Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Wed, 2009-07-22 at 14:16 -0500, Curtis Olson wrote: > I have a question and am wondering if our code currently has the > capability to do this and if anyone has developed an appropriate set > of config options. > > I would like to create a view that simulators a gyro stabilized > pan/tilt camera looking at a specific fixed point on the ground (i.e. > news helicopter or uav type application.) I see we have a "lookat" > mode in our code, but this appears to be hardwired to either look at > our own aircraft as it flies from a fixed view point, or look in a > specific direction. > > I'm just wondering if I need to dig into the code to add some > additional modes of operation, or can the code already do what I'd > like and I'm just not seeing how it's done? > > Thanks, > > Curt. News Camera lookat true /position/latitude-deg /position/longitude-deg /position/altitude-ft /orientation/heading-deg /sim/tower/latitude-deg /sim/tower/longitude-deg /sim/tower/altitude-ft -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Wed, 2009-07-22 at 14:16 -0500, Curtis Olson wrote: > I have a question and am wondering if our code currently has the > capability to do this and if anyone has developed an appropriate set > of config options. > > I would like to create a view that simulators a gyro stabilized > pan/tilt camera looking at a specific fixed point on the ground (i.e. > news helicopter or uav type application.) I see we have a "lookat" > mode in our code, but this appears to be hardwired to either look at > our own aircraft as it flies from a fixed view point, or look in a > specific direction. > > I'm just wondering if I need to dig into the code to add some > additional modes of operation, or can the code already do what I'd > like and I'm just not seeing how it's done? > > Thanks, > > Curt. News Camera lookat true /position/latitude-deg /position/longitude-deg /position/altitude-ft /orientation/heading-deg /sim/tower/latitude-deg /sim/tower/longitude-deg /sim/tower/altitude-ft -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Wow, that's perfect, exactly what I was hoping for !!! I made a small change in your proposed configuration to map the target-lat/lon/elevation path to /sim/input/click so the camera automatically stays fixed on anything you click on in the view. I discovered that you really want to have the aircraft on autopilot, or someone else flying with a proper view. The capabilities and reconfigurability of FlightGear is amazing. (We aren't perfect, but it doesn't hurt to pat ourselves on the back every once in a while.) :-) Thanks again! Curt. On Wed, 2009-07-22 at 14:16 -0500, Curtis Olson wrote: > > I would like to create a view that simulators a gyro stabilized > > pan/tilt camera looking at a specific fixed point on the ground (i.e. > > news helicopter or uav type application.) I see we have a "lookat" > > mode in our code, but this appears to be hardwired to either look at > > our own aircraft as it flies from a fixed view point, or look in a > > specific direction. > On Wed, Jul 22, 2009 at 8:34 PM, Ron Jensen wrote: > >News Camera >lookat >true > > /position/latitude-deg > /position/longitude-deg > /position/altitude-ft > /orientation/heading-deg > > /sim/tower/latitude-deg > /sim/tower/longitude-deg > /sim/tower/altitude-ft > > > > > > > > -- > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel > -- Curtis Olson: http://baron.flightgear.org/~curt/ -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Curtis Olson wrote: > Wow, that's perfect, exactly what I was hoping for !!! > > I made a small change in your proposed configuration to map the > target-lat/lon/elevation path to /sim/input/click so the camera > automatically stays fixed on anything you click on in the view. I > discovered that you really want to have the aircraft on autopilot, or > someone else flying with a proper view. > Would it be possible to place the new "view" into a window instead of having a dedicated view? That would allow you to have an instrument panel with a blank cut-out that could hold this newscam/FLIR window. g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Gene Buckle wrote: > Would it be possible to place the new "view" into a window instead of > having a dedicated view? That would allow you to have an instrument panel > with a blank cut-out that could hold this newscam/FLIR window. AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. Jon -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Jon Stockill wrote: > Gene Buckle wrote: > >> Would it be possible to place the new "view" into a window instead of >> having a dedicated view? That would allow you to have an instrument panel >> with a blank cut-out that could hold this newscam/FLIR window. > > AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 > instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. > Rats. That would've been a neat feature. g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
