to motif, i.e. a chain build consisting of mesa-libGLw and Inventor. As Inventor seems to be the only user of mesa-libGLw, this should be pretty harmless. Unless somebody objects, I am going to rebuild these 2 packages for fc23 tomorrow. Ralf PS.: derelict-GL3-devel also claims to require mesa-libGLw, but I can not spot any actual source-code nor object dependency beween GLw nor Xm. I therefore am inclined to believe this to be a packaging bug in derelict. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 07:20:22AM +0200, Ralf Corsepius wrote: > On 10/09/2015 09:17 PM, Stephen John Smoogen wrote: > >On 8 October 2015 at 17:04, Kevin Koflerwrote: > >>Christopher Meng wrote: > >>>IMO motif should 'Obsoletes' lesstif in Fedora since motif is free now. > >> > >>The reason we kept lesstif even after OpenMotif was finally freed is because > >>OpenMotif only implements the Motif 2 API, whereas lesstif implemented the > >>Motif 1 API. Back then, a lot of Motif applications did not compile with > >>Motif 2. > >> > > > >A lot of applications still do not mainly because by the time > >OpenMotif was out.. "Motif" was dead except for legacy computer code > >that a lot of research institutes still use. It looks from the amount > >of porting that has been done in this thread that a lot of those > >problems are easier to fix now? > > > > From the people who did the porting was it a quick fix or a bunch of > > patches? > > As far as the packages I touched are concerned, the "porting effort" > was very low. > > The effort basically was reflecting the packaging dep-naming changes > into the specs. > > I did not have to apply any changes to the packages' source code. My > guess is, on the code-level, today's "Motif" is sufficiently > backward compatible, the packages already saw testing against Motif > or even been developed on Motif (and then ported to lesstif)[1]. I > point, I which makes me wonder, is Fedora seemingly being late in > the switch to Motif in comparison to other distros. > > A problem hiding is package installation conflicts between the > *-devel package of different versions of the lesstif, openmotif and > motif packages. Therefore, I tried to stay with lesstif on fedora < > 24 and switch to motif only on fedora >= 24. > > I know, we are late in the release schedule, but I am considering to > switching at least Inventor to motif on fc23, as well - It's > unimportant enough to most users, but is important to me ;) I think that in a case of leaf package like that it totally makes sense to switch even this late before release. Removal of a dependency on lesstif seems important enough. Zbyszek -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 10/09/2015 09:17 PM, Stephen John Smoogen wrote: On 8 October 2015 at 17:04, Kevin Koflerwrote: Christopher Meng wrote: IMO motif should 'Obsoletes' lesstif in Fedora since motif is free now. The reason we kept lesstif even after OpenMotif was finally freed is because OpenMotif only implements the Motif 2 API, whereas lesstif implemented the Motif 1 API. Back then, a lot of Motif applications did not compile with Motif 2. A lot of applications still do not mainly because by the time OpenMotif was out.. "Motif" was dead except for legacy computer code that a lot of research institutes still use. It looks from the amount of porting that has been done in this thread that a lot of those problems are easier to fix now? From the people who did the porting was it a quick fix or a bunch of patches? As far as the packages I touched are concerned, the "porting effort" was very low. The effort basically was reflecting the packaging dep-naming changes into the specs. I did not have to apply any changes to the packages' source code. My guess is, on the code-level, today's "Motif" is sufficiently backward compatible, the packages already saw testing against Motif or even been developed on Motif (and then ported to lesstif)[1]. I point, I which makes me wonder, is Fedora seemingly being late in the switch to Motif in comparison to other distros. A problem hiding is package installation conflicts between the *-devel package of different versions of the lesstif, openmotif and motif packages. Therefore, I tried to stay with lesstif on fedora < 24 and switch to motif only on fedora >= 24. I know, we are late in the release schedule, but I am considering to switching at least Inventor to motif on fc23, as well - It's unimportant enough to most users, but is important to me ;) Ralf [1] In the ole' days, lesstif almost always had been the troublesome part, which required app-code to me modified, because of missing features or incompatibilities ;) -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 8 October 2015 at 17:04, Kevin Koflerwrote: > Christopher Meng wrote: >> IMO motif should 'Obsoletes' lesstif in Fedora since motif is free now. > > The reason we kept lesstif even after OpenMotif was finally freed is because > OpenMotif only implements the Motif 2 API, whereas lesstif implemented the > Motif 1 API. Back then, a lot of Motif applications did not compile with > Motif 2. > A lot of applications still do not mainly because by the time OpenMotif was out.. "Motif" was dead except for legacy computer code that a lot of research institutes still use. It looks from the amount of porting that has been done in this thread that a lot of those problems are easier to fix now? From the people who did the porting was it a quick fix or a bunch of patches? -- Stephen J Smoogen. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
W dniu 08.10.2015 o 12:06, Marcin Juszkiewicz pisze: W dniu 02.10.2015 o 13:33, Jon Ciesla pisze: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. dinotrace fbb xastir xmbdfed xvarstar Those are blocking aarch64. Will dig for more. alliance polyml That's all I found. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
W dniu 02.10.2015 o 13:33, Jon Ciesla pisze: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. dinotrace fbb xastir xmbdfed xvarstar Those are blocking aarch64. Will dig for more. -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 10/08/2015 12:24 PM, Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote: W dniu 08.10.2015 o 12:06, Marcin Juszkiewicz pisze: W dniu 02.10.2015 o 13:33, Jon Ciesla pisze: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. dinotrace fbb xastir xmbdfed xvarstar Those are blocking aarch64. Will dig for more. alliance polyml That's all I found. I believe to have taken care about all of these (but alliance) throughout today and rebuilt them against motif on rawhide. alliance seems multiply pretty broken independently of motif/lesstif. I would consider it to be a candidate for retirement. Ralf -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