We can define arbitrary areas of the screen and draw any view perspective into them. However, I think all the views need to be from the same eye point. (i.e. you can't have a cockpit view in one window and a chase view in another?) However, the capability we do have is very nice for supporting devices like the Matrox Triple Head 2 Go box, or Twin View, or any "spanning" desktop system. And we have the ability to extend this to multiple displays. There is an AMD/ATI demo movie floating around on youtube that shows FlightGear running on 8 monitors using 4 dual-headed video cards. I don't know how far you could stretch this capability? If you could configure a dynamic view offset and view heading for one particular display, you might be able to fake a lot of this. Curt. On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Gene Buckle wrote: > On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Jon Stockill wrote: > > > Gene Buckle wrote: > > > >> Would it be possible to place the new "view" into a window instead of > >> having a dedicated view? That would allow you to have an instrument > panel > >> with a blank cut-out that could hold this newscam/FLIR window. > > > > AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 > > instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. > > > > Rats. That would've been a neat feature. > > g. > > -- > Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 > http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. > > ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment > A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. > http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! > > > -- > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel > -- Curtis Olson: http://baron.flightgear.org/~curt/ -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Jon Stockill wrote: > AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 > instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add additional cameras, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
* Curtis Olson -- Thursday 23 July 2009: > The capabilities and reconfigurability of FlightGear is amazing. ... and have just (needlessly) been damaged by the vector property abomination. Now we get properties that are no longer accessible in all the traditional ways. And that required lots of code and is slower than alternatives. Sigh. m. -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Martin Spott wrote: > Jon Stockill wrote: > >> AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 >> instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. > > The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add > additional cameras, That allows you to extend your display, but doesn't give you an independent camera showing a view from a different POV. README.multiscreen was exactly what I was working from when trying to build something which would composite something like tower/flyby/cockpit views on a single screen. Jon -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Martin Spott wrote: > Jon Stockill wrote: > >> AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need 2 >> instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. > > The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add > additional cameras, > Martin, I don't think that can be used for the kind of "camera" I'm thinking of. The easiest way to visualize the idea I have is to think about the view you'd see in one of the rear-view mirrors that most fighters have along the canopy bow (and the Spitfire has mounted on top of the canopy bow, outside the cockpit). You'd see your full screen view as usual, but you'd also have these "mirrors" showing the view behind you at the same time. g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Melchior FRANZ wrote: > * Curtis Olson -- Thursday 23 July 2009: >> The capabilities and reconfigurability of FlightGear is amazing. > > ... and have just (needlessly) been damaged by the vector property > abomination. Now we get properties that are no longer accessible in > all the traditional ways. And that required lots of code and is > slower than alternatives. Sigh. > Prove it. g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Jon Stockill wrote: > Martin Spott wrote: >> The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add >> additional cameras, > > That allows you to extend your display, but doesn't give you an > independent camera showing a view from a different POV. Well, I currently don't have a setup to test, yet I understand this section: view The view node specifies the origin and direction of the camera in relation to the whole camera group. The coordinate system is +y up, -z forward in the direction of the camera group view. This is the same as the OpenGL viewing coordinates. x,y,z - double Coordinates of the view origin. as being able to define one POV for each camera. Aside from that, it's without doubt that the setup allows to define distinct/independent cameras in the sense that two camera views don't have to have a common border. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Hi Gene, Gene Buckle wrote: > On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Martin Spott wrote: >> The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add >> additional cameras, >> > Martin, I don't think that can be used for the kind of "camera" I'm > thinking of. The easiest way to visualize the idea I have is to think > about the view you'd see in one of the rear-view mirrors [...] I pretty much understand what you mean (we do have two external rear mirrors mounted onto the glider towing aircraft). I have to admit that I've never configured multiple camera views to display in different windows on the same screen. Yet I've already had different cameras pointing into totally distinct headings, even at different viewing angles - each of them displaying on a distinct X11 screen on the same X11 display (:0.0, :0.1, :0.2). And, _if_ the (already cited) parameter to define the coordinates of the view origin works as expected, then you're almost there you just have to get rid of the window border - for example by retiring the window manager. This alltogether would be an interesting excercise - I'll try that tonight, if nobody is quicker at it. Cheers, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
> Hi Gene, > > Gene Buckle wrote: > > On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Martin Spott wrote: > >> The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add > >> additional cameras, > > > > Martin, I don't think that can be used for the kind of "camera" I'm > > thinking of. The easiest way to visualize the idea I have is to think > > about the view you'd see in one of the rear-view mirrors [...] > > I pretty much understand what you mean (we do have two external rear > mirrors mounted onto the glider towing aircraft). I have to admit that > I've never configured multiple camera views to display in different > windows on the same screen. Yet I've already had different cameras > pointing into totally distinct headings, even at different viewing > angles - each of them displaying on a distinct X11 screen on the same > X11 display (:0.0, :0.1, :0.2). > > And, _if_ the (already cited) parameter to define the coordinates of > the view origin works as expected, then you're almost there you > just have to get rid of the window border - for example by retiring the > window manager. This alltogether would be an interesting excercise - > I'll try that tonight, if nobody is quicker at it. > > I am not sure if this is it (scroll down to see a screenshot): http://flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2985&p=26114 Torsten -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Gene Buckle > > On Thu, 23 Jul 2009, Martin Spott wrote: > > > Jon Stockill wrote: > > > >> AFAIK we're currently limited to 1 camera, which would mean you'd need > 2 > >> instances of FlightGear in order to get the 2 different views. > > > > The file FlightGear/docs-mini/README.multiscreen explains how to add > > additional cameras, > > > Martin, I don't think that can be used for the kind of "camera" I'm > thinking of. The easiest way to visualize the idea I have is to think > about the view you'd see in one of the rear-view mirrors that most > fighters have along the canopy bow (and the Spitfire has mounted on top of > the canopy bow, outside the cockpit). You'd see your full screen view as > usual, but you'd also have these "mirrors" showing the view behind you at > the same time. > I had a look at the this idea a while back - the problem I came across was that the camera would show the view to the rear NOT the mirror image. I couldn't see a way around that without a great deal of processing. At hat point I gave up. Vivian -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 11:26 AM, Martin Spott wrote: > I pretty much understand what you mean (we do have two external rear > mirrors mounted onto the glider towing aircraft). I have to admit that > I've never configured multiple camera views to display in different > windows on the same screen. Yet I've already had different cameras > pointing into totally distinct headings, even at different viewing > angles - each of them displaying on a distinct X11 screen on the same > X11 display (:0.0, :0.1, :0.2). One thing we have to consider with rear view mirrors is that we don't currently have the ability to flip the display for the "mirror" affect. Curt. -- Curtis Olson: http://baron.flightgear.org/~curt/ -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
> > And, _if_ the (already cited) parameter to define the coordinates of > the view origin works as expected, then you're almost there you > just have to get rid of the window border - for example by retiring the > window manager. This alltogether would be an interesting excercise - > I'll try that tonight, if nobody is quicker at it. > Now there's an idea. What happens if you're running in "full screen" mode? g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Vivian Meazza wrote:
> I had a look at the this idea a while back - the problem I came across was
> that the camera would show the view to the rear NOT the mirror image. I
> couldn't see a way around that without a great deal of processing. At hat
> point I gave up.
>
There's got to be a very simple view transform matrix that would invert the
display in the horizontal direction. Probably the identity matrix with the
appropriate axis negated (-1). It might be a relatively simple thing to add
to the view transform pipeline at some point.
In fact from a previous project I did the following to modify the model view
matrix for a mirror view:
if ( mirror_geometry ) {
glScalef ( -1.0f, 1.0f, 1.0f ) ;
}
Regards,
Curt.
--
Curtis Olson: http://baron.flightgear.org/~curt/
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Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
>> >> > I am not sure if this is it (scroll down to see a screenshot): > http://flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2985&p=26114 > Now that's nearly the exact thing I was talking about. Thanks for the link! g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
> > One thing we have to consider with rear view mirrors is that we don't > currently have the ability to flip the display for the "mirror" affect. > Does OSG have that as a built-in feature by chance? g. -- Proud owner of F-15C 80-0007 http://www.f15sim.com - The only one of its kind. ScarletDME - The red hot Data Management Environment A Multi-Value database for the masses, not the classes. http://www.scarletdme.org - Get it _today_! -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] view manager "look at" mode
Gene Buckle wrote: >> And, _if_ the (already cited) parameter to define the coordinates of >> the view origin works as expected, then you're almost there you >> just have to get rid of the window border - for example by retiring the >> window manager. This alltogether would be an interesting excercise - >> I'll try that tonight, if nobody is quicker at it. >> > Now there's an idea. What happens if you're running in "full screen" > mode? The camera setup allows to set the "fullscreen" flag individually for every camera. Therefore I'd expect the system to display your primary view in fullscreen and the mirror view just in a small window, Martin. -- Unix _IS_ user friendly - it's just selective about who its friends are ! -- -- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