IMO motif should 'Obsoletes' lesstif in Fedora since motif is free now. -- Yours sincerely, Christopher Meng http://awk.io -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On Thu, Oct 8, 2015 at 10:38 AM, Ralf Corsepiuswrote: > On 10/08/2015 12:24 PM, Marcin Juszkiewicz wrote: > >> W dniu 08.10.2015 o 12:06, Marcin Juszkiewicz pisze: >> >>> W dniu 02.10.2015 o 13:33, Jon Ciesla pisze: >>> Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. >>> >>> If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. >>> >>> dinotrace >>> fbb >>> xastir >>> xmbdfed >>> xvarstar >>> >>> Those are blocking aarch64. Will dig for more. >>> >> >> alliance >> polyml >> >> That's all I found. >> > I believe to have taken care about all of these (but alliance) throughout > today and rebuilt them against motif on rawhide. > > alliance seems multiply pretty broken independently of motif/lesstif. > I would consider it to be a candidate for retirement. > > Thank you! > Ralf > > -- > devel mailing list > devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct -- http://cecinestpasunefromage.wordpress.com/ in your fear, seek only peace in your fear, seek only love -d. bowie -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
Christopher Meng wrote: > IMO motif should 'Obsoletes' lesstif in Fedora since motif is free now. The reason we kept lesstif even after OpenMotif was finally freed is because OpenMotif only implements the Motif 2 API, whereas lesstif implemented the Motif 1 API. Back then, a lot of Motif applications did not compile with Motif 2. Kevin Kofler -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Joachim Backes < joachim.bac...@rhrk.uni-kl.de> wrote: > On 02.10.2015 13:33, Jon Ciesla wrote: > >> Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think >> it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining >> packages still using it I could find in rawhide: >> >> xbae >> mesa-libGLw >> ski >> Inventor >> grass >> >> > An additional pkg is "grace" needing lesstif. > Looks like this is just due to xbae and nedit, so it should be fine. > > -- > > Fedora release 23 (Twenty Three) > Kernel-4.2.2-300.fc23.x86_64 > > > Joachim Backes> http://www-user.rhrk.uni-kl.de/~backes/ > -- > devel mailing list > devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct -- http://cecinestpasunefromage.wordpress.com/ in your fear, seek only peace in your fear, seek only love -d. bowie -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 02.10.2015 13:33, Jon Ciesla wrote: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining packages still using it I could find in rawhide: xbae mesa-libGLw ski Inventor grass If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. If anyone objects to retiring lesstif, also let me know, and why you feel that way. If there are no major objections by Monday I'll retire lesstif then, and repair any broken dependencies that were missed. Thanks! -j I have have installed nedit on my F23 box, and this pkg needs lesstif, and it won't install with motif! Kind regards Joachim Backes -- Fedora release 23 (Twenty Three) Kernel-4.2.2-300.fc23.x86_64 Joachim Backeshttp://www-user.rhrk.uni-kl.de/~backes/ -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining packages still using it I could find in rawhide: xbae mesa-libGLw ski Inventor grass If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can migrate them. If anyone objects to retiring lesstif, also let me know, and why you feel that way. If there are no major objections by Monday I'll retire lesstif then, and repair any broken dependencies that were missed. Thanks! -j -- http://cecinestpasunefromage.wordpress.com/ in your fear, seek only peace in your fear, seek only love -d. bowie -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 10/02/2015 01:33 PM, Jon Ciesla wrote: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining packages still using it I could find in rawhide: Inventor [Inventor maintainer speaking] Migrating Inventor to motif should not be much of a problem, however in past, this wasn't possible, because Fedora's lesstif-devel and motif-devel clashed and could not be installed in parallel. I'll try to investigate. Ralf -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On 02.10.2015 13:33, Jon Ciesla wrote: Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining packages still using it I could find in rawhide: xbae mesa-libGLw ski Inventor grass An additional pkg is "grace" needing lesstif. -- Fedora release 23 (Twenty Three) Kernel-4.2.2-300.fc23.x86_64 Joachim Backeshttp://www-user.rhrk.uni-kl.de/~backes/ -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct
Re: Proposal: retire lesstif in f24 and beyond
On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 6:49 AM, Joachim Backes < joachim.bac...@rhrk.uni-kl.de> wrote: > On 02.10.2015 13:33, Jon Ciesla wrote: > >> Lesstif being basically dead upstream and motif being available, I think >> it's probably time to retire lesstif. I've migrated the remaining >> packages still using it I could find in rawhide: >> >> xbae >> mesa-libGLw >> ski >> Inventor >> grass >> >> >> If anyone knows of other packages using it, please let me know and I can >> migrate them. If anyone objects to retiring lesstif, also let me know, >> and why you feel that way. If there are no major objections by Monday >> I'll retire lesstif then, and repair any broken dependencies that were >> missed. >> >> Thanks! >> -j >> > > I have have installed nedit on my F23 box, and this pkg needs lesstif, and > it won't install with motif! > > > Kind regards > > Joachim Backes > > > -- > > Fedora release 23 (Twenty Three) > Kernel-4.2.2-300.fc23.x86_64 > > > Joachim Backes> http://www-user.rhrk.uni-kl.de/~backes/ > -- > devel mailing list > devel@lists.fedoraproject.org > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct I've now rebuilt nedit for f24, and lesstif will still be available for f23. Thanks! -- http://cecinestpasunefromage.wordpress.com/ in your fear, seek only peace in your fear, seek only love -d. bowie -- devel mailing list devel@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct